Bloated Squad?

[Igorwasking]

And he’s looking leaner already. Hopefully will be training in the next few days. The old Georgie is in there - and will be a revelation this season with Bryson and Mount either side of him. Bookmark my words!

[europia]

9 hours ago, JoeDerby said:

I'd get rid of Thorne (I've had enough), Hanson (loan), Olsson, Anya, Martin and Vydra.

 

Which will also give us the opportunity to invest, I'd love to see an exciting striker bought.

 

 

Well if Vydra is sold, the club will need to buy (at least) 20 goals a season from somewhere. 

[RoyMac5]

3 minutes ago, europia said:

Well if Vydra is sold, the club will need to buy (at least) 20 goals a season from somewhere. 

Hmmm wonder where that might come from? 

[Sparkle]

23 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Hmmm wonder where that might come from? 

WE could be boring and play a very British 442 with Martin and Vydra getting 40 goals between them 

                   Carson

wisdom Keogh Davies Forsyth 

wilson Bryson Mount lawrence    

               Vydra Martin 

not a bad side that ! But hey we have serious options 

[Ambitious]

I've just had a look at the squad, derived as much as I can from it and came out with the following:

GK: Scott Carson, Kelle Roos & Jon Mitchell 
Carson has been very consistent since he's been here, so much so we actually have very little to go off where the other two are concerned. It could be argued that we're putting a lot of faith into Mitchell & Roos based on the fact that if Carson were to get injured it would be one of those in the sticks and no chance of loaning anyone in. It needs to be looked at, but if Mitchell or indeed Roos are good enough it should show in training - despite us seeing nothing. 

DEF: Richard Keogh, Curtis Davies, Alex Pearce, Craig Forsyth, Andre Wisdom, Max Lowe, Jamie Hanson, Jayden Bogle & Marcus Olsson.
Personally, I would look at signing a left back. Again, I base that on the fact that Lowe isn't experienced enough and the loan at Shrewsbury didn't really showcase his ability either. I don't have a massive issue with Forsyth, plus I do think he's a solid defender, but he's always been hit-and-miss with the ball at his feet. Wisdom & Bogle at right back is the correct balance for me. We have three experienced CBs with Keogh & Davies being as good as you really get at this level. Pearce comes in and does a job when needed. I would be open to seeing him move on, for him more than us, so we can get someone in younger to replace him in the squad. Jamie Hanson, unfortunately, I just don't see what he brings to the table. He was originally a CB - can he play there? I don't know. I'd look to loan him out personally, possibly sell him outright. Olsson is out for the season, just about, plus I think he's probably played his last game for us. 

MID: Tom Huddlestone, Craig Bryson, Mason Mount, Bradley Johnson, Jacob Butterfield, George Thorne, Joe Ledley, Timi Elsnik & Callum Guy
This is where the issue lies with regards to too many bodies for few positions. I genuinely don't know what I would do. Butterfield, of course, is probably the first I would look to move on. It's not to say that he couldn't be a good player here, but I've just seen more in others. Thorne, I wouldn't want to lose a player of that quality so I would keep him around and try and work with him. I can see the pros & cons for all of them. Guy, I imagine, will be back out on loan as he looks further down the pecking order than Elsnik, who I also wouldn't be surprised to see moved out on loan. I believe we will see at least three, if not four, of these leave before the end of August - allowances for loan moves. 

WING: Harry Wilson, Tom Lawrence, Mason Bennett, Luke Thomas, Ikechi Anya, Nick Blackman, Kyle McAllistair & Kellan Gordon. 
I fully expect that we have concluded our wide options for now. Anya & Blackman will no doubt be available for moves. It's a good mix of wide options. Thomas needs a clear path through to the first team in my opinion, because he is at the moment our best academy prospect. Bennett, too, needs a bit of backing. It certainly helps with the likes of Wilson & Lawrence available. McAllistair probably needs a year at the club - U23s and Gordon back out on loan, maybe?

ST: Chris Martin, Matej Vydra, Cameron Jerome & David Nugent
This is the area we're most likely to invest in, providing a buyer can be found for those named. Martin, as much as I would love to see him back at the point of our attack, doesn't seem favoured & Vydra is being paraded around so we can put our hand in our pocket. Nugent & Jerome will no doubt still both be Derby players, but I'd imagine their first team roles will be somewhat diminished on last season. 

I'd say looking at it that we should expect 2x defenders, 3x midfielders, 3x wingers & 2x strikers out on loan or permanent deals. We then maybe looking at 2x defenders and another striker in. My guesses would be: Pearce, Hanson, Elsnik, Guy, Butterfield, Anya, Blackman, Gordon, Martin & Vydra. I'd also not be surprised to see us snatch an experienced keeper up, should one present itself. 

[Carl Sagan]

5 hours ago, IlsonDerby said:

Pearce? 

Leaves us with Keogh, Davies and Hanson for CB Huddlestone at a push? Alright for covering 1 or 2 games but if Keogh or Davies were to sustain a lengthy injury I'd rather have Pearce coming in.

And also Wisdom and Forsyth (we have Bogle, Lowe and Anya for their other positions). And then seventh choice is the big lad we bought from Matlock, Max Hunt.

[Ambitious]

Just now, Carl Sagan said:

And also Wisdom and Forsyth (we have Bogle, Lowe and Anya for their other positions). And then seventh choice is the big lad we bought from Matlock, Max Hunt.

