RamNut Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 1 minute ago, rynny said: Rowett also said we were going to get young hungry players, then signed Davies, Huddlestone, Ledley, Jerome... They were young.......in comparison to Sharp and Rooney ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 17 hours ago, RamNut said: Question: which player has played the most minutes this season, and made the most starts? Surprise surprise ......Lawrence which should tell us that he is one of Cocu’s favourite players. lawrence is now in the same category as Roos in that fans knee jerk reaction is now to give him a hard time no matter how he plays. since we select the world’s most right footed player as a left winger, we shouldn’t really be surprised that he delivers very few crosses and has virtually no assists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rynny Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 30 minutes ago, RamNut said: They were young.......in comparison to Sharp and Rooney ? How many young players did we have in the team at the time though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 3 minutes ago, rynny said: How many young players did we have in the team at the time though? Young players just block the way for the 34 year olds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TramRam Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 14 hours ago, B4ev6is said: I do feel for tom lawarance losing her way he did everyone deals greath in different ways. But hitting the bottle is not it. I get how he feels losing my grandma and then in 2018 two days before christmas I lost my grandad sigh I miss him greatly. I cant bear go near the dopthlin in tge city centra as use to be his favourite drinking hole sigh just to painful. Sorry for your loss, So which pub were you in when you posted this ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B4ev6is Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 I was in no pub but at home but I rarely have a drink these because pain relief I am in pain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derbyram1 Posted January 14, 2020 Share Posted January 14, 2020 Having read through a few social media comments regarding our Tom yesterday (his birthday) I can honestly say we have some of the most toxic and venomous fans in the country. Actually ashamed and embarrassed to read some comments! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
europia Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Tom Lawrences performances have been poor recently, but the club need to have him in the shop window to attract a buyer. So it's a bit of a dilemma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 On 14/01/2020 at 09:12, RamNut said: Surprise surprise ......Lawrence which should tell us that he is one of Cocu’s favourite players. lawrence is now in the same category as Roos in that fans knee jerk reaction is now to give him a hard time no matter how he plays. since we select the world’s most right footed player as a left winger, we shouldn’t really be surprised that he delivers very few crosses and has virtually no assists. Add to that he doesn't pass until he absolutely has to and even then he would rather shoot and he stands no chance of winning fans over. I saw him at Ipswich and he was exactly the same. He probably was their best player. But that says more about Ipswich and the kind of football they were playing at the time. I've never been a fan but I do agree right now the magnifying glass is on him and that's not fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 On 14/01/2020 at 14:24, Derbyram1 said: Having read through a few social media comments regarding our Tom yesterday (his birthday) I can honestly say we have some of the most toxic and venomous fans in the country. Actually ashamed and embarrassed to read some comments! That's not just football fans. That's people in general. I'm a boxing fan and love ancient history. When it comes to social media both have a large fanbase(?) that can't wait to have a pop at someone. In boxing there are "bums" and "ducks". Just yesterday I was watching a video on the Punic Wars and the comments were full of racism and modern day politics squabbling Social media just gives all these gimps full of anger because they are still bottle fed the safe high ground to be aggressive. I don't exclude myself from being a dick on here from time to time. Does anyone? But if you recognise you're capable of being a dick then you can keep a lid on it. These knobs don't. They would make excellent journalists though. The Sun probably hires people directly off tw@tter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OUTSIDER Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 1 hour ago, Alpha said: Add to that he doesn't pass until he absolutely has to and even then he would rather shoot and he stands no chance of winning fans over. I saw him at Ipswich and he was exactly the same. He probably was their best player. But