Shameful

[Spanish]

7 hours ago, Millenniumram said:

Perhaps I am, but frankly I don’t care. The clubs approach to this so far has been pathetic, and I’m not changing my stance on that until the club shows signs of changing there’s. I stand by my views, simple as.

you are entitled to your view but mine is that booing your own player (s) is not constructive and does nothing to help the club.  Frankly I find it a bit childish really

[Spanish]

27 minutes ago, Sexydadbod said:

Yeh man , I can’t stand all of these people who have the decency to criticise two players who were very lucky to not kill innocent people then are back in the team one game later like everything’s been forgotten??? The club may forget, the fans rightly wont 

none of us including the club has forgotten

[Sexydadbod]

1 minute ago, Spanish said:

none of us including the club has forgotten

Could have fooled me then because they should have been suspended until at least the court date, Mel Morris has been a joke here, at the weekend he kept rightly banging on about the seriousness of drink driving then days later these prats are back in the team? You can see why fans are rightly furious

[nottingram]

5 minutes ago, Sexydadbod said:

People keep assuming they’re remorseful and truly regret their actions, we like to think they will be but we can’t be sure they will or that it hasn’t been already laughed off in the squad, I really wouldn’t be surprised if it has. Sorry for the act or sorry they got caught and is this the first time they’ve done it? This is all speculation.

Bennett was allegedly(posted by another user on here), interacting with girls on Instagram and liking their posts in the days after the incident, doesn’t seem like someone who is sorry to me. If he was he’d get his head down and do something about it rather than treating it like he’s lost a snooker match or something. Sometimes the full force of the law is the only way to wake these people out of their bubble and for them to mature like it did with Troy Deeney, who is now a much better man than he was before being sent to prison because it woke him up.

And you keep assuming they aren’t remorseful. Might surprise you to know that the people who made the decisions know them much better than you do. Who’s have thought it eh?

Oh no Mason Bennett was on Instagram the day after? Lock him up and throw away the key because that is just beyond the pale. If I knew that I would definitely not have been behind them being involved last night - can’t believe a young man would like girls pictures on Instagram, what a disgrace!

This coupled up with the fact you keep on saying he was at a drink driving course the day before, which at best is incredibly disingenuous, just makes it look like you want them hung, drawn and quartered without a) knowing the slightest thing about the attitudes and current state of mind of either player involved and b) even having done the slightest bit of research before you’ve made your reactionary posts.

[Millenniumram]

2 hours ago, sage said:

Or you could wait until you see the clubs full response after the court date before condemning MM and PC. 

Knee Jerk.

 

Doesn’t matter what the clubs response is after the court date, it doesn’t excuse the fact they shouldn’t have been playing.

[Spanish]

1 minute ago, Sexydadbod said:

Could have fooled me then because they should have been suspended until at least the court date, Mel Morris has been a joke here, at the weekend he kept rightly banging on about the seriousness of drink driving then days later these prats are back in the team? You can see why fans are rightly furious

TBH we all know your opinion and it isn't going to change.  You've made your point eloquently and you will not influence the club.  Why not just move on, decide whether you can still support the club and make a decision.

 

 

[Sexydadbod]

Just now, nottingram said:

And you keep assuming they aren’t remorseful. Might surprise you to know that the people who made the decisions know them much better than you do. Who’s have thought it eh?

Oh no Mason Bennett was on Instagram the day after? Lock him up and throw away the key because that is just beyond the pale. If I knew that I would definitely not have been behind them being involved last night - can’t believe a young man would like girls pictures on Instagram, what a disgrace!

This coupled up with the fact you keep on saying he was at a drink driving course the day before, which at best is incredibly disingenuous, just makes it look like you want them hung, drawn and quartered without a) knowing the slightest thing about the attitudes and current state of mind of either player involved and b) even having done the slightest bit of research before you’ve made your reactionary posts.

I haven’t said they aren’t remorseful, anywhere, but it wouldn’t surprise me if they weren’t. Would you be saying the same if someone you were close to was killed by these two prats? No you wouldn’t. 

Mason Bennett prancing around on social media as if nothing happened is wrong, and if he had a brain cell in his head he’d know better and would avoid social media completely like Lawrence has, otherwise you give people like myself ammunition to criticise him. 

Yeah he wasn’t at a drink driving course, but he was at a course highlighting the DANGERS of alcohol and it went completely over his thick head. 

I couldn’t care less about how they are feeling, in fact I want them to suffer for a bit because I want them to feel guilty about what they have done, rather than guilty that they have been caught. I want them to suffer hard so they know not to do anything like this again and just to feel a tiny bit of pain that families of drink driving victims feel.  If they are genuinely remorseful and not doing it for PR reasons, I will slowly begin to accept them again, if not I will let them know EXACTLY how I feel. It’s like a kick in the face to all Derby fans who have been victims of drink driving or know someone who has closely been affected. It’s ok to commit the offence because you will miss one game then normality will take place . What message does that send out , you or anyone else who backs them are pathetic. You won’t understand unless you are a victims of drink driving yourself. 

