Bald Eagle's Barmy Army Posted October 11, 2023 Share Posted October 11, 2023 15 hours ago, tinman said: Omari Kellyman’s little brother has left the academy to move to Villa. Because currently there's no pathway to the first team. They also wasn't happy with the standard of coaching. sage, Jram and Jubbs 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srg Posted October 11, 2023 Share Posted October 11, 2023 Best striker in the academy got 2 minutes in a nonsense cup in a game we were winning, despite striker being the worst position in the first team currently. Jubbs and InstaRam 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted October 11, 2023 Share Posted October 11, 2023 5 minutes ago, Bald Eagle's Barmy Army said: Because currently there's no pathway to the first team. They also wasn't happy with the standard of coaching. I thought the Academy had been revamped? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bald Eagle's Barmy Army Posted October 11, 2023 Share Posted October 11, 2023 21 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: I thought the Academy had been revamped? They decided to leave in May this year - this isn't a new revelation. The decision was made before the new academy manager came in. A lot of talk around the academy is "would Omari be anywhere near the first team at Derby if he'd have stayed'? The answer has to be no and he certainly wouldn't be getting the opportunities like he is now. IslandExile and RoyMac5 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted October 11, 2023 Share Posted October 11, 2023 7 minutes ago, Bald Eagle's Barmy Army said: They decided to leave in May this year - this isn't a new revelation. The decision was made before the new academy manager came in. A lot of talk around the academy is "would Omari be anywhere near the first team at Derby if he'd have stayed'? The answer has to be no and he certainly wouldn't be getting the opportunities like he is now. If we compare him with Brown, who is the same age (only 2 days between it), and just as highly rated within our academy... Brown has only been given 18 minutes of first team football (17 minutes in the cup vs Blackpool and 1 minute last night) Kellyman, was given the full 90 in Europe (and got 1 assist) whilst also getting 12 minutes off the bench against Everton in the cup. He was brought on when 2-0 down to help rescue something from the game. He was given 26 minutes in the Pizza Cup last season, and was trusted to play the full 90 in their first game this season Ram@Lincoln, Jubbs, angieram and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bald Eagle's Barmy Army Posted October 11, 2023 Share Posted October 11, 2023 1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said: If we compare him with Brown, who is the same age (only 2 days between it), and just as highly rated within our academy... Brown has only been given 18 minutes of first team football (17 minutes in the cup vs Blackpool and 1 minute last night) Kellyman, was given the full 90 in Europe (and got 1 assist) whilst also getting 12 minutes off the bench against Everton in the cup. He was brought on when 2-0 down to help rescue something from the game. He was given 26 minutes in the Pizza Cup last season, and was trusted to play the full 90 in their first game this season And this is why you need a manager who trusts the process. If we have a manager who isn't going to do that in league 1, he certainly isn't going to do it in the championship. Maybe if PW had watched more minutes in the academy, he would know whether they could handle a poxy EFL cup game. therealhantsram 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MackworthRamIsGod Posted October 11, 2023 Share Posted October 11, 2023 Brown should have been give a change by now. He has pace, is young, full of energy, knows where the net is...what on earth is not to like? Wouldn't suprise me if we loan him out so Paul isn't forced to pick him. Bald Eagle's Barmy Army and Ram@Lincoln 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YorkshireRam Posted October 11, 2023 Share Posted October 11, 2023 4 hours ago, Srg said: Best striker in the academy got 2 minutes in a nonsense cup in a game we were winning, despite striker being the worst position in the first team currently. 2 of our strikers are in the top 10 goalscorers in the division currently (#6 and #9, respectively), so I'm not sure this is fair. In fact, Brown's minutes per goal for the u21s this season is 173, compared to Collins' 138 and Waghorn's 93 at professional-level... I'd like to see him play more too, but I'd actually say our strikers have overperformed so far this season compared to other positions? Premier ram 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ossieram Posted October 11, 2023 Share Posted October 11, 2023 8 hours ago, Bald Eagle's Barmy Army said: They decided to leave in May this year - this isn't a new revelation. The decision was made before the new academy manager came in. A lot of talk around the academy is "would Omari be anywhere near the first team at Derby if he'd have stayed'? The answer has to be no and he certainly wouldn't be getting the opportunities like he is now. Is he playing for Villas 1st team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted October 11, 2023 Share Posted October 11, 2023 19 minutes ago, ossieram said: Is he playing for Villas 1st team? Twice already this season, including a full 90 in Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 11, 2023 Share Posted October 11, 2023 6 hours ago, YorkshireRam said: 2 of our strikers are in the top 10 goalscorers in the division currently (#6 and #9, respectively), so I'm not sure this is fair. In fact, Brown's minutes per goal for the u21s this season is 173, compared to Collins' 138 and Waghorn's 93 at professional-level... I'd like to see him play more too, but I'd actually say our strikers have overperformed so far this season compared to other positions? My opinion for what it’s worth is that Brown is a great future talent but isn’t showing enough in the u21s regularly yet to warrant a start or lots of time in the first team whilst the others are scoring more regularly. He has been performing well and has scored in the behind closed door games so is definitely getting there and I think he will be introduced more towards the end of the season. Regards the path to the first team… I agree this is incredibly limited under Paul Warne as whether it’s right or not or he thinks he is or not there is immense pressure to go up this season. Personally I think Clowes will struggle to continue to finance this team in League 1 next season with even more investment needed to go up. As such PW is doing what most manager’s would do and that’s relying on “experience” to get that job done. I do also worry though that the path to the first