NottsRam77

24 minutes ago, MadAmster said:

Over 5 seasons promoted, relegated, promoted, relegated, promoted. There are 2 ways to view the 2 relegations, IMO.

1. He isn't up to coaching in the SBC or

2. The Millers didn't have the money to pay for the players he wanted / Rotherham wasn't a big enough draw for players / both

When he left Rotherham to come to us last season they were in 8th. Does that mean 2. above is the more likely?

On paper he recruited well. Most fans seemed to be of that opinion until the "proper" games started. Unfortunately, football is played on grass, not on paper. Every new signing is a gamble that may, or may not, come off. The measure of PW will be to see if he can take the current situation and turn it round into something resembling the confidence everybody seemed to have going into the season.

On the start, we've never done better than 2 wins from the opening 6 games in any season in which we won the League or got promoted. We have a 2 in 7 (1975) and two 2 in 8s. The rest were all 2 in 6.

Also remember 2 years ago. the Dogs down the road lost their opening 7 and went up...

Im not bashing him.. quite the opposite 

im pointing out he has had success at this level 3 times… his record on a tiny budget in the league above is an open discussion

what im saying is  i wont question his record at this level

52 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

But does he? And is that important? It doesn't take long for it too change. The only thing that seems to be consistent with what other fans told us when we were relegated was the refs were crap and there was huge amounts of time-wasting. Other than that it is populated with different types of football playing teams just as the Championship is it seems to me.

Roy… u dont get promoted from this league 3 times and not know it .. cmon 

if he knows beyond this league is in doubt, questioned , to be proved but to say he doesnt know this league is silly with 3 successful promotions from it on his cv 

hes in a select few in that respect 

i know what ur saying 

u could argue he dossnt know derby county… what we expect (the moon on a stick lol) 

Having had a bit of time to digest and let the dust settle.

my considered thoughts fwiw

a hugely disapointing result but an even more worrying performance.

you could see way before they scored our lack of being able to do the fundamental basics.

communication and organisation was clearly lacking. Players going for the same ball… balls being played short when the runner went long, balls going long when the recipient was showing short. Their players picking up space with no one around them. Its a basic of any footballer at any level to be able to communicate, to pass player on, pick players up, To be aware of players and space around them…. And we were oblivious and amateur at all of this from the word go.

thats my biggest concern and critisism of the team and warne. I would expect under him the basics to be executed flawlessly ..he talks endlessly about the small things matter and doing the basics well.

well if the oxford game was an example of this he and the club are in trouble.

hes not stupid, he knows this league and im sure it will be addressed but im genuinely not sure the players are capable of it

how can u press hard and quickly with JC upfront.. he works hard yes… but not at any sort of speed .. its not his game… would wash and MW change that? Maybe ? I hope so

but i dont get how u can be a hard pressing team with a 6ft plus oil tanker up top

its all a little worrying, but its now he earns his crust

coyr!

For 3m id definitely sell …. But i am genuinely worried about where we’re at 

(caveat not as worried as i was last summer lol)

Are we still under a business plan? Are we able to spend any money at all? 
 

what confuses me is that clowes said we have a good budget for the division.. yet weve still to spend a penny bar wages but then bielik and off the wage bill would cover most of that.

There was a lot of talk about getting a more rounded age group into the building but bar elder and ward (just) weve yet to do that and have signed players at the tail end of their careers.

i wasnt expecting us yo go crazy and scatter gun but was hoping that we would get some much needed energy (23-26) that maybe still needed rounding but were here to work on.

if we sell cash for another journyman or two ill be very disappointed.

Unless this is all a buying us time exercise to get away from this business plan where we can be a little more free and creative… or maybe to let the accademy recruits come of age 🤷

i dont know… it all seems a little meh and rudderless in terms of a strategy atm.. and i wasnt asking or expecting a lot 

2 hours ago, NottmRAM said:

Waggy can create as well as score but I think we're crying out for a Jack Marriot type.