We tried to sign the lad that went to Hull, so obviously keeping our options open for a young CB with potential. 

Pearce, I just feel bad for at this stage. He's never really let us down when given the chance, but he's just not at the same level as Davies & Keogh. He'd be a good signing for a Championship club, no doubt, plus his character is very telling in interviews...etc. 

[Carl Sagan]

7 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

My choice of those to try to move on would be:

Mitchell, Hanson, Pearce, Johnson, Butterfield, Blackman, Jerome

but as has been said, it depends if anyone wants them. Butterfield has the technique to fit into a skillful passing midfield, and could flourish under Lampard, but as we'e already seen the club has become quite toxic for him and I wouldn't want him to be an obstacle to bringing through some of the other players.

 

Having posted my list of suggested "outs" above, I'm told the club has circulated a similar list around the league of players who are available for sale or loans:

Anya, Blackman, Butterfield, Guy, Hanson, Jerome, Johnson, Ledley, Martin

Apparently there were others, but after seeing the squad in Tenerife, Lampard has decided to keep them. When I look at these names I think it's a good assessment.

Vydra is neutral, with no pressure to sell. If he goes, Frank gets money to spend.

[Carnero]

6 minutes ago, Carl Sagan said:

Apparently there were others, but after seeing the squad in Tenerife, Lampard has decided to keep them

I bet 2 of them are Bryson & Nugent 

[Carl Sagan]

1 minute ago, Carnero said:

I bet 2 of them are Bryson & Nugent 

half right!

[PistoldPete2]

1 hour ago, europia said:

Well if Vydra is sold, the club will need to buy (at least) 20 goals a season from somewhere. 

WIlson scored 7 in 13 which equates to over 20 goals if sustained over a season, not that I think he will . But Mount can score a fair few from midfield, which we lacked last year.  Unless you count Vyds as a midfileder. 

[EnigmaRam]

Just Nugent then I’d guess, surely he’s surplus?

[i-Ram]

7 minutes ago, Carl Sagan said:

Having posted my list of suggested "outs" above, I'm told the club has circulated a similar list around the league of players who are available for sale or loans:

Anya, Blackman, Butterfield, Guy, Hanson, Jerome, Johnson, Ledley, Martin

Apparently there were others, but after seeing the squad in Tenerife, Lampard has decided to keep them. When I look at these names I think it's a good assessment.

Vydra is neutral, with no pressure to sell. If he goes, Frank gets money to spend.

Thanks Carl for the insight.  This would seem to suggest that we are in for a striker over the coming weeks too.   Given their wages (l guess most of the senior pros are on a sizeable wedge) it will be interesting what fees Mel is prepared to accept to make an exodus happen.

[Ambitious]

2 minutes ago, PistoldPete2 said:

WIlson scored 7 in 13 which equates to over 20 goals if sustained over a season, not that I think he will . But Mount can score a fair few from midfield, which we lacked last year.  Unless you count Vyds as a midfileder. 

Mount is almost certain to take Vydra's spot in the team, in my opinion. The question for me is whether Vydra moves up into the number 9 role or gets sold - I'd probably put my 10 pence worth on the latter. 

[RoyMac5]

31 minutes ago, Carl Sagan said:

...I'm told the club has circulated a similar list around the league of players who are available for sale or loans:

I've no idea who you are, so how do you know these things?

[deanoakaram4life]

18 minutes ago, Ambitious said:

Mount is almost certain to take Vydra's spot in the team, in my opinion. The question for me is whether Vydra moves up into the number 9 role or gets sold - I'd probably put my 10 pence worth on the latter. 

If Vydra's off we need a striker. Can't expect big tallys from Nuge or Jerome tbf 

[Ambitious]

1 minute ago, deanoakaram4life said:

If Vydra's off we need a striker. Can't expect big tallys from Nuge or Jerome tbf 

Yeah, no doubt we will only sell Vydra with a replacement lined up. Marriott seems the obvious choice. Abraham obviously has an open door to come here whenever he wants. 

A reporter in Leeds has come out and said Vyd's wants £50k-a-week, so I actually think it will be difficult to move him on. If he is still here come the first game of the season, it will almost certainly mean no other striker has come in & he starts at the tip of the front 3. 

[Carl Sagan]

32 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

I've no idea who you are, so how do you know these things?

When you're a deceased cosmologist you attain a certain level of omniscience. The Cosmos is all that is or was or ever will be, and I've seen it all. ?

Either that or lovely well-informed people from the Forum sometimes give me a heads up as they don't need the grief. I don't often share, but I don't see any harm here. 

[dcfcfan1]

We need blackman, Nugent, butterfield, martin gone tbh

I know it sounds cold and disloyal but I just want all our deadwood sold so we can jump at opportunities such as marriot 

[Carnero]

12 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

I'm told the club has circulated a similar list around the league of players who are available for sale or loans:

Anya, Blackman, Butterfield, Guy, Hanson, Jerome, Johnson, Ledley, Martin

Pretty much every one of these is understandable, with the only slight surprises being Butterfield & Martin who should be good enough footballers to play in a possession team.

The others are not suited to Frankieball at all, particularly Johnson & Jerome.

If we could get all 9 out (unlikely) then the squad would be reduced to 21, allowing for the addition of a midfielder (Bayliss? Palmer?), a winger (Josefzoon?) & a forward (Abraham? Marriott?).