The Rugby Union Thread

[Chester40]

I generally watch the 6 Nations and have done since I was a kid, but otherwise I can take it or leave it.

The World Cup is the opportunity to really put the game into the national consciousness... but it really isn't a great format for the general public. 

Unless England get up a head of steam and reach semi/final and play an old enemy/favoured team (France, Aussies, All Blacks) then it will pass by largely unremarkable upon. 

Lots of horribly one-sided games, huge waits between games, unbelievably inscrutable rules for the casual observer....

Cricket reinvented itself with 20-20... I wonder if it is possible to do something with the format/rules to make it more gripping from the outset of the competition. 

.

 

Edited September 29, 2023 by Chester40

[Comrade 86]

14 hours ago, Chester40 said:

I generally watch the 6 Nations and have done since I was a kid, but otherwise I can take it or leave it.

The World Cup is the opportunity to really put the game into the national consciousness... but it really isn't a great format for the general public. 

Unless England get up a head of steam and reach semi/final and play an old enemy/favoured team (France, Aussies, All Blacks) then it will pass by largely unremarkable upon. 

Lots of horribly one-sided games, huge waits between games, unbelievably inscrutable rules for the casual observer....

Cricket reinvented itself with 20-20... I wonder if it is possible to do something with the format/rules to make it more gripping from the outset of the competition. 

.

 

I think it's been brilliant to be honest. Some huge games already, with more to come and we've not yet hit the knockout stages, which will be monumental.

As for the smaller nations, they can only improve for more games against better opposition, even if they do receive an awful tonking or two in the process. Lest we forget, the Kiwis stuck 145 points on the Japanese when they first pitched up at a WC and the Japanese went on to beat the mighty Saffas at RWC15 and have beaten Wales and Scotland too. It took time, but the point is you have to start somewhere. 

[RadioactiveWaste]

Perhaps a push could be made on Rugby 7s the way 20-20 cricket has?

The one sided games haven't been great for the WC, but the key games have been really good, Ireland v south Africa and Fiji beating the Aussies have been good moments already.

Whilst I fear Scotland won't make the QFs which is a shame as the Scotland team is decent from the QFs onwards I expect every match to be good and I can't wait.

[Comrade 86]

5 hours ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

Whilst I fear Scotland won't make the QFs which is a shame as the Scotland team is decent from the QFs onwards I expect every match to be good and I can't wait.

A predictably full throttle smash up between Fiji and a never say die Georgian outfit. Bodies strewn everywhere at full time, there'll be some sore limbs in the morning. 

 

Edited September 30, 2023 by Comrade 86

[RadioactiveWaste]

Scotland doing what they need to against Romania who've had 2 yellow cards.

The game v Ireland is going to be huge. Obviously, you fear the worst as a Scotland fan (in pretty much every sport) but the if we have our day factor is there.

Making it out of this group would be a massive achievement for Scotland.

[Comrade 86]

2 hours ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

Scotland doing what they need to against Romania who've had 2 yellow cards.

The game v Ireland is going to be huge. Obviously, you fear the worst as a Scotland fan (in pretty much every sport) but the if we have our day factor is there.

Making it out of this group would be a massive achievement for Scotland.

Poor Romania looked beat inside 10 minutes, but all credit to Scotland who were utterly ruthless and played some scintillating rugby. The game against Ireland is obviously a different kettle of fish, but Scotland have potent weapons of their own. As with a few of the games on that side of the draw, I think it'll be about who turns up on the day and the Scots aren't cowed by any side these days.

Ireland will start favourites and rightly so, but Darcy Graham is on fire and with the big lad to come back in and Russell waiting in the wings, the Scots backfield is looking pretty damn tasty right now. If Scotland can front up 1 through 8, I think their chance is there for all to see. It's certainly one for the neutrals to savour 😆

[Comrade 86]

There's a few I'd not miss if they never played again 😂 I'm actually not sure I'm even joking.