that says more about Ipswich and the kind of football they were playing at the time. I've never been a fan but I do agree right now the magnifying glass is on him and that's not fair. this is one of Lawrence's biggest faults, he just tries to take on a player and generally runs into a wall or losses it. when all are screaming to pass he just keeps going then he losses the ball, if it works he scores hes applauded.... but saying this Waghorn Marriott have done similar but its 'unlucky' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 16 minutes ago, OUTSIDER said: this is one of Lawrence's biggest faults, he just tries to take on a player and generally runs into a wall or losses it. when all are screaming to pass he just keeps going then he losses the ball, if it works he scores hes applauded.... but saying this Waghorn Marriott have done similar but its 'unlucky' Could accept it more from Lawrence if it wasn't so often. Can't expect him to be at this level and make the right decisions 7 or 8 times in 10. But you're probably talking a couple of times in 10 that he will give the ball to someone before they lose their space. Be alright if he produced something himself. For such a greedy player his goal contribution is rubbish. I don't think it would be a hard problem to fix. We always say he doesn't lack the techniques. Managers I assume keep picking him based on the promise of that technical ability producing results. Fans giving him grief won't help so I hope that stops. If Cocu is going to insist that Lawrence will become a team player then we shouldn't be trying to sabotage him. To what end? Same with using Waghorn as a target man. The worst first touch since Connor Sammon. I can't think of a Derby regular since Sammon with a first touch so dodgy. But there's no good people start jeering and booing him at games either. It's Cocu picking the teams. I just hope we don't end up with another new manager that says "hey, this Lawrence is a tricky customer. I bet I can get him to create loads by giving him complete freedom". Be nice to see him get a kick up the bum or a kick for another team. Preferably a kick up the bum because on those handful of standout games per season where ability meets decision making he looks worth his value. The rest of the time I'd rather have a worse footballer in the team playing for the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OUTSIDER Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 1 hour ago, Alpha said: Could accept it more from Lawrence if it wasn't so often. Can't expect him to be at this level and make the right decisions 7 or 8 times in 10. But you're probably talking a couple of times in 10 that he will give the ball to someone before they lose their space. Be alright if he produced something himself. For such a greedy player his goal contribution is rubbish. I don't think it would be a hard problem to fix. We always say he doesn't lack the techniques. Managers I assume keep picking him based on the promise of that technical ability producing results. Fans giving him grief won't help so I hope that stops. If Cocu is going to insist that Lawrence will become a team player then we shouldn't be trying to sabotage him. To what end? Same with using Waghorn as a target man. The worst first touch since Connor Sammon. I can't think of a Derby regular since Sammon with a first touch so dodgy. But there's no good people start jeering and booing him at games either. It's Cocu picking the teams. I just hope we don't end up with another new manager that says "hey, this Lawrence is a tricky customer. I bet I can get him to create loads by giving him complete freedom". Be nice to see him get a kick up the bum or a kick for another team. Preferably a kick up the bum because on those handful of standout games per season where ability meets decision making he looks worth his value. The rest of the time I'd rather have a worse footballer in the team playing for the team. agree totally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 To all the Lawrence haters... He passes the ball more times per 90 minutes than: Roos, Hamer, Knight, Martin, Bennett, Whittaker, Waghorn, Jozefzoon, Marriott Only Bird crosses the ball more times per 90 than Lawrence (only 4 games played) Only Shinnie, Bennett and Whittaker play more key passes per 90 6 players get dispossessed more often per 90 minutes: Marriott, Knight, Bogle, Holmes, Whittaker, Bennett Only Waghorn has more goals this season Lawrence blocks almost 50% more passes than the 2nd best at the club (Lowe) He has cleared and intercepted the ball more than any attacking player (excludes GK, CB, FB and DM) Only Holmes has attempted more tackles than Lawrence (excludes GK, CB, FB and DM) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said: To all the Lawrence haters... He passes the ball more times per 90 minutes than: Roos, Hamer, Knight, Martin, Bennett, Whittaker, Waghorn, Jozefzoon, Marriott Only Bird crosses the ball more times per 90 than