[rynny]

38 minutes ago, Sexydadbod said:

Yeh man , I can’t stand all of these people who have the decency to criticise two players who were very lucky to not kill innocent people then are back in the team one game later like everything’s been forgotten??? The club may forget, the fans rightly wont 

I don't understand the argument of they could have killed someone. Where do you draw the line? You could kill someone by speeding, running a red light, using your phone whilst driving, not paying attention and so on. You could even kill someone whilst driving and it not be your fault. It's just seems such a feeble excuse to berate the players, they've done enough wrong to add that to it. 

[nottingram]

3 minutes ago, Sexydadbod said:

I haven’t said they aren’t remorseful, anywhere, but it wouldn’t surprise me if they weren’t. Would you be saying the same if someone you were close to was killed by these two prats? No you wouldn’t. 

Mason Bennett prancing around on social media as if nothing happened is wrong, and if he had a brain cell in his head he’d know better and would avoid social media completely like Lawrence has, otherwise you give people like myself ammunition to criticise him. 

Yeah he wasn’t at a drink driving course, but he was at a course highlighting the DANGERS of alcohol and it went completely over his thick head. 

I couldn’t care less about how they are feeling, in fact I want them to suffer for a bit because I want them to feel guilty about what they have done, rather than guilty that they have been caught. I want them to suffer hard so they know not to do anything like this again and just to feel a tiny bit of pain that families of drink driving victims feel.  If they are genuinely remorseful and not doing it for PR reasons, I will slowly begin to accept them again, if not I will let them know EXACTLY how I feel. It’s like a kick in the face to all Derby fans who have been victims of drink driving or know someone who has closely been affected. It’s ok to commit the offence because you will miss one game then normality will take place . What message does that send out , you or anyone else who backs them are pathetic. You won’t understand unless you are a victims of drink driving yourself. 

You might not have said it but you have certainly implied it. Tbh no I probably wouldn’t be saying the same if they’d killed someone I know - pretty obviously really. But no one died and they’re lucky. That’s why I’d prefer them to do community work to help to raise awareness of the issue so they know how lucky they are. I just don’t see what good an X game ban does other than it making it look like Derby are doing something when in reality the only people punished then are Cocu and the team as they have two less players to choose from.

Again, Bennett wasn’t really at a course either. He probably went to watch some old blokes walk around kicking a football and found it quite boring, like I did on Saturday when they did it in front of the east stand. Just so happens such an event was promoted by Drinkaware.

I also want them to suffer as a result of their actions, but I don’t think isolation is the way to do that. I think education, rehabilitation and fines are a much better way to go than token bans 

 

[Sexydadbod]

1 minute ago, rynny said:

I don't understand the argument of they could have killed someone. Where do you draw the line? You could kill someone by speeding, running a red light, using your phone whilst driving, not paying attention and so on. You could even kill someone whilst driving and it not be your fault. It's just seems such a feeble excuse to berate the players, they've done enough wrong to add that to it. 

All of the above apart are just as bad (apart from driving whilst it not being your fault) and I’d have the same view because it’s sheer ignorance and arrogance. It’s made me furious how people think it’s fine to move on, I haven’t said I will never forgive them, but for the moment I want them to suffer hard and just few a glimpse of pain that families of victims of drink driving feel for the rest of their lives.

People won’t understand unless it’s happened to themselves. Drink driving is terrible, but it’s made worse by seeing the state Bennett was in and the fact the club offered them vehicles home earlier in the night but they refused and made the decision to drive. It’s only sheer luck in this situation they didn’t kill anyone, there’s a much higher probability of killing someone being the state Bennett was in.

[Norman]

10 minutes ago, rynny said:

I don't understand the argument of they could have killed someone. Where do you draw the line? You could kill someone by speeding, running a red light, using your phone whilst driving, not paying attention and so on. You could even kill someone whilst driving and it not be your fault. It's just seems such a feeble excuse to berate the players, they've done enough wrong to add that to it. 

I draw the line at speeding when drunk, crashing and knocking a passenger out and seriously hurting someone. 

They very nearly killed someone. It doesn't really get much closer.

[rynny]

7 minutes ago, Norman said:

I draw the line at speeding when drunk, crashing and knocking a passenger out and seriously hurting someone. 

They very nearly killed someone. It doesn't really get much closer.

Were they speeding? There was the video of them "hurtling" where they looked to be going less than 30

Was Keogh knocked out? There have been have been contradicting reports with one saying that he was wandering around near the scene of the crash when emergency services showed up.

Yes Keogh's knee is messed up, but close to killing him? 