Too many of our lads believe they are way better than they are. This was 2/3 off our strongest 15! I'm done with Borthwick anyway. We might go further than our ability would normally allow us, but the eye does not lie. Scotland, Ireland, France, NZ and the Saffas all streets ahead of us on pretty much every level. 

Out with Borthwick, unless he conjures up a miracle. He lacks the requisite courage to drop underperforming players. Everything that was good about his transformation of Leicester, has been overridden in favour of Eddie Jones-esque 'pragmatism'. Cadan Murphy, VRR, Quirke, Randall, Slade...  Farrell isn't in the top half dozen Englishman playing 12 in the Prem!

Out with Roger 'Soundbite' Sweeney irrespective; £600k and expenses to bring the English game to its knees, 4 clubs gone, the national side in disarray, viewing figures plummeting. What does the man do, PR aside? Way past time we flushed out the port guzzling, old school tie brigade and brought in professionals with a clear vision /strategy and the drive to implement it. 

 

[Comrade 86]

Setting England's defensive woes aside, the Scots sadly failed to bring their a-game this week in what may yet prove to be the most challenging contest in rugby; beating the boys from the Emerald Isles. The Irish have surprised me as they are maintaining the trajectory of the last 2 years or so that saw them reach the world #1 slot. I honestly didn't think they could play any better. Wrong! 

Doff of the cap to the Portuguese who have just beaten Fiji in Toulouse. No fluke either and this is why I've no issue with the format or team numbers. I was in South Africa when the Japanese turned over them over 9n 2015 and I'd put this performance at that same level. Absolutely brilliant game of rugby that swung one way, then the other, right to the final minute. Massive props.

Angry Fijians then next week 😱

[RadioactiveWaste]

1 hour ago, Comrade 86 said:

Setting England's defensive woes aside, the Scots sadly failed to bring their a-game this week in what may yet prove to be the most challenging contest in rugby; beating the boys from the Emerald Isles. The Irish have surprised me as they are maintaining the trajectory of the last 2 years or so that saw them reach the world #1 slot. I honestly didn't think they could play any better. Wrong! 

Doff of the cap to the Portuguese who have just beaten Fiji in Toulouse. No fluke either and this is why I've no issue with the format or team numbers. I was in South Africa when the Japanese turned over them over 9n 2015 and I'd put this performance at that same level. Absolutely brilliant game of rugby that swung one way, then the other, right to the final minute. Massive props.

Angry Fijians then next week 😱

A shame for Scotland to go out the way they did, was always going to be a hard ask and whilst in my heart I expect Ireland to overcome them I'd hoped for more. Getting picked with South Africa and Ireland...

Still, super glad to see Fiji through and having Argentina in the QFs is good as well. The more success seen outside of the traditional 8 rugby playing nations the better.

[oomarkwright]

Yeh great win for Portugal. That will be good for their nation. Yet Fiji went thru ahead of Australia so if carlsberg did Sundays, 😁. 

[Comrade 86]

11 hours ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

A shame for Scotland to go out the way they did, was always going to be a hard ask and whilst in my heart I expect Ireland to overcome them I'd hoped for more. Getting picked with South Africa and Ireland...

Still, super glad to see Fiji through and having Argentina in the QFs is good as well. The more success seen outside of the traditional 8 rugby playing nations the better.

And on that note.... Portugal!!! No fluke about it either. Absolutely brilliant, they were.

[LeedsCityRam]

On 07/10/2023 at 19:44, Comrade 86 said:

There's a few I'd not miss if they never played again 😂 I'm actually not sure I'm even joking.

Too many of our lads believe they are way better than they are. This was 2/3 off our strongest 15! I'm done with Borthwick anyway. We might go further than our ability would normally allow us, but the eye does not lie. Scotland, Ireland, France, NZ and the Saffas all streets ahead of us on pretty much every level. 

Out with Borthwick, unless he conjures up a miracle. He lacks the requisite courage to drop underperforming players. Everything that was good about his transformation of Leicester, has been overridden in favour of Eddie Jones-esque 'pragmatism'. Cadan Murphy, VRR, Quirke, Randall, Slade...  Farrell isn't in the top half dozen Englishman playing 12 in the Prem!

