Will Hughes Watch

[Millenniumram]

2 minutes ago, Alpha said:

Why we writing him off?

Our current starting 11 features Vydra and Weimann. 

Who have both been excellent and are more than capable of getting out this league?

[Alph]

1 minute ago, Millenniumram said:

Who have both been excellent and are more than capable of getting out this league?

Dunno about that. They've been good.

My point is more that who had Weimann down to be a first choice winger for us this time last year. 

Yet Hughes is doomed by September

[Day]

1 minute ago, Alpha said:

My point is more that who had Weimann down to be a first choice winger for us this time last year. 

[Alph]

1 minute ago, David said:

Behave bruv!

Even those that rated him must have thought he was headed for the bin.

Never picked, poor when he was and then loaned out... 

[Day]

1 minute ago, Alpha said:

Behave bruv!

Even those that rated him must have thought he was headed for the bin.

Never picked, poor when he was and then loaned out... 

Thought he was a goner but I wouldn't have sold him, not at the numbers which were being talked about. You get nowt for that these days.

[Millenniumram]

8 minutes ago, Alpha said:

Dunno about that. They've been good.

My point is more that who had Weimann down to be a first choice winger for us this time last year. 

Yet Hughes is doomed by September

I'd have had him down over Russell myself, given his pre season form. Both players get harshly treated imo because they were bought post mcclaren, neither, in particular vydra were given much chance in the right system to show their talents.

Think they both deserve more praise than they get on here, if they were Martin and Russell people would be creaming themselves at some of the performances so far. Vydra in particular is an immense talent when used properly, technically brilliant with the speed of thought to match.

On Hughes I think he made a grave mistake going to Watford, they have ambitions above his current level. Should have done an ince and gone to Brighton imo or someone like that. That being said to write his chances off completely is absurd, a couple of injuries and he might get in the team- if he then shows his obvious capabilities and adapts quickly he may win his place.

[Carl Sagan]

Was in a London black cab last night and the driver asked if I liked football. Of course he was a Hammer (they're almost all Essex boys) and asked me who my team was, When I replied, "the Mighty Derby County" his immediate reaction with nothing from me to instigate it was to ask why the hell we sold Will Hughes who's "such a brilliant player" and then "for next to nothing". It was utter disbelief on his part.

I've actually been invited to the FIFA Awards next month (shameless namedrop) so if Mel's lucky enough to also be invited, I might ask him in person!

[Parsnip]

1 hour ago, Carl Sagan said:

I've actually been invited to the FIFA Awards

Wtf! Who are you? Why are you getting invited to the fifa awards? How come i'm not getting invited to the fifa awards? What even are the fifa awards?

Are you a famous important people? I don't meet many famous important people. 

I don't get invited to s****

 

[RadioactiveWaste]

6 minutes ago, Parsnip said:

Wtf! Who are you? Why are you getting invited to the fifa awards? How come i'm not getting invited to the fifa awards? What even are the fifa awards?

Are you a famous important people? I don't meet many famous important people. 

I don't get invited to s****

 

Breakfast club or mafia are my guesses.

[Carl Sagan]

4 hours ago, Parsnip said:

Wtf! Who are you? Why are you getting invited to the fifa awards? How come i'm not getting invited to the fifa awards? What even are the fifa awards?

Are you a famous important people? I don't meet many famous important people. 

I don't get invited to s****

 

I'm just a dead cosmologist. It's not what you know but who you know and I'm lucky to have friends in high places. Chin up. Your time will come Parsnip!

4 hours ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

Breakfast club or mafia are my guesses.

Still sad at not getting invited to the breakfast club. This'll have to do instead. I'll laugh if there are sausages in hospitality!

[RamNut]

6 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

Was in a London black cab last night and the driver asked if I liked football. Of course he was a Hammer (they're almost all Essex boys) and asked me who my team was, When I replied, "the Mighty Derby County" his immediate reaction with nothing from me to instigate it was to ask why the hell we sold Will Hughes who's "such a brilliant player" and then "for next to nothing". It was utter disbelief on his part.

I've actually been invited to the FIFA Awards next month (shameless namedrop) so if Mel's lucky enough to also be invited, I might ask him in person!

I agree with the taxi driver.

it wasn't gary micklewhite was it?

