Woodley Ram Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 I read in the DT that Cocu has been abused by fans and sworn at following the recent defeat at Brentford, I dont know because I was not there. What I would say is that the fans have the right to voice their dissatisfaction but in the right way and should not abuse Cocu let along swear at him. i think Cocu being at Derby is a positive thing and think he will bring great things, this will not happen overnight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MackworthRamIsGod Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 I feel sorry for Cocu. I said when the window closed and I still maintain it, if you asked him how he feels I bet he would be very disappointed. I think he expected a couple of quality signings after Rooney and the club didn't deliver. If you hire Jame Martin as your personal chef and all you have in the house is a tin of beans, dont expect him to whip up a gourmet meal, likewise, we cant expect Cocu to earn a top 6 spot with the dross we have currently in midfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampage Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 Cocu had enough money to walk out if abused so we need to look after our potentially best manager for a long time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papahet Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 He gets booed partially because he doesn’t acknowledge the supporters. The togetherness just doesn’t seem to be there like last season under Lamps and Jody- It felt like we was all in it together. Cocu seems so distant with us for some reason. Maybe he’s abit shy to bounce, but how hard can it be to come over and applaud the fans after two piss poor performances within the week? Maybe he’s hesitant after the Turkey tenure but the togetherness isn’t there whatsoever ATM. Feels so detached since FL left Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeds Ram Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 Fans have the right to be extremely frustrated and annoyed at the staff and players after such an awful display. They're professionals they know the job and they should simply get on with it and try to improve as quickly as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRam Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 3 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said: Fans have the right to be extremely frustrated and annoyed at the staff and players after such an awful display. They're professionals they know the job and they should simply get on with it and try to improve as quickly as possible. No amount of money gives anyone the right to abuse people, unless of course it's a transaction related to a seedy basement. The lack of separation between criticism and abuse in football fans is really quite jarring to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubbles Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 5 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said: Fans have the right to be extremely frustrated and annoyed at the staff and players after such an awful display. They're professionals they know the job and they should simply get on with it and try to improve as quickly as possible. Don't pish me off. Did you hear some of the stuff thats been supposedly said? and i quote: "He was sworn at and told in no uncertain terms to go back where he came from." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeds Ram Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 1 minute ago, Squid said: Don't pish me off. Did you hear some of the stuff thats been supposedly said? and i quote: "He was sworn at and told in no uncertain terms to go back where he came from." I mean a man being sworn at when walking off the pitch is what happens when you lose 3-0 and don't acknowledge the fans existence. Obviously i don't approve of saying he should 'go back to where he came from' which a certain ex manager of ours said about a player once... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeds Ram Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 5 minutes ago, SaintRam said: No amount of money gives anyone the right to abuse people, unless of course it's a transaction related to a seedy basement. The lack of separation between criticism and abuse in football fans is really quite jarring to be honest. I think shouting and swearing while attending a football match after such an awful performance is quite normal behaviour especially since emotions get so high. Obviously if they went up in the street and did it to intimidate him then that's not okay but that's not what we're talking about. The stadium is an arena where fans can voice their love, happiness and also displeasure and there is nothing wrong with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YorkshireRam Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 2 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said: I think shouting and swearing while attending a football match after such an awful performance is quite normal behaviour especially since emotions get so high. Obviously if they went up in the street and did it to intimidate him then that's not okay but that's not what we're talking about. The stadium is an arena where fans can voice their love, happiness and also displeasure and there is nothing wrong with that. We're supposed to be supporters, what part of telling our new manager to ''go back to where he came from'' is supporting the side? I hate people that shout directly at players/staff, booing after poor performances i can just about tolerate but shouting abuse seems counter-intuitive to me, we all want Derby to win but how is that gonna help us achieve anything?