Tribunal Update

[Ghost of Clough]

21 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

I don't think Mel would have to gamble BIG but I can't seriously see us getting promotion next season with 50% academy players (or whatever percent Mel has supposedly stipulated/wished for). Need some experienced players of decent quality, ones Cocu feels will be able to 'follow his orders'.

Bogle, Lowe, Bird, Sibley, Knight will be regulars in the starting lineup next season as they have been this year. Some may even include Roos.

Ravas, Buchanan, Whittaker, JBrown, etc... to used in case of emergencies.

We only need to be 10 points better off over the season to be in the top 6. Given we actually increased the rate of points gained when the kids were in the team, I fancy our chances of getting them.

[Curtains]

1 minute ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Bogle, Lowe, Bird, Sibley, Knight will be regulars in the starting lineup next season as they have been this year. Some may even include Roos.

Ravas, Buchanan, Whittaker, JBrown, etc... to used in case of emergencies.

We only need to be 10 points better off over the season to be in the top 6. Given we actually increased the rate of points gained when the kids were in the team, I fancy our chances of getting them.

That won’t work 

[Abu Dhabi Ram]

1 minute ago, Curtains said:

That won’t work 

I think it will, if we add a new striker and winger. 

[Curtains]

2 minutes ago, Abu Dhabi Ram said:

I think it will, if we add a new striker and winger. 

And CB .

 

[MackworthRamIsGod]

1 hour ago, Gritty said:

Couldn't disagree more strongly.  "Throwing everything at it" is what got us into this mess

Besides, whether one agrees or disagrees with ffp, they are the rules.  I'm sick of my club trying to find a way around them.  It's not cute or clever. It's basically us trying to find a way to cheat the spirit of the rules.  And it's wrong. 

That's why I said in brackets (thankfully for this club I am not).

Throwing everything at it isnt a bad thing, if the right person is spending the money and the right homework has been done.

We seem to ring round in a mad panic asking clubs if they have any players for sale, Johnson being a prime example.

With Cocu having his little black book, he could sign a few gems.

[Curtains]

And new Goalkeeper 

[Ghost of Clough]

6 minutes ago, Curtains said:

That won’t work 

Why not?

[Curtains]

Just now, Ghost of Clough said:

Why not?

Too much reliance on Academy players. 
 

[Gritty]

Expectations need re-aligning in my view.  We're constrained by ffp and covid impacting finances.  Stephen Pearce said so in recent interview. And cocu said as much yesterday

We need to cut our cloth this year.  That means most signings will be cheap and on low wages. Maybe a loan or two

Kids form will fluctuate

I hope for 6th. But realistically think 8th to 10th likely.  We need to give youngsters time to develop.  We're not going to be on some promotion charge with this squad and with limited recruitment possible

[Spanish]

1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Birmingham failed the period ending in 2018. Losses for those three years were £5.1m, £16.4m, and £37.5m (total of £58.9m). This was stated as equaling a P&S loss of £48.8m (£3.4m per season exempt), and overspend of £9.8.

P&S overspend for the 2019 period actually increased to about £12.9m, yet no punishment. This is the reason why I believe P&S losses are 'reset' to £13m. The alternative is that an agreement is made to get back within limits at an acceptable pace (they still spend £10m on players in the summer).

Brim also sold their stadium to a related company but fo only 23m I think.  Still it may still be subject to a further review depending on what happens t us

[Ghost of Clough]

26 minutes ago, Curtains said:

Too much reliance on Academy players. 
 

Not really. It's only a quarter of the squad who will be regulars in the squad, with just 3 starting most games.

[RoyMac5]

32 minutes ago, Curtains said:

And CB .

 

and a keeper

[RoyMac5]

3 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Not really. It's only a quarter of the squad who will be regulars in the squad, with just 3 starting most games.

If it's squad fine, but not as season long starters, edit: but 3 might be okay - what's Mel's percentage?

[Curtains]

2 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Not really. It's only a quarter of the squad who will be regulars in the squad, with just 3 starting most games.

