McRamFan Posted April 10, 2018 Share Posted April 10, 2018 19 minutes ago, rsmini said: Shrewsbury could very well be in the Championship next season. Would this effect the plan to have safe standing within the ground? On paper it should as per recommendations being implemented by the report by the FA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith Happens Posted April 10, 2018 Share Posted April 10, 2018 It is understood from reports that the conversation went like this: Tracey Crouch: So whats next ? Adviser: Its an application for safe standing by West Brom Tracey Crouch: Oh that sounds good, shall I authorise it? Adviser: Is it something you think would be a good thing? Tracey Crouch: Oh yes it sounds great, shall we ring them and ask if they want us to pay for it out the public purse? Adviser: That seems very generous, I am sure West Brom will be very happy... Tracey Crouch: West Who???, sorry i thought you said West Ham....oh in that case put it in the bin...next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrivateDerby Posted April 10, 2018 Share Posted April 10, 2018 1 hour ago, McRamFan said: This recommendation has stood, even though it has been proven that the police slaughtered the Liverpool fans, and standing had **** all to do with it. No report or inquest has proven anything, as far as I know they found failings and put the blame where people wanted it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoetheRam Posted April 10, 2018 Share Posted April 10, 2018 5 hours ago, rsmini said: Shrewsbury could very well be in the Championship next season. Would this effect the plan to have safe standing within the ground? The other classic, stupid, piece of legislation requiring them to convert to seating within three years would then come into effect. This is why rail seats have been pushed rather than the other more traditional terracing style model because as we know from Scunthorpe and Peterborough standing in year two of a championship campaign is safe but as soon as it gets to year three it isn't. Whether the rail seats would need to be in the seated position straight away or after three years is unclear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerTedd Posted April 10, 2018 Share Posted April 10, 2018 Do burton have an all seater stadium yet? They’ve only had two years, and the way this seasons going, it doesn’t look worth it to invest in the seats. I went for a play off semi there a few years ago, and I’m sure I remember standing on terraces. It was my daughters first game and I had to carry her the whole time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagerbob Posted April 10, 2018 Share Posted April 10, 2018 Standing is safe period, when you have Stewards adequately policing the no standing in an aisle, and making sure people have tickets for the correct sections etc. Football has moved on from the 80s. Its a shame the Tories havent. Safe Standing is just a way to satisfy the safety Brigade which is modern Britain. Keeps Safety Advisary groups (which wasnt even a thing until recently) happy, Keeps Police happy, Health and safety Excecutive etc. It even keeps Big brother happy who needs to have a name and ID attributed next to every single space in the ground. But alas no the Government refuse to budge. Why they wont budge when Police, Fire, SAG etc see it as more safe than the current setup is anyones guess. Is Safety really the issue with them? Or do they think allowing people a choice to stand will more likely turn them into the animals we occsionally see when England fans travel abroad? Once again who knows. One thing is for sure The Sports Minister Tracey Crouch is just a puppet for a horrible Government towing a an outdated narrow minded view on this issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagerbob Posted April 10, 2018 Share Posted April 10, 2018 5 hours ago, Paul71 said: It is understood from reports that the conversation went like this: Tracey Crouch: So whats next ? Adviser: Its an application for safe standing by West Brom Tracey Crouch: Oh that sounds good, shall I authorise it? Adviser: Is it something you think would be a good thing? Tracey Crouch: Oh yes it sounds great, shall we ring them and ask if they want us to pay for it out the public purse? Adviser: That seems very generous, I am sure West Brom will be very happy... Tracey Crouch: West Who???, sorry i thought you said West Ham....oh in that case put it in the bin...next. Tracey Crouch: So whats next ? Adviser: Its an application for safe standing by West Brom Tracey Crouch: Oh that sounds good, shall I authorise it? Adviser: Whats the Governments Official position on the issue of Safe Standing? Tracey Crouch: Party line is, its unsafe. No point in even reading this then is there? If I authorise it Cabinet will see to it that I get sacked in the morning. Application Rejected. Next? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagerbob Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 Just came across this Brilliant Letter from former Supporter Liason Officer at Bristol City to Sports Minister. (Petition is now virtually at 50k )https://www.otib.co.uk/index.php?