Don’t be too dismayed Rosenier ball is still painful

[Curtains]

Just now, RoyMac5 said:

That is your choice. My choice is different. 

That’s also fair enough and I respect that. 
 

[May Contain Nuts]

35 minutes ago, Curtains said:

Did the fans appoint Warne !

Is that a real question? David Clowes is a Derby County fan, so kind of, yes! 😉

Obvious, no, the fans didn't appoint Warne, but they had a choice in how to react to his appointment... but I've covered the double standards I saw from a few people a million times before, and they still annoy me, clearly.

[Curtains]

10 minutes ago, Kokosnuss said:

Is that a real question? David Clowes is a Derby County fan, so kind of, yes! 😉

Obvious, no, the fans didn't appoint Warne, but they had a choice in how to react to his appointment... but I've covered the double standards I saw from a few people a million times before, and they still annoy me, clearly.

So just assuming David Clowes decided to gamble and make  a change now which I definitely don’t subscribe to to be clear what would happen to the likes of Barker , Buxton etc .

What compensation would Warne get on the 3 years left on his contract and could Derby afford that. !

Alternatively. Clowes could stick with Warne and assess at end of the season which is what I would advocate .

 To me changing now would be ridiculous and not letting him manage as he wants is also ridiculous.
We don’t want Clowes going into the dressing room after a defeat or a win because of style of play concerns do we !

The fans can moan if they want but moaning and shouting and booing might not help 

 

Edited September 26, 2023 by Curtains

[Comrade 86]

3 hours ago, Curtains said:

Funny how many Derby fans think Rosenior is wonderful again .

Seem to remember many wanted him gone 

Do you not recall as clearly those who wanted him to stay? You were busy telling them they were wrong as I recall, me being one of them.

And let's not pretend that good will for Liam is a new thing, borne out of dissatisfaction with Warne, as that's absolute nonsense. I thought we made a mistake at the time and while I'm not one of those screeching for Warne's removal, I still think it was a mistake now.

[Curtains]

3 minutes ago, Comrade 86 said:

Do you not recall as clearly those who wanted him to stay? You were busy telling them they were wrong as I recall, me being one of them.

And let's not pretend that good will for Liam is a new thing, borne out of dissatisfaction with Warne, as that's absolute nonsense. I thought we made a mistake at the time and while I'm not one of those screeching for Warne's removal, I still think it was a mistake now.

I remembered being frustrated at Lincoln away yes but wanting him sacked was a different matter.  
I remember fans wanting Rowett gone and Cocu and NC and Clemence and even McClaren .

Whatever those merits I don’t believe we can go that way yet with Warne.  
 

 

[May Contain Nuts]

13 minutes ago, Curtains said:

So just assuming David Clowes decided to gamble and make  a change now which I definitely don’t subscribe to to be clear what would happen to the likes of Barker , Buxton etc .

What compensation would Warne get on the 3 years left on his contract and could Derby afford that. !

Alternatively. Clowes could stick with Warne and assess at end of the season which is what I would advocate .

 To me changing now would be ridiculous and not letting him manage as he wants is also ridiculous.
We don’t want Clowes going into the dressing room after a defeat or a win because of style of play concerns do we !

The fans can moan if they want but moaning and shouting and booing might not help 

 

I've never advocated for the immediate removal of Warne, soooooooo 🤷‍♂️

[Comrade 86]

3 minutes ago, Curtains said:

I remembered being frustrated at Lincoln away yes but wanting him sacked was a different matter.  
I remember fans wanting Rowett gone and Cocu and NC and Clemence and even McClaren .

Whatever those merits I don’t believe we can go that way yet with Warne.  

On this much we agree, but if I were you, I'd get used to folk questioning the Rosenior call, as if Warne proves unable to muster his troops, there will inevitably be further questions asked.

[Curtains]

1 minute ago, Kokosnuss said:

I've never advocated for the immediate removal of Warne, soooooooo 🤷‍♂️

That’s ok then see you Saturday at PP 

[AndyinLiverpool]

18 minutes ago, Curtains said:

So just assuming David Clowes decided to gamble and make  a change now which I definitely don’t subscribe to to be clear what would happen to the likes of Barker , Buxton etc .

What compensation would Warne get on the 3 years left on his contract and could Derby afford that. !

