Is keeping the same team right when tired

[Ninos]

Just now, RodleyRam said:

Ooo do you know her? Small world! Tell her I said hi

I would never admit to it on a public forum unless she wanted me to - then again she might because we both know she craves attention

[Rev]

We have a big sports science department, don't we?

I'm sure they would let Rowett know if a player was in need of a rest, not least because the chances of picking up an injury are much higher when that's the case.

FWIW, I thought Vydra looked shot on 60 minutes, yet found his second wind impressively to carry him through, while Nugent just looked ineffective in the circumstances, rather than knackered.

 

[Curtains]

52 minutes ago, reveldevil said:

We have a big sports science department, don't we?

I'm sure they would let Rowett know if a player was in need of a rest, not least because the chances of picking up an injury are much higher when that's the case.

FWIW, I thought Vydra looked shot on 60 minutes, yet found his second wind impressively to carry him through, while Nugent just looked ineffective in the circumstances, rather than knackered.

 

Good point .   If only we could have got one last night.  So unlucky in my eyes. 

[RodleyRam]

Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

I actually don't think is as much about tiredness although must be a factor.

I think it's more about needing to change tactics and therefore personnel to combat the opposition. 

We knew Ipswich would park the bus and play for set pieces. That style of play clearly needs a different approach from us. At home we need to play higher, on the deck and in and around teams. We don't be given as much space in behind. Using the personnel we've got the approach needed would be better suited to Martin, Russell and Thorne opposed to Nugent, Wiemann and Huddlestone. 

That said, we were clearly unfortunate not to put one away last night, so it's not disastrous. Just felt we needed to be a bit more proactive and adapt to the opposition rather than just going with the 'don't change a winning side' adage.

Still a work in progress and important we learn from games like last night.

[TommyPowell]

9 hours ago, curtains said:

Yes I went to Middlesbrough and it was a tough game.  I couldn’t believe Gary started the same starting 11. 

Luke Thomas needs a chance on the bench as what’s the use of the U23s 

No need for Pearce at home as Huddlestone as we saw can play CB as can Baird. 

seems like today GR is agreeing with you good call

 

[Sparkle]

17 hours ago, Ninos said:

So what you’re saying is :

Martin and Vydra have big footballing brains and Nugent has a smaller footballing brain which therefore means two big footballing brains link better together in home games.

And what about goals, is that connected to big footballing brains or can small brained players like Nugent do that? I didn’t see any goals from the big football brains together at home yesterday, did you ?

Some very profound logic there though.. lol

Thank you but that is not what I was saying

[RamNut]

Starting the same team was a reasonable decision, altho personally i would have played wisdom instead of 35 year old chris baird.

However we were sluggish from the start and really needed to make changes.

changing nugent for martin was also reasonable. Personally i would have then played nugent, vydra and martin all because our attack needed more bodies to break through a 4 to 6 man Ipswich defence.

after 70-75 minutes we visibly ran out of steam although i didn't feel we had players on the bench who could really affect the game. Bringing on Thorne and russell was about all we could do, but these were like for like substitutions. The game was crying out for hughes or bryson or both. I.e. A short passing game to pick a way through a packed defence. 

Lawrence did his best but looks like a player who might need a break.

[Curtains]

1 hour ago, RamNut said:

Starting the same team was a reasonable decision, altho personally i would have played wisdom instead of 35 year old chris baird.

However we were sluggish from the start and really needed to make changes.

changing nugent for martin was also reasonable. Personally i would have then played nugent, vydra and martin all because our attack needed more bodies to break through a 4 to 6 man Ipswich defence.

after 70-75 minutes we visibly ran out of steam although i didn't feel we had players on the bench who could really affect the game. Bringing on Thorne and russell was about all we could do, but these were like for like substitutions. The game was crying out for hughes or bryson or both. I.e. A short passing game to pick a way through a packed defence. 

Lawrence did his best but looks like a player who might need a break.

We have Luke Thomas but he wasn’t on the bench .

Have Hughes and Bryson returned !

[TuffLuff]

2 hours ago, Sparkle said:

Thank you but that is not what I was saying

It’s the Ninos Deflection Tactic - If you cant debate properly, you debate silly.