Both tbh lol

2 hours ago, NottmRAM said:

For me, it boils down to this:

1. Sloppy passing. This is down to the players and is almost always a confidence thing.

2. Too slow in transition. This is a big problem and the main issue. Last night we moved the ball up the pitch with the pace of erosion. Sideways and backwards passing when we've won the ball in defence. Getting the ball up the pitch quickly is key to creating chances. PW came out after a bad perormance last season and said "I don't think my message was clear. I didn't mean NEVER pass backwards or sideways, but it should be a last resort. We should be always looking to pass the ball forward." That message seems to have changed. PW did make a comment last night about "being braver" and my interpretation of that is looking to move the ball up the pitch instead of playing the easy, short, sideways pass.

3. Bad press. "The press" done right is a good tactic but it has to have the whole team working together for it to work. When the press is not done well, it is easy to pass through it (which is exactly what Oxford did last night for their second goal).

4. We need someone in defence to carry the ball out. This creates space further up the pitch and sets up the move.

5. The players last night did not look like a team. From front to back, there was no cohesion. They were not reading the passes or the runs. This is why it is important to keep the same starting 11. Finding that starting 11 is the tricky part when they have had a bad start and the manager is being asked to find an answer pronto.

Also think … and lets be honest we all thought it start of the season

i dont think collins is good enough

the service was crap to him last night but how many times did he win a contested ball up to him.

iv seen much slighter forwards win more ball, make it stick or draw the foul

not using him as the scape goat as he could quite easily be part of the solution with better service i just think we need better up there in terms of cuteness and ability to lead the line… id rather see waggy quite honestly .. but im saying that with waggy of 5 years ago in mind 

so its all a bit of a mess tbh 

9 hours ago, Andicis said:

Didn't we fire managers at the first difficulty under Mel? How did that work out for us? "But this is different". No, it isn't. It's time for us to learn our lesson as a club.

This

while like everyone else im disappointed and at the crap what we witnessed last night.

weve done the managerial merry go round before and it nearly killed us

sadly weve got to sup it up put our big boy pants on and keep our fingers crossed that time allows the players to gel and execute a game plan with greater conviction than last night

Game over

theyve been utter s*** 

2 minutes ago, 8Leeds said:

I wouldn’t say that they aren’t very good, they’ve just been asked to do jobs they shouldn’t be and the tactics they’ve been asked to execute are utter sh!te

Just keep giftwrapping opportunities to the opposition through needless mistakes

1 minute ago, Silko said:

Did we get booed off again ? 

Yes

i predicted 6 -12 games before rhe booing started and got laughed at

its not even taken 3 games 

shocking in all aspects tbh 

The lack of quality and composure on the ball is fricking freightening

id be looking at waggy and wash in sooner rather than later, drop bird back and get him on the ball .. its not good against a pretty ordinary and rarely troubled oxford

1 minute ago, Eoghan1884 said:

This goalie doesn’t look very confident, get some balls in on top of him and a few shots off 

Nor does ours lol

or our back line lol

Just not been good enough

sums up our first half that

simply not good enough

passing not good enough, intensity not good enough, composure not good enough, communication not good enough. 
 

Absolutely crap so far 

need a rocket up their arses 

Nearly killed ourselves there by sheer lack of communication

basics derby , basics 

1 minute ago, Gee SCREAMER !! said:

Ward done, covering for Smiths fanny challenge.

Other way round

smith covered wards s*** challenge

We seem very slow and ponderous on the ball atm

also seems a total lack on communication between those on the ball and those not

Need to sharpen it up 50% 

1 hour ago, duncanjwitham said:

Sorry mate but that’s just nonsense.  Just because 2 teams work hard doesn’t remotely mean they play in the same way. Would you say that Liverpool and Man City play the same way because they both favour ability over hard work? 