team is reducing every season under him and even if we go up then next season he won’t trust youth as he will feel the pressure to stay up. With regards to those who have left Kellyman has actually surprised a few but it shows with backing and opportunity players can excel. Compare that to Gordon who after a promising start has been injured for nearly 2 seasons now and doesn’t have a return date still. Kellyman is showing that you do need a path to the first team and players like Brown, Radcliffe, D Robinson and Evans should with their abilities have a pathway mapped out over the next season or so to a place in the squad and team. The new set up does appear to be very good but I also understand why the Kellyman family would prefer to have both boys at the same club as I’m sure the club will want the younger one too after how well his brother has developed! What's different this season is there is also no need to push through lads early and to let them develop more in their age groups and out of the spotlight so to speak. Thompson, McAndrew, Allen, Wheeldon and Hawkins need time in the u18s and the lads from the u21s I’ve mentioned above need time at that level or out on loan learning their craft. In the long term I think this pays dividends for the club and the players and Hale seems to be a very good choice after Wassall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 12, 2023 Share Posted October 12, 2023 Evans out on 1 month loan to Barwell. Be good for Ridd to get some minutes with the u21s and will probably allow Thompson to move up to the u21 bench which gives Shattell or Price some minutes at u18… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted October 12, 2023 Share Posted October 12, 2023 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bald Eagle's Barmy Army Posted October 12, 2023 Share Posted October 12, 2023 23 hours ago, ExiledinDerby said: My opinion for what it’s worth is that Brown is a great future talent but isn’t showing enough in the u21s regularly yet to warrant a start or lots of time in the first team whilst the others are scoring more regularly. He has been performing well and has scored in the behind closed door games so is definitely getting there and I think he will be introduced more towards the end of the season. Regards the path to the first team… I agree this is incredibly limited under Paul Warne as whether it’s right or not or he thinks he is or not there is immense pressure to go up this season. Personally I think Clowes will struggle to continue to finance this team in League 1 next season with even more investment needed to go up. As such PW is doing what most manager’s would do and that’s relying on “experience” to get that job done. I do also worry though that the path to the first team is reducing every season under him and even if we go up then next season he won’t trust youth as he will feel the pressure to stay up. With regards to those who have left Kellyman has actually surprised a few but it shows with backing and opportunity players can excel. Compare that to Gordon who after a promising start has been injured for nearly 2 seasons now and doesn’t have a return date still. Kellyman is showing that you do need a path to the first team and players like Brown, Radcliffe, D Robinson and Evans should with their abilities have a pathway mapped out over the next season or so to a place in the squad and team. The new set up does appear to be very good but I also understand why the Kellyman family would prefer to have both boys at the same club as I’m sure the club will want the younger one too after how well his brother has developed! What's different this season is there is also no need to push through lads early and to let them develop more in their age groups and out of the spotlight so to speak. Thompson, McAndrew, Allen, Wheeldon and Hawkins need time in the u18s and the lads from the u21s I’ve mentioned above need time at that level or out on loan learning their craft. In the long term I think this pays dividends for the club and the players and Hale seems to be a very good choice after Wassall. I believe the U16s find out very soon if they get a scholarship or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 12, 2023 Share Posted October 12, 2023 They can offer up to May but generally like to get the business done before January. Typically the big Cat 1s do it first and then everyone else follows. Most will Have an idea by now though whether it’s a yes or no and the top ones will already have their offers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHomunculusLives Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 I think we're crying out for a new young player to burst from the academy into the first team and provide some excitement. Warne clearly prefers to pick seasoned, steady professionals rather than gamble on youth, but would be great if there was a prospect so talented at 17/18 they were simply too good not to pick. You'd hope with a Category A academy at League One level we'd have someone capable of breaking through, but perhaps not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srg Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 2 hours ago, TheHomunculusLives said: I think we're crying out for a new young player to burst from the academy into the first team and provide some excitement. Warne clearly prefers to pick seasoned, steady professionals rather than gamble on youth, but would be great if there was a prospect so talented at 17/18 they were simply too good not to pick. You'd hope with a Category A academy at League One level we'd have someone capable of breaking through, but perhaps not. Unfortunately all academy players that have had success over the past 10 years have come from (mainly) financial necessity. From Hughes and Hendrick way back, to Knight, Bird, Ebosele and the rest of it. Zero budget forced them to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuniverse Posted October 14, 2023 Share Posted October 14, 2023 (edited) On 12/10/2023 at 19:18, RoyMac5 said: Good interviews with Dajaune Brown and Craig Fleming. Edited October 14, 2023 by Stuniverse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted October 14, 2023 Share Posted October 14, 2023 32 minutes ago, Stuniverse said: Good interviews with Dajaune Brown and Craig Fleming. He sounds like a lovely, motivated young man. And not just because he rated Chris Martin! 😄😉 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted October 14, 2023 Share Posted October 14, 2023 41 minutes ago, Stuniverse said: Good interviews with Dajaune Brown and Craig Fleming. Interesting interview with Craig Fleming (have you watched @Ghost of Clough?), makes you wonder when you hear such technical talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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