Out with Roger 'Soundbite' Sweeney irrespective; £600k and expenses to bring the English game to its knees, 4 clubs gone, the national side in disarray, viewing figures plummeting. What does the man do, PR aside? Way past time we flushed out the port guzzling, old school tie brigade and brought in professionals with a clear vision /strategy and the drive to implement it. 

 

A likely World Cup semi final will sadly keep the status quo in tact for a while yet - I completely agree that the RFU are negligently managing the game in this country. Eddie Jones alluded to the dearth of talent coming through before he resigned & the RFU must take responsibility for not providing the pathways - the current England squad still has too many who went to the 'right type of school'. Absolutely appalled by their handling of the desperate situations at Wasps, Worcester & Irish too.

As to the tournament, really enjoyed it so far especially given the change in power from South to North. I suspect we will see the Northern Hemisphere win its second RWC shortly & my money is on Ireland, such intensity and class & impressively coached by Andy Farrell. We are extremely fortunate to be on the other side of the draw - France v Saffas and Ireland v ABs really should be the World Cup semis. Also great to see the Tier 2 nations starting to improve - Portugal & Uruguay have been very bright indeed & I hope World Rugby give some real thought after the RWC as to how to facilitate their improvement along with Chile, Georgia & the Pacific Nations.

Edited October 9, 2023 by LeedsCityRam

[Comrade 86]

16 hours ago, LeedsCityRam said:

A likely World Cup semi final will sadly keep the status quo in tact for a while yet - I completely agree that the RFU are negligently managing the game in this country. Eddie Jones alluded to the dearth of talent coming through before he resigned & the RFU must take responsibility for not providing the pathways - the current England squad still has too many who went to the 'right type of school'. Absolutely appalled by their handling of the desperate situations at Wasps, Worcester & Irish too.

As to the tournament, really enjoyed it so far especially given the change in power from South to North. I suspect we will see the Northern Hemisphere win its second RWC shortly & my money is on Ireland, such intensity and class & impressively coached by Andy Farrell. We are extremely fortunate to be on the other side of the draw - France v Saffas and Ireland v ABs really should be the World Cup semis. Also great to see the Tier 2 nations starting to improve - Portugal & Uruguay have been very bright indeed & I hope World Rugby give some real thought after the RWC as to how to facilitate their improvement along with Chile, Georgia & the Pacific Nations.

Sweeney has to go. He's presided over the decimation of the game at home and for too long, the stuffed shirts have rinsed the players whilst filling their own pockets. Let's not forget the 2003 crop had to refuse to rain whilst in training camp for their victorious RWC exploits.  Really not a lot has changed and Sweeney is a painful throwback IMHO.

As for the tourney, well no gripes from me. It's been brilliant and more so than any (and I've watched every game I could from every RWC since the first one) it's been by far the best and critically, the highest profile. Rugby is on the threshold of becoming a truly global sport and the game's administrators need to be of a calibre that can fully exploit the swelling interest to the benefit of the game itself. 

My highlight so far? Easy. the Portuguese team, who rocked up with no fear at ll, played an expansive game from all over the park and consequences be damned. They really embody the essence of the game and its spirit and I think they've been beyond exceptional. Romania have steadily improved and warrant a mention based on heart alone. They've taken some fearful tonkings, but have to a man stayed present and stood up and they've shown steady improvement and I thought the scoreline in their last game did them zero justice. I love their fighting spirit and they again tried to play rugby that fans want to watch. 

Knock-outs here we come. I'm at a mate's 40th do on Saturday, so I'll miss the first of the big ties, but I've already got a bottle of Macallan in for the Sunday games and I can catch the Ireland v NZ game as an hors d'oeuvre, or amuse bouche either side of a fillet of beef. I'm like a pig in shoyte right now, despite England's woes 😎

 

[RadioactiveWaste]

On 10/10/2023 at 15:03, Comrade 86 said:

Sweeney has to go. He's presided over the decimation of the game at home and for too long, the stuffed shirts have rinsed the players whilst filling their own pockets. Let's not forget the 2003 crop had to refuse to rain whilst in training camp for their victorious RWC exploits.  Really not a lot has changed and Sweeney is a painful throwback IMHO.

