Alan Nixon Breaks Silence on American Billionaire Bid

[atherstoneram]

3 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

Well the Government  not only let the club get into that much debt but actually created the debt in the first place by closing the  stadium to fans. 

There are no new owners. They wlll only become liable for debts if they agree to take them on. 

        

And what happens if they don't,the club can't be kept on as a going concern as it would be trading whilst insolvent

[PistoldPete]

7 minutes ago, RAM1966 said:

I think the fans should press for there to be a full investigation on how such mismanagement of a football club can be allowed to happen and go unpunished....

Should I be punished for wasting my money on a dodgy motor? Or investing my money in a dodgy investment sold to me by a dodgy broker?

I don't like people wasting their money any more than you seem to but why should anyone be punished for buying a loss making club and not be able to make it profitable?

[PistoldPete]

1 minute ago, atherstoneram said:

And what happens if they don't,the club can't be kept on as a going concern as it would be trading whilst insolvent

So in that case HMRC gets nothing. So it needs to do a deal. Same as other creditors.   

[PistoldPete]

23 minutes ago, RAM1966 said:

Some good points but companies that go bust and continue to trade generally change there name and registration and VAT numbers at companies house.  Guess what that means we are no longer members of the EFL....  That means auromatic expulsion and down to the bottom of the Non League wood pile....

But why? Why should a name like Debenhams which has been well and truly tarnished by its owners still be able to trade as a brand but Derby county not? 

[Van der MoodHoover]

2 hours ago, Gritstone Tup said:

You’re missing a big factor off there, we’re a football club, no sympathy, to be made an example of. If not, then it could become common practice within the football industry. The precedent is already there with Bury etc mentioned above, do HMRC want to reset the precedent to make it a common thing fir football to decide how much they pay!?

 

If only Mel had the wherewithal to own dcfc through a trust based in the British Virgin Islands all would have been well.... ?

[atherstoneram]

1 minute ago, PistoldPete said:

So in that case HMRC gets nothing. So it needs to do a deal. Same as other creditors.   

Since the administrators have been in place they have had to take loans out to keep the club going,that won't have gone unnoticed by HMRC.

[PistoldPete]

17 minutes ago, jono said:

You make some great moral points but comparing a failed business to one engaging in tax avoidance isn’t really relevant.

Tax payers money isn’t being used to prop up a football club - it doesn’t need propping up .. it’s already collapsed. What we are dealing with now is the collateral damage.

I want HMRC to get as much money as they can and I also want DCFC to survive as an entity. As to the TAX .. in the end it is money that pays for schools, roads and a health service. The issue is, there isn’t as much money available as is owed. 
 

So .. back to what the Admins have been saying… they are in discussions with the HMRC and will present to them whatever prospective new owners offer. It’s mind numbingly simple for the HMRC

There isn’t enough money in any circumstances .. so HMRC have 2 choices 

1) Liquidate club and get their share from remaining assets which includes some player transfer fees which will add up to X pounds

2) Accept offer from new owners which adds up to X pounds - plus or minus .. HMRC have to figure out if there is a plus. If there is then they will accept. If there isn’t or the process looks to extended then they won’t.

We should continue to pay our fair share .. DCFC can’t because the tank is empty.
You can fine a homeless person a million quid but you won’t get it. Make me a cup of tea in this chocolate tea pot. Just won’t happen. It’s the principal of limited liability, without which not much happens. Even in a state system it goes wrong because states collapse via inflation and valueless currency when the world at large realises promises can’t be met

 

 

MSD has first charge , then I think its football cerditors and then HMRC. Someone correct me if I am wrong. In which case even if we sold our entire playing staff HMRC will only get anything at all if a buyer is found who is willing to pay something more in.

[PistoldPete]

4 minutes ago, atherstoneram said:

Since the administrators have been in place they have had to take loans out to keep the club going,that won't have gone unnoticed by HMRC.

So you think admin team should have let the club go pop? Breach the players contracts and let them all leave for free?