[cannable]

6 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

I've actually been invited to the FIFA Awards next month (shameless namedrop) so if Mel's lucky enough to also be invited, I might ask him in person!

They'll do anything for a backhander 

[Parsnip]

6 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

why the hell we sold Will Hughes who's "such a brilliant player" and then "for next to nothing

Seriously though, what's your beef with this?? In Jan '17 Will was entering in to his last year - we were about to lose him for nothing in summer 2018 - and Will had to wait another year for his Prem move. Mel and Will's agent obviously came to an arrangement that got Will a quicker move and got us some money. It was a win/win and probably good business. He wanted a move and he did us a favour by signing a new contract.

It's a shame there was no bidding war. 

I miss him too

[Carl Sagan]

12 minutes ago, Parsnip said:

Seriously though, what's your beef with this?? In Jan '17 Will was entering in to his last year - we were about to lose him for nothing in summer 2018 - and Will had to wait another year for his Prem move. Mel and Will's agent obviously came to an arrangement that got Will a quicker move and got us some money. It was a win/win and probably good business. He wanted a move and he did us a favour by signing a new contract.

It's a shame there was no bidding war. 

I miss him too

Agree with most of that. I was surprised Will signed a new contract and presumed there was some sort of agreement. My beef is that we rushed Hughes out the door on the quiet before the season had even properly ended, seemingly doing everything we could to avoid a bidding war. He was still playing in the Euros. Most of the Premier League clubs had just started their summer break. I was told Brighton were also interested, but we never seemed to pursue that.

I believe we could have got 4x the fee had we waited which would have been better for Will in that he would then have had to be played from the off. The problem with being a club's cheapest signing is that you're the easiest person to leave out. But maybe Highes was deperate to go to Watford, even if that seems hard for most of us to imagine, especially as we've had it rammed down our throats for years he's a Liverpool fan. His agent played his career for Watford and perhaps talked him into it and they weren't going to listen to other offers.

I suppose my beef is also that Rowett clearly didn't want him which makes me believe deep down we're screwed because GR must be a terrible judge of a player. And I desperately want Rowett to succeed! I could go to a match and just watch Hughes the whole game because his technique was miles above any of the other players.

[cannable]

8 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

Agree with most of that. I was surprised Will signed a new contract and presumed there was some sort of agreement. My beef is that we rushed Hughes out the door on the quiet before the season had even properly ended, seemingly doing everything we could to avoid a bidding war. He was still playing in the Euros. Most of the Premier League clubs had just started their summer break. I was told Brighton were also interested, but we never seemed to pursue that.

This is what does my head in when Steve Nicholson claims it was a good deal as Watford were the only team in for him.

It was fairly common knowledge that Brighton were sniffing.

The U-21s hadn't finished and you just knew he would produce a MOTM display the minute he left. 

We sold him early in what Rowett has repeatedly stated is a "dead market".

We sold him pre-Neymar transfer explosion. 

The latter is the only factor there in which hindsight had come into play. It was a s**** deal. 

[TuffLuff]

8 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

Agree with most of that. I was surprised Will signed a new contract and presumed there was some sort of agreement. My beef is that we rushed Hughes out the door on the quiet before the season had even properly ended, seemingly doing everything we could to avoid a bidding war. He was still playing in the Euros. Most of the Premier League clubs had just started their summer break. I was told Brighton were also interested, but we never seemed to pursue that.

I believe we could have got 4x the fee had we waited which would have been better for Will in that he would then have had to be played from the off. The problem with being a club's cheapest signing is that you're the easiest person to leave out. But maybe Highes was deperate to go to Watford, even if that seems hard for most of us to imagine, especially as we've had it rammed down our throats for years he's a Liverpool fan. His agent played his career for Watford and perhaps talked him into it and they weren't going to listen to other offers.

I suppose my beef is also that Rowett clearly didn't want him which makes me believe deep down we're screwed because GR must be a terrible judge of a player. And I desperately want Rowett to succeed! I could go to a match and just watch Hughes the whole game because his technique was miles above any of the other players.

I completely agree with you in a lot of ways about technique and how good a footballer he could be, but I don't think the championship suited him. In my opinion he suffered (as did the club) for not selling him the season before. But saying that it would have been hard then after he was injured most of the season before. So we were damned either way.