As for the tourney, well no gripes from me. It's been brilliant and more so than any (and I've watched every game I could from every RWC since the first one) it's been by far the best and critically, the highest profile. Rugby is on the threshold of becoming a truly global sport and the game's administrators need to be of a calibre that can fully exploit the swelling interest to the benefit of the game itself. 

My highlight so far? Easy. the Portuguese team, who rocked up with no fear at ll, played an expansive game from all over the park and consequences be damned. They really embody the essence of the game and its spirit and I think they've been beyond exceptional. Romania have steadily improved and warrant a mention based on heart alone. They've taken some fearful tonkings, but have to a man stayed present and stood up and they've shown steady improvement and I thought the scoreline in their last game did them zero justice. I love their fighting spirit and they again tried to play rugby that fans want to watch. 

Knock-outs here we come. I'm at a mate's 40th do on Saturday, so I'll miss the first of the big ties, but I've already got a bottle of Macallan in for the Sunday games and I can catch the Ireland v NZ game as an hors d'oeuvre, or amuse bouche either side of a fillet of beef. I'm like a pig in shoyte right now, despite England's woes 😎

 

I like a MacAllan.

 

[Comrade 86]

England team to face Fiji

England: Smith; May, Marchant, Tuilagi, Daly; Farrell (capt), Mitchell; Genge, George, Cole, Itoje, Chessum, Lawes, Curry, Earl.

Replacements: Dan, Marler, Sinckler, Martin, Vunipola, Care, Ford, Lawrence.

I don't even know where to begin with this team selection, so I shan't bother.

[Gap tooth ram]

The sad part is I won't even be that upset if we lose, due to the absolute thrashing we'd get in the semis.  The quarters will all be competitive, the semi not so much, then a cracking final, where I think it will be France v Ireland.

Have a worry that the All Blacks might just have one big performance in them though, hope I'm wrong.

[Van der MoodHoover]

It's all full circle back to the very first WC for England. We were pretty poor then, but made up the numbers in the quarters.

Sadly, borthwick has not been brave. I'm pretty sure the fans would have given him a free hit but the same old faces are there.....

He briefly looked like he might have found a way to play out of necessity. But no, as soon as the suspension players were available backwards we went in selection terms.

We might just beat Fiji but would we want to pop up in the semis? The best we could hope for would be a gritty backs to the wall type defeat by 10-15 pts, relying on scoring solely through kicks.

[Comrade 86]

Hard lines for the Welsh. Had Dyer given the pass to Rees-Zaamit he goes in under the posts, but inexplicably he hung on. Chasing the game having butchered the chance to win it, young Costelow then telegraphs a pass and all of a sudden the game is over. 

No doubt they will be incredibly disappointed, but their form going into the tourney was possibly worse than England's and I think they've acquitted themselves well, all being equal. Gatland has very quickly steadied the ship and they are a young side with some very talented players coming through. Hopefully, the WRU won't continue to undermine the national game the way they have been in recent years.

Ona separate note, beating both the Welsh and the Argentinians with 14 men (13 for long periods in the Welsh match up) looks rather better now that at the time, though the Samoa game seemed a step backwards. Hard to know what to expect, though I hate the team selection in more ways than I can count. A back 3 of Smith, May and Daly terrifies me and I think I can guess the areas the Fijians will target. Mystery surrounds the absence of Arundell, but apparently Farrell feels he needed taking down a few pegs and has been doing his best to achieve that all week in training. Couldn't make it up.

 

[RadioactiveWaste]

Is that a first trip to the semis for the Pumas?

Hopefully another good show tonight in the Ireland v NZ match.

 

[BucksRam]

7 minutes ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

Is that a first trip to the semis for the Pumas?

Hopefully another good show tonight in the Ireland v NZ match.

 

Finished 3rd in 2007 so they've been here before. Well deserved on todays performance.