/topic/194225-govt-safe-standing-petition-please-read-as-action-is-required/&page=2&tab=comments#comment-3201337 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 This could be sorted very easily - all football supporters let thier politicians know that they will vote for the ones who will allow safe standing then they will re evaluate thier opinions is it likely to happen - probably not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSD Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 What's safer. Allowing 4000 fans in one stand to be stood up in seated areas where you could easily go flying over onto the row below or being stood up with a safety barrier in place which can also be used for seating for required. The government want to reject plans for a system that's safer for supporters than what's currently in place? Makes zero sense to me. Fear of a backlash from the scousers? Even though the kop all stand up as one......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbadbob Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 7 minutes ago, SouthStandDan said: What's safer. Allowing 4000 fans in one stand to be stood up in seated areas where you could easily go flying over onto the row below or being stood up with a safety barrier in place which can also be used for seating for required. The government want to reject plans for a system that's safer for supporters than what's currently in place? Makes zero sense to me. Fear of a backlash from the scousers? Even though the kop all stand up as one......... It's not the scousers fault Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadioactiveWaste Posted April 14, 2018 Share Posted April 14, 2018 It's not a Tory/labour thing, it's that politicians dont see it as a vote winner, but any kind of incident and associated media coverage with your political name attached would be seen as high risk/low value trade off. It's daft, but that's how politics works. You get what they think people will vote for (or against sometimes). I'm in favour of rail seating. I never saw the bad old days, I've enjoyed standing sections when I've been in one and standing in seated sections isn't that great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philmycock Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 Check out the hotbed of footy fans that want to stand, Manchester, Newcastle, Norwich & Derby by the looks of it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andicis Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/43832443 Honestly, it's time for them to change their mind. Stadiums are so much safer than they used to be, and catastrophic errors in judgement like Hillsborough won't happen again. I see no reason why they can't allow it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philmycock Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 43 minutes ago, Andicis said: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/43832443 Honestly, it's time for them to change their mind. Stadiums are so much safer than they used to be, and catastrophic errors in judgement like Hillsborough won't happen again. I see no reason why they can't allow it. They’re obviously desperate for votes in Liverpool, it’s all political innit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andicis Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 5 minutes ago, philmycock said: They’re obviously desperate for votes in Liverpool, it’s all political innit? But surely in Liverpool they can see that, it's the fault of a policing error, not the actual standing, coupled with the fact that standing safety has increased a huge amount. I remember going to Yeovil away, and it was a standing away stand, and it was much safer than Leicester away in the cup, when I ended up down the stairs when we scored! I know it's personal for Liverpool fans, but we can't always look back, sometimes we have to look forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angieram Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 I'm surprised more people haven't signed the petition, to be honest. It maybe shows that the pool of regular away attendees is quite small, really. Surely it is in the interests of anyone who attends away matches to sign, even if they want to sit. At least with a designated standing area the away fans who prefer sitting could avoid it. I quite like to stand at away matches as it is easier to sing, but I have had a couple of six foot blokes topple on to me when we're celebrating a goal and it's very painful and potentially dangerous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagerbob Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 Safe standing is the best we can hope to get. But Safe Standing in Germany was only introduced in at the top clubs to satisfy UEFAs rules on sitting down in european competition. Infact according to the Safe standing roadshow guy, only one club in the entire bundersliga 2 has rail seated "safe standing" At the weekend I wasnt at Pride Park. I was in the away end of my favourite second division club, and it just reminds me of how football used to be in England as teenage guy or in my early 20s before the Taylor report came in. The experience once again Was safe as houses. A bit like rock concert, or standing to watch a band at a festival half way back, So we are not crushed in, we are just a crowd stood next to each other not really invaded personal space. As a result of it being unreserved. It gets people in the ground really early. We can sing and and applaud