Oldben

https://footballleagueworld.co.uk/how-does-nottingham-forests-squad-market-value-compare-to-derby-county/

7 hours ago, Abu Derby said:

How on earth did Mel pass the ‘fit and proper test’?

I hope that the EFL have a more searching set of questions after this debacle. 

Mm is from derby, he's a self professed derby fan and he was worth several hundred million at the time he purchased Derby.

No wonder the efl agreed to allow him to become the new owner, at the time he tool over derby county.

I'm not supporting mm, just that to the efl, on paper, I can see why mm was allowed to take control of derby.

47 minutes ago, Sparkle said:

All true yet I suspect there are several players in that Derby squad who are just simply saying that they have never seen or never experienced the support and togetherness of the supporters this season in their entire football careers and people should be careful of moving elsewhere because that disappears with one misplaced pass in any other squad currently. 
When players like Curtis Davies are prepared to put their career on the line for a football club the supporters remember - forever - when players like Davies play every game with utmost professionalism to a high standard the supporters remember - forever - when players like Davies say they love this football club and have played for no more than £4,500 a week the other players take notice. 

Exactly what sort of career opportunities do you think are open to Curtis Davies in terms of continuing a football career.

He's 37, so not many teams are going to be glancing his way and that's applicable to any derby player of at least 32 years old.

Players 32yrs+, there are better options for other clubs than from a team that's relegated to League One.

League one is a physically demanding league, so I'm wondering how good our older players will be.

For me, Jurys out on that, until we are mid season.

Every so called minnow team will want to beat the so called giant team that is derby county, in front of a crowd as large as derbys.

Some of our younger players are likely to be of interest to other clubs, especially if they can be acquired as free agents.

As regards Davies salary, is 4500 a week, slightly high for a player who's 38 next season.

https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/derby-county-takeover-news-ashley-6989083?utm_source=derbyshire_live_newsletter&utm_campaign=welcome_dcfc_newsletter2&utm_medium=email

As preferred bidder status removal date is 7 May, opening the option to purchase, to Ashley.

2 hours ago, Animal is a Ram said:

Wigan haven't been there long, relegated (and in administration) in 2019/20 - look set to be promoted back this season. Has to be them that we try and emulate.

We could do with a year of boring stability, off the field at the very least. It'd be nice to still be exciting on the field, but I'll just be happy with winning a few more than we lose.

It's about the team.

Wigan lost a few players, Derby look set to loose a lot of players.

Rooney said he needs about 40 players in the summer.

Assuming a lot of free agents at the end of their careers.

Wigan team value is the most expensive in League one.

2 hours ago, Crewton said:

"Shocking officiating, clubs trying to waste time from almost the word go and visiting players trying to give it the big ‘un in front of the biggest crowd many of them will ever play in front of." 

I think we'll feel right at home.. ? 

Club could be in for a rough time in league one.

Rooneys on record as saying deeby need about 40 players in the summer, as an exodus of players depart the club on free transfers.

Derby are not looking to spend a huge amount to return to League One and that's backed up because efl have said that the club will operate under a 3 year restricted budget under an agreed business plan.

The efl has restricted salary budgets to 2 million a year for league one clubs but that was overturned.

Looking at other clubs in that league, they have bigger budgets.

Looking at clubs in League one: Wigan, Ipswich, Sunderland have been there for a while.

Then Looking at Leeds and forest, they took a while to escape league one.

Without the points deduction, a weak Derby team would have been mid table in the Championship.

A weak Derby in League one might not be in the playoffs but consigned to a mid table finish in League one next season.

Derby have been getting average gates of 20000 this season, I think that drops over an extended period in League one.

The top teams in League one have strikers scoring 20 goals a season, where's derbys.

https://rokerreport.sbnation.com/2022/4/20/23031048/derby-county-relegation-to-league-one-isnt-something-id-wish-on-any-club-take-it-from-us

https://rokerreport.sbnation.com/2022/4/20/23031048/derby-county-relegation-to-league-one-isnt-something-id-wish-on-any-club-take-it-from-us

Once Mel knew he needed more capital for Derby than he was prepared to commit, why didn't he seek out a new owner instead of running his play thing into the ground with huge debt.

Why did he bother staying on as owner.

Surviving The Drop Tactics

Spend Big?

The riskiest strategy is to keep spending at a division higher level. Many minor league teams overspend to get a shot at the big level. To avoid spending a season in the second division, these teams typically lose their great players who do not want to go down with the ship.