Simply put his big problems were he had become a target for opposition players in this league and the pace of his game had become slow. So his influence was nullified.

This was partly his fault in that he needed more to his game than his ability with a football. He needed to be a bit more ruthless. Personally I think he's very influenced by the Barcelona style play, which is fine but you have to accept that you need another side to your game.

BUT the bigger blame probably came from the club/management who tried to make him into a player he wasn't. Sometimes he was playing a Thorne role as a deep playmaker and other times he was a tempo setter and he didn't work at either because he can't influence the game playing deeper and his natural game is a bit slow for a tempo setter. So he got messed around which hindered his development.

I don't think it's a coincidence that he performed best with Thorne and Bryson, in that Bryson is the energy/tempo, Thorne is the playmaker and Hughes could pick pockets and knit the play together. He wasn't able to do that in the last season, hence his value and influence have decreased. He's got the ability, but needs to be able to get his game back on track.

[Day]

3 hours ago, cannable said:

This is what does my head in when Steve Nicholson claims it was a good deal as Watford were the only team in for him.

It was fairly common knowledge that Brighton were sniffing.

Watford were the only team. Brighton didn’t want him.

[SaintRam]

28 minutes ago, David said:

Watford were the only team. Brighton didn’t want him.

It was "fairly common knowledge" David. Don't be obtuse now. 

[Carl Sagan]

4 hours ago, TuffLuff said:

I completely agree with you in a lot of ways about technique and how good a footballer he could be, but I don't think the championship suited him. In my opinion he suffered (as did the club) for not selling him the season before. But saying that it would have been hard then after he was injured most of the season before. So we were damned either way.

Simply put his big problems were he had become a target for opposition players in this league and the pace of his game had become slow. So his influence was nullified.

This was partly his fault in that he needed more to his game than his ability with a football. He needed to be a bit more ruthless. Personally I think he's very influenced by the Barcelona style play, which is fine but you have to accept that you need another side to your game.

BUT the bigger blame probably came from the club/management who tried to make him into a player he wasn't. Sometimes he was playing a Thorne role as a deep playmaker and other times he was a tempo setter and he didn't work at either because he can't influence the game playing deeper and his natural game is a bit slow for a tempo setter. So he got messed around which hindered his development.

I don't think it's a coincidence that he performed best with Thorne and Bryson, in that Bryson is the energy/tempo, Thorne is the playmaker and Hughes could pick pockets and knit the play together. He wasn't able to do that in the last season, hence his value and influence have decreased. He's got the ability, but needs to be able to get his game back on track.

What I don't agree with here are the comments about the pace of Hughes' game. He was the only player you watched who always knew what he was going to do with the ball before he received it and more often than not it involved moving it on first time and already being on the move to receive it again. The slowness wasn't down to him - it was brought in by Clement. Left to his own devices Hughes played at a much faster tempo than any of the other players who didn't have the same ability to play fast one-touch (Barcelona-style) football.

You're right he was mucked about positionally. Hughes was perfectly fine as a deep playmaker but it was poor management and a total waste of his talents - like playing Gareth Bale at left back. When someone has Hughes' level of ability he should always have been played much higher up the pitch so he could impact the game far more.

And you're absolutely right that the Championship isn't the league for him. Once he gets his chance I expect him to thrive and really crack on.

[ramsbottom]

5 hours ago, TuffLuff said:

I completely agree with you in a lot of ways about technique and how good a footballer he could be, but I don't think the championship suited him.

He's got the ability, but needs to be able to get his game back on track.

 

9 minutes ago, Carl Sagan said:

. Left to his own devices Hughes played at a much faster tempo than any of the other players who didn't have the same ability to play fast one-touch (Barcelona-style) football.

You're right he was mucked about positionally. Hughes was perfectly fine as a deep playmaker but it was poor management and a total waste of his talents - like playing Gareth Bale at left back. When someone has Hughes' level of ability he should always have been played much higher up the pitch so he could impact the game far more.

And you're absolutely right that the Championship isn't the league for him. Once he gets his chance I expect him to thrive and really crack on.

I'd say he isn't even suited to the premier league where it's all power & pace.  The fact that Cha-Labrador is getting starts for them so soon after his move, despite him having inferior technique.  

He'd be better suited to Spain or Italy, which isn't great, because players like him a ten a penny abroad...