[Norman]

Just now, rynny said:

Were they speeding? There was the video of them "hurtling" where they looked to be going less than 30

Was Keogh knocked out? There have been have been contradicting reports with one saying that he was wandering around near the scene of the crash when emergency services showed up.

Yes Keogh's knee is messed up, but close to killing him? 

Oh aye, those crash pictures defo show impacts of 25mph. 

If Keogh was knocked out, had a mangled knee and a broken wrist, then yes, as crashes go, that is very close to something life-changing for Keogh. It already is tbf.

I'm not going to defend or support any of them until after the court date and we know more details. To be put in the position to do so is unfair on fans and also highly divisive to our fan base. 

Disgusting decision. 

[CornwallRam]

This just goes right to the crux of why this forum exists. It's the foundation of what Derby County Football Club means.

I think the word 'club' is important. We're not just an audience or a customer base; we're tacitly members of a club. We've all incorporated DCFC into our identities. We all want the club to succeed - but no one supports Derby County for the glory. Whether you were born in Alveston or Galveston, whether you have had a season ticket for 50 years or just watch on the TV when you can, if you support Derby County you are part of the club. I love that the ground is filled with welders, accountants, labourers and secretaries. We're all Derby aren't we?

When I go on holiday, I often wear something with a Ram on it. Invariably, I meet other Derby fans and we have a chat - we have that common bond. Yet, identifying myself as a DCFC supporter also leads to conversations with supporters of other clubs. They are different but the same - our club allegiance is ingrained. We all feel a little pain when our clubs are struggling. But that is nothing compared to when the love of our clubs is shaken by actions which are morally bankrupt.

Drunk drivers kill people. Drunk drivers destroy lives. My club should never condone drunk driving. Playing Bennett and Lawrence before they've even been to court is not even giving them a slap on the wrist. Mel's apology on Saturday looks like empty spin. We might as well start marketing special discount on alcohol for those parking their cars near the ground - don't rush off; have a couple for the road. If you wrap your car around a lampost, we'll give you a paid week off work and then it'll be like nothing ever happened.

I know we all make mistakes. Maybe, after appropriate sanctions and signs of remorse, the pair could have been re-introduced to the team. Certainly it should not have even been considered until after the court case and club enquiry have concluded. They haven't even apologised yet! This is probably because they have been given legal advise not to - but what sort of message does it send that they play again without even signalling their contrition?

I don't care what other clubs have done in the past - this is my club and I am appalled and embarrassed by 'our' actions.

[sage]

40 minutes ago, Millenniumram said:

Doesn’t matter what the clubs response is after the court date, it doesn’t excuse the fact they shouldn’t have been playing.

Well it's an opinion. 

Of course legally they havent done anything wrong until they are convicted. The England Cricket team did the opposite with Ben Stokes and got slagged off for it. Whatever they did they would be criticised. 

I remember when people used to make calm judgements after knowing all the facts rather than frothing in indignation at the world around them.

 

[Andicis]

3 hours ago, Josh said:

Support the club ffs 

In short, no. 

The whole idea that whatever the club does you have to blindly follow and support is frankly ludicrous. 

Everyone who has an issue with it is still a supporter of the club, they just have moral objections with this issue as of current, to claim they're not supporting their club is stupid. 

[GB SPORTS]

10 hours ago, Millenniumram said:

Would be no different. Put me in charge of Derby, those two are sacked. Simple as. Personally would believe overall that would have the best positive impact on the rest of the Squad regardless.

Think you might have to take a view from the rest of the squad, before that.

[Millenniumram]

1 minute ago, WHAT DO I GET said:

Think you might have to take a view from the rest of the squad, before that.

If the rest of the squad disagree, then that’s up to them. If they refuse to play because of it, they can go too. About time someone took a stance against this squad.

[sage]

24 minutes ago, Millenniumram said:

If the rest of the squad disagree, then that’s up to them. If they refuse to play because of it, they can go too. About time someone took a stance against this squad.

Milleniumram's a football genius.

 

[Sexydadbod]

1 hour ago, Spanish said:

TBH we all know your opinion and it isn't going to change.  You've made your point eloquently and you will not influence the club.  Why not just move on, decide whether you can still support the club and make a decision.

 

 

I’m letting off a lot of steam, because to me it’s like the club don’t understand the severity of the offence(s), one game then you’re back in, what does that say? As I keep saying in multiple threads, Sunderland suspending Darron Gibson for drink driving was in my view the appropriate course of action and we should have done the same with these two until the court date. The players haven’t even apologised yet in the public. I get they have been legally advised not to but to me it’s plain wrong that they get to play before even saying sorry, if after the court date they put out a public apology (both written and in video) showing genuine remorse then I’d have have eventually come to terms with them and forgiven them. It just stinks how they get to play without even saying sorry first.