the players as soon as they begin their pre match warmup. Plenty of time to get your flags n banners tied up at the front, time to get the beers in which we can then take back onto the terraces. Catering then does a decent turn because fans are in the ground before kickoff. The home end is the same, from an hour before the fans are conregating in their places getting into the game atmosphere, only in the seated main stand and opposite stand do you get this thing of just getting to your seat just before kick off. There is no stupidly loud tannoy drowning out songs. I used to wonder why in Germany no one left the ground early. Maybe its because they make a day of it by getting in the ground early and arent in a rush to get back. But its also, because after the game, win lose or draw, both teams seem to have their post match team talk on the field in a circle while the coach gives his speech. Then if they win, the players come over to appluad the Boys end / Ultras and vice versa. If they lose and have lost badly (like was the case on saturday) they still come over to the crowd and take the abuse / listen to what the fans have to say about their peformance, often the coach or one player will even come into the crowd to make that connection with the fans whilst the rest cower back a bit like naughty school children taking a bollocking from the head master. All in all the connection between the fans and the players is better for this, than all leaving early because there are no bars around the stadium, and arent all worried about sitting in a car park as they rush to leave the stadium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike93rh Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 It's scary what common sense is actually up against when it comes to the debate around safe standing. Below is an email I have sent to Tracey Crouch's department, as well as my local MP, I'd love to hear others' thoughts on it: "Dear Ms Crouch, I am writing after hearing your comments regarding safe standing as discussed in parliament yesterday, and would like you to take the time to read and respond to my email. The survey you quoted in parliament obtained opinion on the safe standing issue by asking 1,800 football fans from across the country what they think of standing in grounds, do they themselves want to stand, etc. But I feel this is missing an important point and would like your thoughts on the below. I don't feel it is necessary to canvas every type of supporter, because as yourself and other MPs rightly point out football matches are much more family-friendly affairs now, and not many parents want to force their 4 year olds to stand for 90+ minutes of football. But nobody who is for safe standing is trying to force grounds to install the system everywhere. Instead, we want it in the areas where 'unsafe' standing is already prevalent. If you want a true picture of opinion on the issue by those who it will affect, then the government/FA/Premier League etc. needs to canvas opinion outside the stands of stadiums where the standing is already occurring. I would like to know if this is an opinion you share? I personally support Derby County FC, and tonight there will be around 4,000 Derby fans stood in the south stand and around 2,000 Fulham fans standing in the away end, of around 32,000 people in total. That's nearly 19% of the capacity stood up, 'unsafely'. How many fans around the ground do you think will be against the idea of them standing, even if it's not for them personally? I would hazard a bet at none. Because it's not affecting them, and it adds to the atmosphere and the 'occasion' of the game. Furthermore, football clubs are well aware of their 'family ends' and 'noisy areas', and hence where standing is most likely to prevail. Fans of the clubs themselves are aware of this information too, or can be made aware by the club's ticket office. This adds further weight to the argument that installing safe standing where it is needed will not in any way affect other supporters who do not wish to stand at football grounds. Lastly, I would like to know if your department has conducted/obtained research into the average number of actual 'standers' there are within the top two leagues of English football, as opposed to just the opinion of 1,800 'generic' fans? I feel this is important data you require to make an informed decision as I am not convinced that you are currently aware of just how many football fans stand at any given game currently. I appreciate your time in reading my email and look forward to your response." I feel it's politics that's getting in the way of the right decision being made here. But alas, it seems we have a politician who's too afraid of upsetting the status quo to allow what should be a no-brainer to go ahead. Mindless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted May 11, 2018 Share Posted May 11, 2018 5 minutes ago, mike93rh said: I feel it's politics that's getting in the way of the right decision being made here. But alas, it seems we have a politician who's too afraid of upsetting the status quo to allow what should be a no-brainer to go ahead. Mindless. It was Labour’s Barry Sheerman which stated it. He reiterated something similar an hour ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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