Fair enough.  But you need a strong bench. 

To be honest it’s all ifs and buts.  

Look how many said Lampard would fail at Chelsea 

[Shipley Ram]

34 minutes ago, Curtains said:

Too much reliance on Academy players. 

 

[Curtains]

Just now, Shipley Ram said:

 

It’s the quality though.  Can you name them Man U kids 

[Curtains]

Butt   Beckham.  Scholes.  The Neville’s.  Brown Giggs. Etc etc 

[Ghost of Clough]

8 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

If it's squad fine, but not as season long starters, edit: but 3 might be okay - what's Mel's percentage?

September 2015 "My goal over the next five years is that at least 50 per cent of our first team will have academy players in it. That’s just one player each year and we are there."

Then a couple months ago he reiterated the target of half the starting 11 being from the academy.

3 are almost nailed on starters. With another 2 regular starters (used in rotation) and a few others such as Buchanan and Whittaker getting a few games. Playing 5 for the sake of playing at least 5 in every game is too extreme and will not happen. But, a significant number of games will see Mel's 5 academy starters. Close enough in my opinion

7 minutes ago, Curtains said:

Fair enough.  But you need a strong bench. 

To be honest it’s all ifs and buts.  

Look how many said Lampard would fail at Chelsea 

We could field the 5 star academy graduates: *New GK*, Bogle, te Wierik, *Clarke*, Lowe, Bird, Rooney, Knight, Sibley, Lawrence, Martin
... and still have a bench of: Roos, Wisdom, Forsyth, Evans, Shinnie, Holmes, *New Winger*, Waghorn, Marriott

To me that looks like a very strong bench, and even excludes Davies and Bielik as senior members of the team - assuming Carson, Malone, Jozefzoon and Bennett are off

[Curtains]

15 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

September 2015 "My goal over the next five years is that at least 50 per cent of our first team will have academy players in it. That’s just one player each year and we are there."

Then a couple months ago he reiterated the target of half the starting 11 being from the academy.

3 are almost nailed on starters. With another 2 regular starters (used in rotation) and a few others such as Buchanan and Whittaker getting a few games. Playing 5 for the sake of playing at least 5 in every game is too extreme and will not happen. But, a significant number of games will see Mel's 5 academy starters. Close enough in my opinion

We could field the 5 star academy graduates: *New GK*, Bogle, te Wierik, *Clarke*, Lowe, Bird, Rooney, Knight, Sibley, Lawrence, Martin
... and still have a bench of: Roos, Wisdom, Forsyth, Evans, Shinnie, Holmes, *New Winger*, Waghorn, Marriott

To me that looks like a very strong bench, and even excludes Davies and Bielik as senior members of the team - assuming Carson, Malone, Jozefzoon and Bennett are off

Well that’s  assuming those players are going to be good enough for a promotion push even without a points deduction.   I take what you are saying and it’s a good post.  

I want to be positive and I do think the Academy has produced good players coming through but it’s all about the right blend of senior and academy players in the right positions and the obvious weaknesses we have at the moment that need addressing particularly on the wing and the spine of the team from goalkeeper to central defenders to strikers.  

Of course its all about opinion and Cocu and his staff and our spending power.  

It would be a mistake to rely on the Academy players in a 46 match season and more.  The likes of Bird etc have looked very tired recently and the team needs a rest. 

[RoyMac5]

22 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

We could field the 5 star academy graduates: *New GK*, Bogle, te Wierik, *Clarke*, Lowe, Bird, Rooney, Knight, Sibley, Lawrence, Martin
... and still have a bench of: Roos, Wisdom, Forsyth, Evans, Shinnie, Holmes, *New Winger*, Waghorn, Marriott

To me that looks like a very strong bench, and even excludes Davies and Bielik as senior members of the team - assuming Carson, Malone, Jozefzoon and Bennett are off

So basically you feel that a new keeper, CH and winger will be enough next season to have us competing for Top 6? Can't say I do. Edit: but I think that might be all we get.  Still too much youth and to little real cover rather than shoe-ins.