On the Ram Page

9 minutes ago, ap04 said:

What's mildly infuriating is the nonsense being spouted out as a result of a win although I can't speak for others - someone even had the cheek to mention IQ, meanwhile we've been reading gems such as:

"Great win that" - As opposed to the wins that aren't great, guess what the one before was "great" too
"It was all about the 3 points" - Whilst certain other games are about something else, friendlies I suppose
"We deserved this win" - No comment
"Not lucky at all" - No, only 4 flukes out of the last 5
"Our form is brilliant / Warne great job / Others bottling it" - 1 deserved win in the last 7
"So proud of them" - 0 shots at ht at home sure was a new high, not embarrassing at all for an autos contender or Dcfc in L1 according to another poster
"They fought til the end" - As though other sides wouldn't try to recover the ball and get it forward drawing at home against a similar or inferior opponent, they would all lie down with "I surrender" placards
"Result not performance" - "Alright lads today you don't have to create much or defend that great, it's all about the goal and the clean sheet"
"Was always going to be ugly" - Nought to do with us not being good enough to break them down and make it not ugly, it was fate or just one team on the pitch
"This year is not about enjoyment" - Ok we might not have enjoyed it today with 2 chances at home but we damn well will when -assuming status quo- we create fa in the Championship!
"Ref did very well" - Just the one major decision out of one wrong

I despair

Go and lie down in a darkened room

2 minutes ago, sage said:

Never suggested we didn't need a strong side, in fact I said it was needed. Just one change was needed. They didn't look in disarray.  

Their coaches were at the start of the game trying to fathom out how we were set up and trying to respond 

48 minutes ago, sage said:

My thoughts on reflection are, it was a poor team selection in terms of lack of threat from wing back, reverting to a 2 in CM and stringing 3 across a front line which jammed up the space in front of the wing backs. We needed to be strong but trying to beat Stevenage at their own game seems ridiculous as they play it every week. We had no attempts at goal first half and were lucky they didn't score from theirs and be awarded a penalty.

Bringing Smith on for Wilson and Bird to revert to their best positions and for a midfield 3 to assert control, whilst a front 2 allowed the wing backs space changed the game. Then later as they seemed to tire and their subs seemed a drop in quality, only one team looked like winning in the last 15 mins.

A draw would have been a fair result but I'm delighted with a win. I think the lack of a CF finally brought back that backs to the wall response from the crowd which along with superior fitness and bench carried us through.

I think the lack of tactical acumen from Warne was balanced out by achieving a high level of physical and mental resilience in the squad.

 

 

 

 

I disagree with you in that unless we stood up to them initially we would have been trampled on. Our front play early on was poor. NML wasn’t on his game, Barkhaizen brushed off the ball too easily, our passing was poor. We wore them down in the end, they tired and we got our goal. Wasn’t a great watch apart from the stupendous effort that was put in.

I think our tactics and formation had them in disarray at the start, their coaches were flying around the technical area with bits of paper trying to work out how they should set up. It was quite funny to watch. Their main coach, a Steve Evans lookalike but 12 stones lighter, never stopped shouting and organising  all game. Evans appeared every now and again to vent his spleen to the 4th official who did an excellent job to ignore him. It was as good a watch as the match itself.

But eventually our tactics paid off and we won the game. I think Warne and his coaches are far more astute than they are given credit for. Yes, it could have gone all wrong, but it didn’t on this occasion.

Todays game was one I thought beforehand would be very difficult and I thought we may get a draw. Stevenage are a typical hard tackling, aggressive side which Derby sides have struggled to play against for many a long year - N Clough, McClaren etc etc etc. we struggled at their place and were well defeated, having been bullied off the park.

News that Collins was not fit also made team selection extremely difficult, as he is the one who normally takes the brunt of aggression from the opposition defence. I can totally understand the team selection today, which I think was initially to standup to the bullying, aggressive tactics. Having 4 particularly strong defenders in Nyambe, Bradley, Nelson and Cashin set the tone, with Adams and Elder also being strong too. I think this initial part of the game, although not exciting, was necessary. Although not entertaining, I admired our courage and grit.