Bringing in proven talent and expertise has significant benefits. These are usually excellent players who can be sold when things don't go as planned. They can also mentor your junior squad members. Their reliability makes them the backbone of your team.

However, their salary and transfer fees might be high. There's also no assurance a transfer will go as planned, so when every dollar counts, they are risky bets. These people may be a costly to Derby if the club fails to reclaim the championship tier.

However its true that those teams that have spent the most are mostly in the playoffs or looking at automatic promotion.

Spend Smart?

Losing a division generally means wage cuts, so finding cheap replacements is crucial. It's important to be able to quickly and economically replace players. You should aim for certain players.

1. Emerging youngsters;

2. The out-of-contract established players;

3. Rejects from a top club.

Even successful transfers may fail for unexplained reasons, but strong scouting can reduce chances of that happening.

Next free agents, a manager knows that one man's garbage is another's treasure. The listings of retired players may include some hidden gems, although old legs don’t go so far especially in the physical league one.

Next Loan players, a disadvantage of a loan is that some players are too young to make an immediate impression. However, some can compete and even flourish at lesser levels.

Bargain older players have drawbacks. An old player with season or two is all you'll sign on a bargain. Injured or physically declining players will be the most common ones you sign. Your scouts matter. Without a network, there will be no transactions.

Focus On The Academy?

Benefits Of …

1.      It’s cheap

2.      The fans usually love it

3.      It’s long term planning

Disadvantages

1.      The academy is largely barren, many of our best talents been sold already or are likely to leave in the summer.

2.      Youngsters often fail and are inconsistent

3.      It’s long term planning, and its unhealthy for Derby to spend a long time in league one as there’s little financial return in league one

18 hours ago, angieram said:

It wasn't a policy, we were under transfer embargo.

Firstly,  we won't have money to bring in  players on transfer fees.

Secondly, I think Rooney has done pretty well with the players he has been able to bring in, limited as he was.

The players hes brought in are definately not Rooney's first choice, they were the players he was forced to bring in given the restrictions.

Who says he will not have money, i mean why buy derby for a vast amount of money and then spend nothing on new players for a team that could lose at least 50% of its players in the summer, rooney has stated he wants at least 40 new players in the summer.

Of course that probably does mean we will get a lot of rejects to join the club again, but hopefully in the key and necessary positions derby will be signing some players on a budget.

Remain hopeful that next season doesn't repeat the last two seasons transfer policy.

Spending almost nothing on players, and the bringing in old has beens which in my opinion don't strengthen the squad.

I'm hopeful that we have learned our lessons and want to see a strong enough team to win promotion if we are in League one.

In League there are a number of strong teams, many have a 20 goals a season player.

9 players in League one have scored at least 15 goals, 6 players have scored at least 19 goals.

Lawrence is on 11 goals.

Teams in League one need a strong defense.

5 players have 10+ assists in League one.

Lawrence our top assist player, is on 5 assists.

7 hours ago, angieram said:

Are they? I better hand my maths o-level back, then! 

There are 4 games left to play, win all 4 and get 12 points.

Derby are eight points behind Reading, so if Reading lose three of their remaining 4 games, then there's hope.

Very low odds on that happening.

Another factor will be goal difference at that point in time.

"It's not about how hard you hit. It's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward. How much you can take and keep moving forward."

Rocky balboa Sylvester Stallone

Statistically, Derby are relegated but at least they are going out in style.

"In the midst of chaos, there is also opportunity"

Sun-Tzu, A Arte da Guerra, Art Of War

In the chaos of this season, the team has battled on and now if we are to be relegated, we are going out in style.

Under new ownership, its time to rebuild, to strengthen and to push for a promotion.

"Thus we may know that there are five essentials for victory:
1 He will win who knows when to fight and when not to fight.
2 He will win who knows how to handle both superior and inferior forces. (As Derby did at Fulham)
3 He will win whose army is animated by the same spirit throughout all its ranks. (As Derby Club and fans have this season)
4 He will win who, prepared himself, waits to take the enemy unprepared. 
5 He will win who has military capacity and is not interfered with by the sovereign. (Unfortunately we have been interfered with by the efl throughout the season. That included make our team to weak to fight by not allowing us to sign the best players)

Sun Tzu, The Art of War

https://www.football365.com/news/opinion-rooney-success-derby-county-championship-survival

I want to see derby sign either Cole stockton or Alfie May.