Alternatively. Clowes could stick with Warne and assess at end of the season which is what I would advocate .

 To me changing now would be ridiculous and not letting him manage as he wants is also ridiculous.
We don’t want Clowes going into the dressing room after a defeat or a win because of style of play concerns do we !

The fans can moan if they want but moaning and shouting and booing might not help 

 

Clowes did exactly that a year ago. Instead of giving Rosenior time with the squad he had assembled since the middle of July, he brought in the footballing equivalent of a neanderthal.

[i-Ram]

4 pages on Rosenior I see this morning, when he left 12 months ago. Why isn’t this all in the ex-Rams section Mods?

Whilst I am fed up of talking about Warne too, I would rather discuss the shyte he is serving up rather than critique any of the other 91 managers in the top 4 leagues.

[Comrade 86]

25 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

4 pages on Rosenior I see this morning, when he left 12 months ago. Why isn’t this all in the ex-Rams section Mods?

Whilst I am fed up of talking about Warne too, I would rather discuss the shyte he is serving up rather than critique any of the other 91 managers in the top 4 leagues.

The content is somewhat signposted in the title mate, irrespective of location 😂

 

[i-Ram]

41 minutes ago, Comrade 86 said:

The content is somewhat signposted in the title mate, irrespective of location 😂

Thank you for the insight, which wasn’t lost on me 👍 However, why is anyone interested in how Rosenior is doing? He is at the top of the Championship. We ain’t going to be there for a few years. More than happy to follow his progress in the Ex-Rams section.

[Leeds Ram]

My opinion of Rosenior at the time was that it was a mistake to get rid of him. I wanted him to be given until Christmas to turn around the away form, and if he hadn't, then look at bringing in someone more experienced. Looking back and thinking about it, I'm pretty sure Rosenior would have steered us into the playoffs in the end. He built that squad to build his brand of football and we would have had more in the tank energy-wise than under Warne. Unlike Warne, Rosenior's recruitment here and at Hull has been exemplary, so I'm sure we'd have gotten in reinforcements in January as well. In the playoffs, who knows what would have happened, but it would have been very sweet to see us get promoted under him. 

I felt at the time bringing in Warne was an error and remains so. Not because he won't get us out of the division (i think he will next season) but because i have absolutely no faith in him doing anything except relegate us in the championship. I wanted us to invest in a coach who could be part of a longer-term project to guide us not just out of this league but the next one as well. I hope I turn out to be wrong as I was ultimately with Rooney who I spent months lambasting before he became our talisman. 

Edited September 26, 2023 by Leeds Ram

[Foreveram]

3 hours ago, Kokosnuss said:

It's bloody funny that people are sitting there saying that we just need to be patient with Warne, to ignore the style of football for now (or just stick with it anyway if it gets results), anyone complaining about the quality of football on show is impatient and entitled, wants us to lose so the manager gets the chop, not happy with 3 points, toxic in their negativity, dragging the board down (amongst all the other insults and ridicule hurled their way).

Yet when they start talking about Rosenior they pull out all the usual overstated b******* that everything we did was boring, pointless, possession for possession's sake crap which never got us outside of our own half, this tactic or that tactic was stupid and easy to counter, that he didn't understand what was needed for League One and all that crap

...thus displaying  absolutely zero patience, not allowing the possibility for Rosenior to learn and for the style to develop and basically displaying the very traits they accuse the "anti-Warne Brigade" of having.

So do you think we should get rid of Warne now.

[Comrade 86]

12 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

However, why is anyone interested in how Rosenior is doing?

Do you really want to know? It's just that you're sending out some mighty mixed signals right now, chap! 🤣 

[May Contain Nuts]

55 minutes ago, Foreveram said:

So do you think we should get rid of Warne now.

No.

I just think that the level of derision aimed at those who do is getting a bit out of control. It feels like every point we gain is automatically and immediately used as something to attack other posters. It increasingly looks like there's only one accepted response to a victory and if someone goes against the grain then they're for it.

We saw plenty of this last season when we went on a good run, with threads created to call out other fans for earlier expressing doubts, and it feels like history repeating but with added hostility. We haven't even needed a good run for it to start this season! You'd think there may have been some lessons learned from the experience, but I'm not seeing much evidence of it.