We did try to attack where possible in the first half, but it didn’t happen. Our passing, fluidity up front just wasn’t there. MNL wasn’t at the races in the first half and I don’t think Barkhaizen is particular effective when the opposition is aggressive. We had a couple of near squeaks 1st half but we played them very well - they were probably surprised by our performance.

The 2nd half continued in the same vein but we then became a little more adventurous and the Smith substitution improved matters, freeing Wilson to start attacking more. Not much in the game but I thought we deserved to win in the end due to our courage to stand up to them early on in the game.

Not sure Hourahane was totally fit to start but we seemed to be more mobile in midfield as a result. Everyone got stuck in today, so very pleased with the effort. Sure we will have more productive games going forward soon. We just had to get through today - it was so important that our confidence levels did not drop. Some of our opponents in the promotion race would have loved the 3 points we won today.

Warne has taken a lot of stick on here for his tactics and team selection - not sure what else he could have done under the circumstances he found himself in.

Also a shout out for the referee today, who was not intimidated by the pre-match comments, and Ibthought refereed he game vey sensibly and well on the whole.

we now have a week to work on a formation and tactics for another difficult game on Saturday.

I for one, was pleased with todays showing.

3 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

For the Warne thread I suppose, but as I've said before, 90-95% of managers would have us in a better position. With no striker, Warne benches our most dangerous attacking midfielder? He got lucky.

Yawn,

1 hour ago, Poynton ram said:

I have seen it mentioned by several people that insurance can be taken out to cover a player’s salary if he is off with an injury. Anyone know how it works and what the premium would be. Take JJ, with his history of injuries is he uninsurable or is the premium that steep that the club wouldn’t pay it? With our long list of injuries we clearly don’t have any no claims discount and I would imagine any premiums would be significant. Bored at work hence the question

In the Radio Derby Podcast with Stephen Pearce he talked about an insurance claim for Embleton (I think). Also paid a small loan fee for JJ 2nd loan spell because of his injury record. Worth a listen for this info and the transfer windows.

53 minutes ago, sage said:

irrational and puerile, lovely. 

I don't think he is a bad manager. I think he is a good League One manager for a club with low to medium expectations. 

I can totally accept “I think he is a good League One manager for a club with low to medium expectations”. I believe you are wrong and that he is better than that. But many come on here and say “he is a good League One manager for a club……”

You are giving your opinion which I can accept - others state it as fact which I don’t (unless it is eventually proved).

1 hour ago, Jourdan said:

I am not worried personally. 

I don’t think we have yet seen anywhere close to what CBT can do and can bring to the table. If he is perhaps not fit and perhaps not totally adjusted, he will likely play within himself as many others would.

The biggest thing I saw on Tuesday and v Reading is it being a case of CBT and the rest of the team having to build up an understanding of how they can help one another.

Look at goals two and three on Tuesday. NML was on to Bird’s pass in a flash because they have a good understanding. Similarly Barkhuizen knew exactly where to be to support NML on the breakaway for the third goal. They have been teammates for almost two years, not four weeks.

I think there was one brief moment on Tuesday where CBT and the team looked on the same wavelength. NML as I recall tried to send him clear into space but didn’t get enough purchase on the pass and it was cut out. If we get CBT in those positions more often, we’ll see his threat.

Everyone is raving about Adams and rightly so, but equally he’s only had three games and I feel it is much easier to impact the game as an all-action midfielder in a counter-attacking side that do a lot of defending and spend a lot of time out of possession than a winger who relies on receiving the ball in areas where he can affect the game.

For much of that first half, CBT didn’t receive the ball and when he did, it was in areas where he was crowded out.

In fairness he has hardly received a pass in the games he has played so far. No doubt at Charlton he was used to seeing plenty of the ball. We need to use him as much as we pass the ball to NML.

1 hour ago, i-Ram said:

Hindsight, wisely interpreted and argued is welcomed on this thread. You informed me earlier. I would suggest you raise your game.

Oh dear!

9 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

I'm frustrated we have had such appalling decisions against us all this season and last, yet we never try to put pressure on refs this way. It is part of the modern game and it's potentially a way of sowing doubt in the referee's mind and getting that extra 1% that might make the difference between promotion and not. Instead, when Warne does comment on decisions, it's "Sibley made a shocking challenge and it should have been a penalty". Meaning a ref can feel more able to give a decision against us because our own manager has claimed we've got lucky before.