That would show a desire to do something about the mess that clubs in.

Looking forward to the establishment of a quality scouting network, an absolute must once we have a new owner.

Looking forward to the serious bidding war for the best free agents once we are allowed to do that by the efl.

Realistically we might be able to sign 3 or 4 quality free agents in the summer, rooney says he wants upto 40 new players across under 23 and first team players.

The upcoming season suggests a continuation of this trend in terms of transfers.

This season, the club was obliged by the 

efl to abandon its free agency pursuits or at least only make a limited number of signings on limited spend.

The club missed out on a number of free agents that I wished were signed.

We signed a large number of free agents, the most of whom were older players who had been released by their teams for a variety of reasons.

Assuming the team remains in League One next season, this means the club will have fewer possibilities for quality league one players, resulting in further constraints on who the club may recruit in League One.

I'm concerned about the team's need for quality and the fact that many free agents fail to pan out.

Last summer, just a few free agents piqued my interest and we signed none of them, but thinking about it, would we get any of those in League One and would we be more than competitive on wages, which is what the best free players look for?

To my mind, the club cannot compete in League One with a squad dominated by low-quality ageing free agents.

I'm not saying Derby can't sign free agents; there will always be free agents seeking an easier life in the lower leagues, and at League One level, you're essentially signing free agents who have already been rejected by clubs in the Championship, unless you're willing to pay them a bigger wage.

There are a number of clubs in League one all competing for the same few free agents, on top of the Championship clubs who get first pick options on those players.

There are just too many weak points in the squad as it now stands, let alone what the team might look like next season.

It takes time for players to bond as a team when at least 50% of the team is made up of newcomers.

Additionally, there is a possible 15-point deduction; you do not want a weakend team in that situation.

To climb out of league one, teams must invest.

League one team values include the following:

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/league-one/marktwerteverein/wettbewerb/GB3

League one table table ...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/league-one/table

League one top scorers ...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/league-one/top-scorers

In my opinion derby requires a top scorer like these if they are going to compete in League one.

Together with a too assists player like these ...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/league-one/top-scorers/assists

1 hour ago, RamBeauIV said:

Excellent Questions!!!! 

Quite a few people have been suggesting that the Council can turn a profit on renting to us for £1M or £2M per season!  Fantasy Island.

A fair rent might actually be over £5M per season if the Council is not going to be increasing our council tax further.   

The cost of running a football stadium for 12 months (the Boro costs from a few years ago):

• Business Rates = £1.2M
• Utility Bills (Gas, Water, Electricity) = £760K
• Fire, Theft, Liability Insurance = £380K
• Police Costs = £300K
• Other Security, Surveillance, CCTV = £300K
• Medical Presence (Paramedics etc.) = £400K
• VAT = £1.4M
• Ticket Office, Hospitality & Kiosks = £2.5M plus £300K N.I.
• Stewards & PT Staff = £400K
• Ground Maintenance = £400K
• Stadium Cleaning = £345K
• Cleaning Equipment & Sundries = £250K

Who's going to pay these costs? Mel, the council?  The income from tickets, matchdays and sponsorship will soon get swallowed up.  We need the new owner to buy PPS as well as the club.

Thank you, this is exactly what i wanted to know.

Now i think its better to find a buyer for the stadium, someone who can tackle such debt.

However, I am concerned for DCFC as obviously that rental is a loss and 5 million even if its ball park does indicate the amount of money lost to derby.

The new owner isnt going to be buying the club, but I am left wondering if the new owner doesnt choose to lower costs by ground sharing with another local club ie notts county, burton albion or chestfield.

Of course derby fans wouldn't want that but is it cheaper for the new owner.

I see a loss of income the longer the club stays in league one, and so the target has to be promotion from league one at the earliest possibility.

That on top of requiring an almost entire team rebuild.

Derby lack a player capable of scoring 20 goals a season in league one.

Yet if you look the league one top goal scorers table, the majority of the top teams in league one have a top goal scorer.

Derby cant rely on free agents/loans etc as these players dont want to play in league one.

The teams with the highest team spend are the ones at the top of league one, as is the case with most leagues.

6 hours ago, Bubbles said:

?

 

Possibly, he's under some kind of legal restriction where he can't discuss such things without litigation.

6 hours ago, jono said:

In the short term I am not worried about the stadium. Mel needs income from it. It surely can’t be difficult to establish a reasonable rent to new owners. Longer term, I’d much rather the council bought it and the club pays the council. In a way it helps the fans “own” the fabric of the club. This can take its time while the council do their stuff - or Mel hurries them along by reducing the price ! 