Think your totally missing my point or im not conveying it clear enough

im Not saying that at all .. quite obviously i wouldnt say that 

9 hours ago, duncanjwitham said:

Warne teams are literally nothing like Billy Davies teams 🤷‍♂️.  Certainly the first half of the Davies season, it was very much a defensive 6 (back 4 with Seth Johnson and Matt Oakley sat in front), and the front 4 go and score the goals.  We opened up a bit when we signed a bunch of players in January, but it was still a very structured, regimented team.  Warne's teams basically have everybody trying to contribute to every phase of the game.  You'd never see anything like the Cashin overlapping runs, or Korey Smith scoring inside the 6 yard box in a Davies team.  And likewise, you'd never see the gaping holes in the backline and midfield that those things sometimes result in.

We aren't ever going to be an organised, cohesive unit because we aren't trying to be.  We're trying to make the game fast, chaotic and disorganised, because we think that will let our supposedly better fitness give us the edge. 

It was a team based on hard work, graft and endevor over ability.. there was ability in there obviously but it was a side that was first and formost battler and grafters

 if u compare the skillset of that team to the total football side that was that wba team we beat in the final … robert koren, john greening and zolton gera u know what im getting at 

11 hours ago, duncanjwitham said:

Have they? Which ones? 

I think what he's trying to do is *very* different to the Warnock/Rowett types of setup.  Those teams are solid, well-organised, hard-to-break-down etc.  Warne's "everybody running all the time" type thing is the polar opposite of that.  We aren't setting out to be disciplined, or organised or anything like that.  As far as I can tell, the idea is basically to try and get overloads all over the pitch (defensively and offensively) by out-running them - we're effectively trying to play 2 fullbacks and 2 wingers, 4 defensive midfielders and 4 attacking midfielders, except it's the same 6 players running between both ends of the pitch.  It's by definition chaotic.

And personally, I think there's only so far that can take you.  The ball will always move quicker than players can, and as the standard of players gets better, you'll get diminishing returns as to how much you can close that gap by running more.  Better players will keep the ball better, you'll be chasing it more and getting tired quicker.  And better players will punish mistakes more, because no matter how much you run, in a system like that you will get caught out sometimes, when everyone goes forwards and doesn't get back in time

Well us for one under billy .. took me about 3 seconds to think of that one lol

luton town …. 5 seconds lol

want me to go on ? 
 

no were not an organised, cohesive unit yet but that might be because our newly assembled squad has had 3 competitive games to gel lol

1 hour ago, Blondest Goat said:

I think there's some truth in this too. It did however work 3 times for Rotherham in this league.  I think the bigger question is how far it will take you in the championship but we can worry about that when we get there.  

With better players that we would get in the champ, ur able to press harder , for longer and with greater discipline and awareness.

countless teams have played and done well with a warne esq approach its just doing it well and consistently. 
 

like any style, executed well and it looks the nuts.. when executed badly it looks a disorganised mess 

15 hours ago, Gee SCREAMER !! said:

As I understood it, we have been unable to bring in or register any players from outside the UK whilst the Jozwiak fee was unpaid.

That could have bearing on it, or, we just don't look outside a set geographical belt as per usual like the last 10 years.

Im fine with us staying in our safety belt if our last two overseas investments are anything to go by .. kamil joswiak and abdul camera lol

7 hours ago, Caerphilly Ram said:

More surprising was Max Lowe picking a fight with 76 year old Roy Hodgson 😂 

Lol, yer just a bit 😂😂

honestly think sheff united but particularly luton have a real chance of matching our record. Luton looked dreadful

Did not expect to see will osula leading the line for opening day in the prem.

showed flashes of real potential for us and truth be told if love him to be here as that pacey other option.

but ultimately he was unable to displace james collins. 
 

ad now hes leading the line in the prem.. also saw dobbin got a cameo for everton.

Its a funny old game 

Scored for the wendies today 

4 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said:

It's a great message to the team. If Warne likes you, it doesn't matter how crap you play, you'll still start. If Warne doesn't like you, you can be one of the best players on the pitch and you still won't start.

Aged well 😉😂

or the thing that i said 😉