It gets a bit tiring reading how it's people being negative that's making the forum hard to read when it gets just as bad (if not worse, because of the ganging up) from the other side of the argument.

I have reservations about his long-term suitability, but picking up results and keeping us 'there or thereabouts'  in the short term buys him more time to alleviate the concerns - he'll only do that if he shows signs of learning, and I don't just mean temporarily reacting to circumstances which almost force him into changing his ways before reverting to them the first chance he gets, but proper growth as a manager.

I don't have much faith in this happening, and I don't want us to be lumbered with some of the glaring faults within his philosophy which (if they remain) will likely see us as cannon fodder when we do go up, but that doesn't mean I want him sacked before he's had full opportunity to prove me wrong.

Edited September 26, 2023 by Kokosnuss

[Archied]

3 hours ago, Comrade 86 said:

Do you not recall as clearly those who wanted him to stay? You were busy telling them they were wrong as I recall, me being one of them.

And let's not pretend that good will for Liam is a new thing, borne out of dissatisfaction with Warne, as that's absolute nonsense. I thought we made a mistake at the time and while I'm not one of those screeching for Warne's removal, I still think it was a mistake now.

Yep , As I remember it was pretty split opinions wise , personally I was good with the switch , the football frustrated me after the Charlton game where I was very hopeful and enjoyed it I felt we were going backwards and also the clean sweep fresh start felt right , obviously that’s just opinions, one is no more right than the other ,

I do have to note that plenty on here are putting it as fact that it was a pure football/ results decision by clowes , liam was interim and we have no idea what terms he wanted to sign a full time contract in terms of wages , length , budget to work with going forward ect ect ect 

[May Contain Nuts]

It's an interesting concept that we were going backwards.

We didn't have a proper pre-season, we had a freshly assembled squad largely made up of older players and so we were already at a disadvantage to most sides, and we were playing a game every 4 days on average  - 3.5 days for the first ten - with the longest break between fixtures being 10 days, which was followed by a home victory against a decent side in Wycombe.

(Following the Wycombe game we made the change and the new manager took over a team who'd had 14 days rest)

Is it really any surprise we couldn't keep up the same level of performance as in the earlier games?

Charlton aside, it's hardly as if we went on to beat the teams we looked poorest against when we played them later in the season and in more favourable circumstances, so were we going backwards, or did we happen to come up against some solid opponents (let's not forget that one of these would go on to get over 100 points) whilst understandably rather tired?

Edited September 26, 2023 by Kokosnuss

[Curtains]

50 minutes ago, Kokosnuss said:

No.

I just think that the level of derision aimed at those who do is getting a bit out of control. It feels like every point we gain is automatically and immediately used as something to attack other posters. It increasingly looks like there's only one accepted response to a victory and if someone goes against the grain then they're for it.

We saw plenty of this last season when we went on a good run, with threads created to call out other fans for earlier expressing doubts, and it feels like history repeating but with added hostility. We haven't even needed a good run for it to start this season! You'd think there may have been some lessons learned from the experience, but I'm not seeing much evidence of it.

It gets a bit tiring reading how it's people being negative that's making the forum hard to read when it gets just as bad (if not worse, because of the ganging up) from the other side of the argument.

I have reservations about his long-term suitability, but picking up results and keeping us 'there or thereabouts'  in the short term buys him more time to alleviate the concerns - he'll only do that if he shows signs of learning, and I don't just mean temporarily reacting to circumstances which almost force him into changing his ways before reverting to them the first chance he gets, but proper growth as a manager.

I don't have much faith in this happening, and I don't want us to be lumbered with some of the glaring faults within his philosophy which (if they remain) will likely see us as cannon fodder when we do go up, but that doesn't mean I want him sacked before he's had full opportunity to prove me wrong.

Viva versa more like 

The derision against Warne supporters on here is palpable 

 

[May Contain Nuts]

11 minutes ago, Curtains said:

Viva versa more like 

The derision against Warne supporters on here is palpable 

 

How so?

I can sort of see that it may feel that way if someone takes criticism of Warne personally, and treats it by extension as a criticism of their support, but I can't think of any examples where someone's been targeted for abuse for stating their support of him.

Edited September 26, 2023 by Kokosnuss