[atherstoneram]

1 minute ago, PistoldPete said:

MSD has first charge , then I think its football cerditors and then HMRC. Someone correct me if I am wrong. In which case even if we sold our entire playing staff HMRC will only get anything at all if a buyer is found who is willing to pay something more in.

If we sell all our playing staff HMRC collect 20% in VAT on all sales so they would still get something.

[Philmycock]

45 minutes ago, Abu Derby said:

If I were Mel I wouldn’t be able to look myself in the mirror after what he has done. The destruction of the football club that he oversaw in such a short space of time is absolutely unforgivable. 
He will be remembered as one of the worst owners in the history of British football. 

Unless he decided to pay the bill in full tomorrow, you know, for the football club close to his heart that he's loved all his life?! ? 

[atherstoneram]

2 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

So you think admin team should have let the club go pop? Breach the players contracts and let them all leave for free?

No not at all ,but administrators are brought in to make a business a going concern. if they can't do that without securing additional funding (albeit short term) then the business is not viable

[PistoldPete]

2 minutes ago, atherstoneram said:

If we sell all our playing staff HMRC collect 20% in VAT on all sales so they would still get something.

 Maybe something. Maybe not.

[PistoldPete]

2 minutes ago, atherstoneram said:

No not at all ,but administrators are brought in to make a business a going concern. if they can't do that without securing additional funding (albeit short term) then the business is not viable

It is just cash flow I think. And until a buyer is found.

[jono]

8 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

MSD has first charge , then I think its football cerditors and then HMRC. Someone correct me if I am wrong. In which case even if we sold our entire playing staff HMRC will only get anything at all if a buyer is found who is willing to pay something more in.

I know about MSD’s charge on certain fixed assets via a debenture on the stadium, but I think, from what I heard the admins say on the radio, that HMRC are high up the list or have some priority since a rule change.. I.e ahead of trade creditors. My impression ( could be wrong ! ) was that the offer any new owner made to HMRC was the critical point when it came to likely liquidation - or not .. ….. dependant on the size / attractiveness of that offer to them … This would be tied logically and relatively  to whatever HMRC think they might get if we collapse completely. 

[atherstoneram]

Just now, PistoldPete said:

 Maybe something. Maybe not.

Maybe more than the 25% which people keep on about. Depends how much the players sold for.

[PistoldPete]

1 minute ago, atherstoneram said:

Maybe more than the 25% which people keep on about. Depends how much the players sold for.

We would need about £35 million for incoming transfer fees for HMRC to get more than 25% of their debt. We wil not get anything like that, maybe as little as £10 million in total if we were to sell all our players in a hurry.    

[atherstoneram]

4 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

It is just cash flow I think. And until a buyer is found.

I hope so,i know you think i am not a fan but i have been a fan for 40 odd years and never again did i imagine the club would find itself in this situation. I just think coming out of administration nowdays is not as simple as it used to be.

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

2 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

We would need about £35 million for incoming transfer fees for HMRC to get more than 25% of their debt. We wil not get anything like that, maybe as little as £10 million in total if we were to sell all our players in a hurry.    

£10 million over time. It wouldn’t be all up front . 

[Hordh]

1 minute ago, jono said:

I know about MSD’s charge on certain fixed assets via a debenture on the stadium, but I think, from what I heard the admins say on the radio, that HMRC are high up the list or have some priority since a rule change.. I.e ahead of trade creditors. My impression ( could be wrong ! ) was that the offer any new owner made to HMRC was the critical point when it came to likely liquidation - or not .. ….. dependant on the size / attractiveness of that offer to them … This would be tied logically and relatively  to whatever HMRC think they might get if we collapse completely. 

So if any prospective buyer puts in a derisory offer then the HMRC can and probably would treat that as not being serious and push for liquidation. 

[atherstoneram]

3 minutes ago, TheresOnlyWanChope said:

£10 million over time. It wouldn’t be all up front . 

If that were to happen i would imagine the admins would want 100% payment.