[Coneheadjohn]

On 29/11/2017 at 18:45, reveldevil said:

We have a big sports science department, don't we?

I'm sure they would let Rowett know if a player was in need of a rest, not least because the chances of picking up an injury are much higher when that's the case.

FWIW, I thought Vydra looked shot on 60 minutes, yet found his second wind impressively to carry him through, while Nugent just looked ineffective in the circumstances, rather than knackered.

 

This.

I’m happy to trust the highly qualified professionals to be able to judge a professional athletes fitness.

Personally I would have changed it a bit,Martin/Russell/Wisdom?

But it’s Just guesswork on my part and if it had worked it would have been a fluke.

 

[europia]

On 11/29/2017 at 10:02, curtains said:

Nugent looked way off last night. 

My question would be: Why would Derby County feel more tired than any opposition team? 

[lrm14]

On 11/29/2017 at 11:49, Ninos said:

The wrong decision turned out to be bringing Martin on because with him we failed in the objective: to score a goal or two. And if Winnall was fit, it’s him you would have seen come in. Why? Cuz he scores goals. These are strikers you’re talking about.

The trouble this side has at the moment, which was demonstrated in the first half against Ipswich is that we struggle to CREATE chances, especially against a deep line. You can have the best finishers in the world up front and it won't mean anything if you give them close to zero service. It's why we're so great away from home where we can get in behind teams, but struggle at home due to teams just sitting exceptionally deep. The second half we had chances almost purely because of the space Martin created by playing with his back to goal. I know you hate Martin with a burning passion but take the blinkers off once in a while. 

Also if Winnall was fit, I'm pretty sure it would have been Martin coming on again. Rowett has brought him on a few times now at half time when our direct approach isn't working. Winnall was appalling against Reading in a very similar situation so not sure why you think he would have come on.

[lrm14]

23 minutes ago, europia said:

My question would be: Why would Derby County feel more tired than any opposition team? 

Because Nugent is 32 and a good portion of his game relies on running around like a nutter. Even Freddie Sears was rested for them.

[Dimmu]

1 hour ago, europia said:

My question would be: Why would Derby County feel more tired than any opposition team? 

Derby keeping the same team and opposition rotating a bit springs to mind.

[archied]

Resting players or keeping a winning team is always a debate you can see both ways because honestly there are undeniable pros and cons to support both sides of the argument ,

the point I pick up on is the idea that to beat teams like Ipswich turning up to play very defensive and hit you on the break is to discard the extra defensive midfielder from the start and just go at them at 100 miles per hour ,, well here's the thing ,, the number one thing you don't want to do and can't afford to do is give away the early or first goal because that makes getting a result far far more difficult and to be fair Ipswich this season seem to be scoring more than they have done in the past ,, we gave away the early goal and to my mind that is what really cost us 

[Igorwasking]

2 minutes ago, archied said:

Resting players or keeping a winning team is always a debate you can see both ways because honestly there are undeniable pros and cons to support both sides of the argument ,

the point I pick up on is the idea that to beat teams like Ipswich turning up to play very defensive and hit you on the break is to discard the extra defensive midfielder from the start and just go at them at 100 miles per hour ,, well here's the thing ,, the number one thing you don't want to do and can't afford to do is give away the early or first goal because that makes getting a result far far more difficult and to be fair Ipswich this season seem to be scoring more than they have done in the past ,, we gave away the early goal and to my mind that is what really cost us 

On the basis we lost 1-0, I tend to agree

[jimbobram]

We have a massive squad. That's what we have a squad for. Use them.

[Mistaram]

12 hours ago, europia said:

My question would be: Why would Derby County feel more tired than any opposition team? 

Good question Ipswich didn't look tired to me !

[europia]

On 11/30/2017 at 21:51, Dimmu said:

Derby keeping the same team and opposition rotating a bit springs to mind.

Sure, but the options are available to both team managers. Derby have more squad depth than some other championship teams. That was my point really. 

[europia]

On 11/30/2017 at 20:52, lrm14 said:

Because Nugent is 32 and a good portion of his game relies on running around like a nutter. Even Freddie Sears was rested for them.

Simple answer to that: Forget age, a player is either fit enough to play at the required standard or he is not. Surely all teams have a mixture of ages in the squad? Comes down to management decisions again.