Lawrence (only 4 games played) Only Shinnie, Bennett and Whittaker play more key passes per 90 6 players get dispossessed more often per 90 minutes: Marriott, Knight, Bogle, Holmes, Whittaker, Bennett Only Waghorn has more goals this season Lawrence blocks almost 50% more passes than the 2nd best at the club (Lowe) He has cleared and intercepted the ball more than any attacking player (excludes GK, CB, FB and DM) Only Holmes has attempted more tackles than Lawrence (excludes GK, CB, FB and DM) What stats don't tell you is the timing of those passes, the options available to him etc I don't criticise him for his work rate. I think it's maybe his swagger that sometimes winds people up but most the time I think he works as hard as any winger apart from the real grafters known for replacing quality with lots of running about. I don't think he loses the ball an unusual amount of times. I would expect wingers to lose possession more than any other position. So no problem there. The problem is there's no stat that shows him beating a man, ignoring a wide open Marriott, beating another man, ignoring an overlapping full back, beating another man, ignoring a crossing opportunity, beating another man, ignoring the lay off, running out of room and passing to Marriott who is now holding hands with a defender. Then the attack breaks down. I bet there's nothing spectacular about Hughes stats at Derby. Hughes has a piss weak shot, below average in the air and a passing range of what? 20 yards max? Always on the floor too. Probably very few assists and goals. Tackling was probably pretty high? But the effectiveness of his passes can't be put into a stat. To get the right option, at the right time, with the perfect weight on the ball over and over again made everyone else tick Like Bryson. Bryson is a even shorter range passer. When we played him deep he was useless. No point to any of his passes. They hit their target but they only served to bog us down in a series going nowhere passes. Yet put him in the final third and have him backing up attacks and suddenly it's a very different story. Probably getting a few more passes intercepted now but he's more often moving the ball on in areas where there's lots of attackers/better footballers to work with. Lawrence is the opposite of Hughes. Hughes gives you the ball when and where you want it. Lawrence gives you when and where he has to. It's not his choice it's where he's ended up by being greedy Jason Shackell was a players who's passing stats make him seem good. But he played others into so much pressure by being the slowest most one footed player passer ever. Feint, feint, pass to Warnock. Every. Single. Time. Good luck Warnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted January 16, 2020 Author Share Posted January 16, 2020 2 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said: To all the Lawrence haters... He passes the ball more times per 90 minutes than: Roos, Hamer, Knight, Martin, Bennett, Whittaker, Waghorn, Jozefzoon, Marriott Only Bird crosses the ball more times per 90 than Lawrence (only 4 games played) Only Shinnie, Bennett and Whittaker play more key passes per 90 6 players get dispossessed more often per 90 minutes: Marriott, Knight, Bogle, Holmes, Whittaker, Bennett Only Waghorn has more goals this season Lawrence blocks almost 50% more passes than the 2nd best at the club (Lowe) He has cleared and intercepted the ball more than any attacking player (excludes GK, CB, FB and DM) Only Holmes has attempted more tackles than Lawrence (excludes GK, CB, FB and DM) Please pass this on to other clubs who may be tempted to make a decent bid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 24 minutes ago, Sparkle said: Please pass this on to other clubs who may be tempted to make a decent bid I'll do one for Jozefzoon instead. Crosses a lot, but other players are badly positioned to get on the end of all of them, and doesn't cross as often as Malone or Lawrence Prefers a short passing style, almost never resorting to a long ball. Blocks crosses more often than any other winger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 Bye the way I really like Tom Lawrence. He will come good. No way should we sell him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 3 minutes ago, Curtains said: Bye the way I really like Tom Lawrence. He will come good. No way should we sell him. You are really going for it today son. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted January 16, 2020 Author Share Posted January 16, 2020 28 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said: I'll do one for Jozefzoon instead. Crosses a lot, but other players are badly positioned to get on the end of all of them, and doesn't cross as often as Malone or Lawrence Prefers a short passing style, almost never resorting to a long ball. Blocks crosses more often than any other winger Please do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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