There’s a fine line between putting pressure on referees an naffing them off, so you get nothing. We need to be a bit smarter in getting free kicks ( e.g. Collins & Wilson go down very easily and probably getting a reputation like Chris Martin did) and in wasting time (Wildsmith, throw ins etc). Don’t need events to bite us late in the game.

28 minutes ago, LeedsCityRam said:

No it wasn't, read the quote I replied to again. He was suggesting Clough wasn't doing a good job at Hartlepools but that we appointed him nevertheless - the stats I've provided are pretty conclusive in proving he was doing a good job & showing signs of the managerial talent he would demonstrate with us.

With regard to Clough's first season at Derby, we all know we finished one place below the season previous but I gather season tickets actually increased going into 68/69 as fans could see the young talented team that was emerging.

I was inaccurate when I said he managed Hartlepool "not very well" but nor was he running away with the League. He was actually recommended to Derby's Chairman by Len Shackleton, which was the main reason, I believe, why he came to Derby. But , the main thrust of my post was that he was relatively unknown before he came hear with no history of success (winning anything) as a manager. 

My case was to give Warne a chance to prove he can cope with the job he is required to do.

29 minutes ago, May Contain Nuts said:

I don't sit anywhere within your rules. You're not my boss and I don't answer to you.

That’s why I tend to laugh at your posts, which come over as factually based most of the time but are just your ramblings.

31 minutes ago, May Contain Nuts said:

1 basic rule for posting on this thread now and in future:

Foresight is unwelcome, and hindsight will be dismissed.

(Or is that 2 rules?)

 

No. People’s personal opinions (foresight) stated as being factual, is unwelcome. Hindsight, wisely interpreted and argued is welcomed. Where do you sit within these 2 rules?

2 hours ago, FindernRam said:

An old saying  "The Peter Principle" says if you shine in your job, you rise to your level of incompetence. Then you are replaced. So two thoughts:

PW has/is doing well at this level. We will go up and he may do well at the next level ,and maybe even the Prem . At some point he falls short and we will replace him. However if he does really well, he himself may move to a bigger and better job or be poached.

Alternatively we find a rising star now. Can we guarantee he will not be incompetent at the next level? Also if he's as good as we think others will also have spotted him and temptation to a bigger club will follow.

We tend to be judged in life on our results and football is even more driven that way. PW results by the only standard that counts are good. So I feel we go with the flow and enjoy the ride! 

You beat me to it. Reading the last page or so of this thread made me immediately think of The Peter Principle. At present he is doing well and has a history of getting promotions. He has also been relegated a few times but in some cases there were extenuating circumstances and his previous club were happy to keep employing him.

No one knows (probably not even himself) what he is capable of or what levels he can attain. He strikes me as an intelligent chap and he will know the challenges which lie ahead, should we get promoted. In my opinion he should be given every chance to succeed and only if it becomes apparent that he is out of his depth should he be replaced.

Not comparing him to Brian Clough at all but Brian was managing Hartlepool (not very well) when we appointed him. We didn’t improve the first season he was here but got promotion the following year. No one knew at the time how good he would be, he didn’t show it in the first year here.

Let’s give him the opportunity to succeed.

2 hours ago, May Contain Nuts said:

Playing alongside a more greedy player was just one example, using it as an example doesn't mean I'm stating it as a fact that he is.

Without watching Notts County play any 'take' would have to involve some guesswork, but a quick look at transfermarkt shows that he's been used more as an attacking midfielder & even on the wing this season. They're the 2nd highest scorers in their league, with Macaulay Langstaff their top scorer (22 goals in 31 appearances) so you'd have to assume they see McGoldrick's role as more of a support player than the main striker.

It seems to work for them, they're happ[y with it. It doesn't mean that their manager is getting less out of him than Warne did, or he's having a 'worse' season. It's about the team.

 

vs

He's hardly played as a CF. He's also a year older, which when talking about 36 year olds can be a massive difference - see the difference in Curtis Davies over 2 seasons - although I don't think that's actually the case here.

And what about his time at Derby. What were the other factors there.

