Grimbeard Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 5 hours ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said: Even Corbyn with Dianne Abbott as asst manager could improve on where we are... Now that's just barmy. however............... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spanish Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 9 hours ago, Alpha said: Record number of points and goals in a season. The run in you speak of includes injuries to both Martin and Bent and all 3 defensive midfielders. And at the time people said Pearson would get this team promoted easy. Then when Pearson had us rock bottom and the lowest scorers in the UK who was it that came and took us up half the league. You called him a failure. What's success? Midtable Premier League? Trying to get 40 points in a season and not being battered by Man City? Success and failure has to be given context You didn't dream of promotion before Mac. We never won more than we lost. Poor manager who won titles with Twente, his "disaster" at Wolfsburg is a myth. He handed Boro their only silverware? Took them into Europe. He set records here. Sure he's done bad jobs. So has Pep. Who hasn't? Nigel Pearson is a good manager yet Mac had to clean his poo up. Cocu is a good manager proven in Holland... Mac has done well by Derby. Thats just true. Thats not to say everyone should want him back. I don't myself. But he was good for Derby. Losing to Reading 3-0 still left us closer to promotion than Cocu, Clough and Pearson. The good coach rhetoric... he's a manager with mixed results like so many. But he has had more success at Twente, Boro and Derby than most real managers. Hi, that all sounds like cocu. Great history elsewhere and unlucky with injuries. The evidence as far as Derby is concerned would indicate if you want the ocasional flirtation with playoffs then he maybe the man. Not sure why have to keep revisiting solutions that haven’t worked in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Ram Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 14 hours ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said: Even Corbyn with Dianne Abbott as asst manager could improve on where we are... Yea, Doris and Priti couldn’t mind, be non league rams ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRBee Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 16 hours ago, Eatonram said: I've been watching the Rams a long time....a very long time. Not sure I've ever seen such a collapse in form, confidence and work rate as we are currently witnessing. Not sure how this happened and I'm even less sure how to get out of it. I suppose the obvious thing would be to bring in a manager that demands work rate a la Bielsa. All championship managers seem now to recognise that this is the foundation of success in the Championship, you would think it was obvious but I've thought under successive managers, Derby's players do not match the work rate of their opponents and somehow feel a "superior" ability will somehow win through. We also now seriously have to question whether in terms of ability it is in anyway "superior" in any case? I think of a few performances last year like Stoke at home and Blackburn where we looked decent...........where has it gone? Was Martin really so pivotal? Anyway, it is clear now (and this is the first time I've said this) that we must have a change of manager, if for no other reason, to be a catalyst for change on the pitch....we are in a downward spiral that has to be addressed. Martin's contribution , not necessarily him but a player who can do what he did, was essential. We played better with him in the team. Sibley had a another player who could think quickly and with whom to link play. Cocu often seemed reluctant to play Martin, it took a long time for him to be appreciated. Cocu's style is slow, cautious and will never succeed. Cocu has often claimed he wants us to play a quicker game but seems not to be able to cheive it. Quicker play is not just speed of running but quicker decision making as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 10 hours ago, Ken Tram said: Break the team up - go down to League 1 if necessary - build a cheap team using our excellent Academy players - and ride to the wave of momentum to the Premier League. Just like Sunderland! There's nothing wrong with most of the squad, but they are rudderless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 51 minutes ago, Spanish said: The evidence as far as Derby is concerned would indicate if you want the ocasional flirtation with playoffs then he maybe the man. Not sure why have to keep revisiting solutions that haven’t worked in the past. Because Mel sacked him - twice - before he got chance to build anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asanovic70 Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 Interesting thread. Can we get out of this spiral? Not sure, it could go either way (Sunderland, ’17-’18 or Stoke under Michael O’Neill). We aren't bottom for no reason after 11 games. That a side with a (reduced) points deduction are now above us makes it even more of an embarrassment. A change of manager is inevitable I am sorry that it hasn’t worked out for Cocu, but I think a managerial change is now inevitable especially as we go into an international break. It will allow a new manager a short period of time to assess things, talk to the senior players (Curtis Davies), assess the squad. We need a manager who can motivate the squad & give them direction, pick a formation that suits the squad & use the youngsters more selectively rather than become dependent on them as this situation isn't ideal for their development. Rooney I would also explore the agreement regarding Rooney, ripping it up will probably be costly & possibly mean losing the limited finances available to us (January window), but we need to send him a message that he is not bigger than the club. Restoring confidence But whoever comes in, as manager will have to spend time to restoring the confidence of a team that has been shot to pieces. The Barnsley manager raised this point in his post match comments & dictated their approach. This could prove challenging as we simply don't have players used to scrapping for points (mentality), vis a Wycombe, bar the likes of Shinnie & Knight. Whoever we bring in, may well have to work with Rooney as we may not be in the financial position to pay him off as with Savage. Parallels: Stoke & Sunderland We’ve made as bad a start as Sunderland in ’17—’18 who were relegated. They had acquired one point more at this stage (7): Home 1D 4L (all in a row) & Away 1W 3D 2L (1W 4D 6L) Last night, Quest flagged up Michael O’Neill at Stoke & his impact. He came in when they were 6pts adrift, had a manager playing a style that divided the fans & never seemed to convince. Last season, they didn’t win until their 11th game, 5L in 6 at home (1D), away: 1W 1D 3L (1W 2D 8L) they hit 11 goals, conceding 22. They then made a change in early November, shortly before the international break Back to basics If we’re going to get out of this spiral, we need to cut out the mistakes. Watching the Quest highlights, Reading were punished after making two mistakes. Teams force struggling teams to make mistakes as is happening with us. We need to compete in every game, even when we’re not getting the luck. Decisions do tend to even themselves out. Next manager So who can we turn to? What sort of manager? We may have to sacrifice principles & be pragmatic, mixing styles, going direct on occasion & hire a proven fire-fighter. Mick McCarthy is dour, but perhaps was the sort of manager in the short/immediate term. He has now been appointed elsewhere. Paul Cook was targeted by Mansfield but wants to stay in the Championship. He was linked to Birmingham. It’s a risky appointment as he has often been appointed by sides from the beginning of a season, or in mid-table. But I would not be averse. But if the worst happens, will he be allowed the chance to rebuild? That may mean bringing in a personality as big as Rooney, like Sam Allardyce, on a contract to keep us up & then look to review things after that. Allardyce is perhaps coming to the end of his career, he may fancy one last crack/challenge. He won't be cheap, however, in terms of what he may demand, but then he hasn't been in much demand lately either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Durden Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 I'm waiting with trepidation for the announcement that Cocu has been placed on gardening leave and Mel Morris will be in charge of first team affairs. Would be the logical conclusion to the current circus being played out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premier ram Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 Stop tinkering with formations and personnel after a decent performance in the previous game , the three at the back was beginning to show promise then we changed formation against QPR then changed back yesterday but with yet another player in the 3 , yes Cocus had it tough but he still strikes me that he doesnt know his best formation and starting 11 even if everyone was available Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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