Ice hockey

[Foreveram]

I have traveled up to Whitley bay with my granddaughter to watch her play for Hull, my first live match since that tragic accident, quite poignant.

[Jubbs]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-67419951

Adam Johnson: Manslaughter arrest over ice hockey player's death

Edited November 14, 2023 by Jubbs

[Stive Pesley]

58 minutes ago, Jubbs said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-67419951

Adam Johnson: Manslaughter arrest over ice hockey player's death

I guess because someone died, and clearly another person unintentionally caused that death, there have to be manslaughter charges?

Hopefully it's dealt with quickly and sensitively, and the mitigating circumstances don't lead to a custodial sentence. I imagine that the Steeler's player responsible can't feel any worse than he already does 😔

 

[Anon]

14 hours ago, Stockport Ram said:

I have seen the footage of the incident. It is horrific.

I have never been to a professional ice hockey game nor do I watch Ice hockey, but for those on the forum who are fans, can you tell me if that sort of challenge (foot to the head region) is common and “accepted” in the game please? 

No, it isn't common. Skates will rarely get up that high. Normally when they do it's a result of a player being sent flying by a check. Every player understands that everyone is skating around with deadly weapons on their feet and it's possible to lose control of your body when skating at speed. Having said that, I don't fully understand why the leg gets raised in this instance. The clip that causes the defensive player to lose control seems pretty innocuous, but momentum does weird things to the body.

[BaaLocks]

I don't understand why someone would watch a clip where they know someone dies.

[Anon]

20 minutes ago, BaaLocks said:

I don't understand why someone would watch a clip where they know someone dies.

Because it's interesting, and because we'd have no business commenting on the challenge if we hadn't watched it.

For what it's worth Johnson comes out of the footage looking like a hero. He doesn't panic and immediately skates across to the bench, giving himself the best possible chance of survival in the circumstances.

[Comrade 86]

Is the consensus that it was deliberate foul play? I can't actually believe that the player would try to maim someone, so was it just a nasty challenge that went horribly wrong and has the guy in question got previous for such things?

So sad that a young athlete loses his life like this. Can't actually bring myself to watch the video.

[RadioactiveWaste]

3 hours ago, BaaLocks said:

I don't understand why someone would watch a clip where they know someone dies.

Sometimes it's to try to make sense of what's been described - I've not watched this incident but I remember when MotoGP rider Marco Simoncelli was killed in a crash I didn't see it but none of the descriptions of it made sense to me (and i still had my motorbike at the time and was really puzzled) so I watched it, the poor guy was really really really freakishly unlucky - and I guess the same here.

It's not necessary for morbid or voyeuristic purposes,but it's not something I'd take lightly myself.

[Anon]

1 hour ago, Comrade 86 said:

Is the consensus that it was deliberate foul play? I can't actually believe that the player would try to maim someone, so was it just a nasty challenge that went horribly wrong and has the guy in question got previous for such things?

So sad that a young athlete loses his life like this. Can't actually bring myself to watch the video.

It's very difficult to judge the consensus for a couple of reasons. Firstly, the footage for anyone who doesn't watch hockey looks awful. If you don't understand hockey it looks like Petgrave makes a beeline for Johnson and karate kicks him in the neck. This, along with the nature of online discourse has polarised discussion. There are people who think it's horrific that the authorities would even investigate and there are people who think Petgrave should be tried for murder, never mind manslaughter. Second, many of the more balanced forums have banned discussion both due to the emotive nature of the incident and the fact that there's an ongoing police investigation.

No way was Petgrave trying to maim Johnson, but I do think it's the correct decision to properly investigate. Petgrave is a goon. He's had disciplinary issues in numerous leagues, but that doesn't necessarily mean anything since this is a legitimate role in hockey and pen minutes/suspensions are expected. There is footage of Petgrave leading with the knee in other challenges. I think it will be extremely difficult to prove recklessness or criminal negligence. Not the same sport, but if Kevin Muscat was never criminally charged I think they will have to dig up a crazy amount of footage to establish a pattern of behaviour for Petgrave.

Edited November 28, 2023 by Anon

[Andicis]

6 hours ago, Stockport Ram said:

It really does. There appears clear intent to harm (obviously not to kill) so I don’t know if that’s enough in a court of law for a manslaughter charge. 

If someone tragically dies as a result of another’s wilful actions it would seem to follow that there should be consequences.

if you drink and drive and kill someone on the roads then as a result of your wilful choice of action ( drinking and driving) you are convicted.  

I don’t see any logical difference in this case, however random it may be.

Because drinking and driving is clearly reckless. Going in for a body check is common practice in ice hockey, which is what it appears he went to do. The skate to skate contact as well as the hip check knocked him off balance. It's just one of those tragic accidents, nobody is to blame. 

[Stive Pesley]

10 hours ago, Andicis said:

Because drinking and driving is clearly reckless. Going in for a body check is common practice in ice hockey, which is what it appears he went to do. The skate to skate contact as well as the hip check knocked him off balance. It's just one of those tragic accidents, nobody is to blame. 

I'm hoping that's the what the manslaughter charge is all about - a chance to have this explained in court, so that Petgrave can come to terms with what happened, and that Johnson's family can find some peace in it being officially ruled a tragic accident

[Cisse]

I have been sent flying on skates and there is not a lot you can do while in air. It happens so quick. Even though Petgrave is a dirty player he is also not skilled enough to do Bruce Lee type moves with or without skates. Petgrave plays in Britain because he can't play in better leagues. One problem with these kind of videos is that when you watch them in slow motion things start to look so different from the reality. 

The same kind of thing happened to Richard Zednik in the past. His own team mate went flying and cut Zednick's throat. Luckily Zednik survived.