Does the council have the budget.

Many councils are financially struggling plus does that mean a temporary reduction in services for disadvantaged groups until the income comes in from the stadium.

Would the council need to take the risk of a very large loan.

It might be better to find a someone willing to risk acquiring the ground.

I think this indicates that the expectation is that Derby gets the 15pts, I see that as meaning best hope is a play off place in League one.

Rooney claims that's a requirement in the  to sign 40 players split between youth and senior squad.

Not sure how strong our team will be.

In league one we need at least one top scorer.

We need a better goalkeeper.

We need a top assist player.

We lack those.

Not sure if we reach the playoffs.

Det ...

Q) In an earlier tweet you said one of the aims was to win the League one title next season, very laudable, but if we do start on -15 dare I venture to suggest it would be virtually impossible and the struggle then would be to avoid going to league 2.

Kirchner: "That would absolutely be a challenge and change our goals for next year. Otherwise, I think everyone has the same goal at the beginning of the year … win matches and try to win the league you’re in. In a normal year, if that’s not the goal, don’t show up."

Q) If we go down to League One and get another 15 point deduction is the plan to bounce straight back up or consolidate for a season and try the year after with a more settled club?

Kirchner: "We will see what the league decides and plan from there. We will be trying to perform our best at all times on the pitch. I think everyone who gets into this is competitive and wants to win. We just won’t ever sacrifice the financial health and future of the club to do so."

3 hours ago, Oldben said:

If it were MA instead of CK, we would know for sure it's a billionaire and we know where most if ma money comes from or at least the amount mentioned in the press.

We also know that ma is vastly experienced in football club ownership.

I guess a factor behind ck is the money, is it his or does it come from venture capital or anonymous backers.

If its from anonymous backers, are any of those from a dubious source.

Mind you I'm not overly concerned about the dubious source as current rules on money laundering and financial regulations should prevent that.

Ck says he's that after the money runs out for the administrators in the future he will be funding the club but that in the future he might look for other investors to help fund the club.

Question: is it better to have investor like MA where you know where the money comes from, and it comes from someone who understands the dynamics of running a football club.

Or, is it better to have potentially multiple investors where potentially if something goes wrong your left with creditors like msd.

We have had a few unscrupulous investors attempt to buy the club.

If Appleby had bought the club, he's meant to be someone who has a desire to see the best for the club. However, that's an approach that didn't work so well with mm ie local fan buys the club.

If someone buys it purely as an investment is that a concern? I mean what happens if that doesn't bring a return on the investment.

Ck says he fully backs rooney.

Rooney for me hasn't been fully tested, this season it's been like, well if you fail to successfully manage the team it's possible to walk away and say look at the mess that club was in.

Is he good enough to promote the team if its in League one, noting that there are some good managers/teams in League one.

I don't see League one as easy without the right team/manager.

Does anyone know if MA would have kept rooney at the club?

1 hour ago, Mucker1884 said:

The only negativity* I've seen thus far is that he says he aims to win L1 next year... We ain't even there yet!  

 

 

 

*Negativity/Realism... same thing in this instance, it could be argued.  ?

Assuming we are in League one next season ...

1. We don't have a team at present, so many players are out of contract in the summer; Any team will require a large rebuild

2. Will the efl give us a 15 point deduction, if so we are not winning league one next season

3. There are a number of teams capable of beating derby in League one next season, it will not be easy even with a large team rebuild

4. I can see why the desire is to be promoted back to the Championship on the first attempt, but again the need for a very strong team to succeed in the Championship, if success is measured by being promoted to the Premier league

League one team values, thinking about maybe 60% of team leaving in the summer, especially our best players  ...

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/sheffield-wednesday/startseite/verein/1035/saison_id/2021

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/sunderland-afc/kader/verein/289/saison_id/2021

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/ipswich-town/kader/verein/677/saison_id/2021

If it were MA instead of CK, we would know for sure it's a billionaire and we know where most if ma money comes from or at least the amount mentioned in the press.

We also know that ma is vastly experienced in football club ownership.

I guess a factor behind ck is the money, is it his or does it come from venture capital or anonymous backers.

If its from anonymous backers, are any of those from a dubious source.

Mind you I'm not overly concerned about the dubious source as current rules on money laundering and financial regulations should prevent that.