1 hour ago, May Contain Nuts said:

Wrong.

Other factors like the experience they've gained from careers played at higher levels, the current quality of opposition they're up against and the standing of their current team within it, the quality (and type) of teammate too because one season you could be playing alongside a greedy b****** who gives you no supply, the next a selfless player.  You can throw in popularity with fans as well, and personal circumstances away from football make a difference too.

It's not a fair crack at the whip you want him to be given though, it's for him to be given all the credit for his grandmother's ability to suck eggs.

Nowhere did I say that Warne isn't a contributing factor, but attributing the reason for them having their best directly to Warne is just daft.

Nothing I've posted is unfair on Warne, it's just an assessment based on what I see while holding him to the standards set by his billing, his comments and our aims and objectives.

So what’s your take on McGoldrick this season - 12 goals in a lower league (should be much easier to score. So must be playing alongside a greedy player or ones lacking quality, as the fans adore him and his personal circumstances haven’t changed or are better.

what were the other factors in the Derby season which made it so successful- quality of players were obviously not better, 

Just listen to Stephen Pearce on Radio Derby last night to hear what David Clowes and he think about him, his skills and man-management. Doesn’t really matter what the fans think, he isn’t going anywhere soon. 
 

BUT I’m sure people will want their say!

Surprised there hasn’t been more comment on what he has said about our Business Plans, transfer strategies (pots etc) and transfer windows. Plus it seems absolutely clear that both David Clowes and Pearce both hold Paul Warne in the highest esteem in respect of his management and man management. Clear he is not going anywhere.

Thought the anti-Warne brigade would be all over this.

7 hours ago, May Contain Nuts said:

They've had their 'best' seasons (although McGoldrick had a better goals per game ratio the previous time he dropped down to L1, I believe) but attributing it to them playing under Warne ignores a number of other factors.

NML was a player I was desperate for us to sign when we were trying to survive under Rooney, he only ended up at League One level due to personal problems, not footballing ability.

The other factors being that you don’t like Warne?

2 hours ago, RoyMac5 said:

Need something a bit stronger than tea! 😄 #COYR

Perhaps they will invite you for your valuable input and then you could take a bottle.

4 hours ago, i-Ram said:

Well you support my point. You say we are all shouting for Liam, and you give one example from what, 2 weeks ago. And S8TY wasnt asking for him back. He just said in hindsight he should have been given more time. Not sure why you are looking for an apology either. You seem to be coming over as a bit of a t*****.

There were loads of people on here saying we should have kept Rosenior. I can’t be bothered to go back and look, but if you don’t believe me (or Returning Ram , go and have a look for yourself, sure you will find plenty of examples.

5 hours ago, Chris_Martin said:

The cost and wages of a player don't determine how good they are as a footballer. If that were true, Phil Jagielka was absolutely terrible for us because he cost £0 and only had £4000 wages.

 

Not sure whether to treat you seriously or not. I suppose you can always find a few examples which back up your point but not as many as I could to disprove it.

7 hours ago, DavesaRam said:

My comments are an expression of frustration because there we were playing them off the park (comparatively) and making them look ragged, but as soon as we scored that all stopped. And as I have said several times this isn’t an isolated case. We have switched the tap off immediately after scoring multiple times and paid the price. We are literally throwing points away, and therefore we may well be throwing promotion away because of stupid tactics. The players are simply doing what they are told. They have to or they get dropped. Hourihane excepted - he never gets dropped.

Much more to do with a team which had sat back and defended suddenly conceded and then became more positive (look at their substitutions) hence we had to defend a bit more. Warne has often been criticised for not responding to opposition changes - he basically can’t win, can he? Unfortunately, we drew the game because the player/players didn’t do as they are told and poorly defended a throw-in (something Warne is always on about).  Unfortunately, some fans just make the facts suit their own agendas.

45 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

We've spend 'serious' money too, but we don't have a squad to take forward into the Championship do we?

Who on?

1 hour ago, Blondest Goat said:

It's not what it takes to get out of this league.  Plymouth and Ipswich played decent football last season. 

At some point we're going to have to play decent football to achieve our long terms goals.  What's wrong with having a desire to see that football now?

And how many years did it take them? And they spent serious money in the last year or so.