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenBr Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 17 minutes ago, Papahet said: He gets booed partially because he doesn’t acknowledge the supporters. The togetherness just doesn’t seem to be there like last season under Lamps and Jody- It felt like we was all in it together. Cocu seems so distant with us for some reason. Maybe he’s abit shy to bounce, but how hard can it be to come over and applaud the fans after two piss poor performances within the week? Who the **** is booing him because he doesn't come and clap the fans. Just because Lampard came and started the bounce doesn't mean every manager will be "one of the lads" like him. I would like to think most of us aren't so needy that we are going to start booing just because he's hurt our feelings by not coming over to us. You can boo the team for poor performances all you like, but there is no excuse to make it personal - especially not this. They have performed badly in two games in a row - I fail to see why you think anyone even the players would come over to applaud the fans after the abuse they received all game long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YorkshireRam Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 19 minutes ago, Papahet said: He gets booed partially because he doesn’t acknowledge the supporters. The togetherness just doesn’t seem to be there like last season under Lamps and Jody- It felt like we was all in it together. Cocu seems so distant with us for some reason. Maybe he’s abit shy to bounce, but how hard can it be to come over and applaud the fans after two piss poor performances within the week? Maybe he’s hesitant after the Turkey tenure but the togetherness isn’t there whatsoever ATM. Feels so detached since FL left I really don't get this argument, his job is our manager and chief coach, he's not here to appease or entertain the supporters, isn't that what Rammie and Ewie are for? Also, I bet the 'bounce' to him is cringeworthy and embarrassing, and it is to be honest, Lampard got away with it based on his character and youthful naivety perhaps? Cocu is clearly a different character with different managerial ideals which directly affects how he approaches the role. His focus at the minute will be on performances and getting results, i'd rather him prioritise that at the minute, rather than trying to entertain fans... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeds Ram Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 11 minutes ago, YorkshireRam said: We're supposed to be supporters, what part of telling our new manager to ''go back to where he came from'' is supporting the side? I hate people that shout directly at players/staff, booing after poor performances i can just about tolerate but shouting abuse seems counter-intuitive to me, we all want Derby to win but how is that gonna help us achieve anything?? I didn't defend telling him to 'go back to where he came from' in fact i explicitly said that's not okay. People have different ways of expressing their emotions and feelings about what it means to support the club (we're not club cocu or club keogh we're Derby county football club). People felt that Cocu and the players let down the club that day and let them know that the standard of performance simply wasn't good enough or tolerable. If you've never boo'd after a performance or shouted at a player then that's how you support the club and that's fine. I don't judge people who don't boo or shout after an awful performance but i also don't judge those who do. The fans felt the players and management let down the club and informed them of that fact and i don't see anything necessarily wrong with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubbles Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 22 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said: I mean a man being sworn at when walking off the pitch is what happens when you lose 3-0 and don't acknowledge the fans existence. Obviously i don't approve of saying he should 'go back to where he came from' which a certain ex manager of ours said about a player once... mate who listens to Nigel Clough though.. come on??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 I cant help thinking it might just change a bit when there's a couple of decent wins under his belt. Its just a frustrating time, some folk cant always keep their emotions in check, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rynny Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 I seem to be missing something? Where's the Ian Holloway article? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YorkshireRam Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 Just now, Leeds Ram said: I didn't defend telling him to 'go back to where he came from' in fact i explicitly said that's not okay. People have different ways of expressing their emotions and feelings about what it means to support the club (we're not club cocu or club keogh we're Derby county football club). People felt that Cocu and the players let down the club that day and let them know that the standard of performance simply wasn't good enough or tolerable. If you've never boo'd after a performance or shouted at a player then that's how you support the club and that's fine. I don't judge people who don't boo or shout after an awful performance but i also don't judge those who do. The fans felt the players and management let down the club and informed them of that fact and i don't see anything necessarily wrong with that. I do judge people that boo (but especially abuse), I think they're not particularly logical individuals... surely a raucous display of positive noise at the beginning of a 2nd half would inspire the players more than disgruntled booing? At full time, booing might be okay but targeting individuals is pathetic. Anyone that has played competitive sport at any level knows that off-days happen when things just don't quite click, individually or collectively, that obviously happens to Derby too but I just don't see how spouting negativity has any productive impact at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angieram Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 Just to set the record straight about Cocu at Brentford. At the end of the match he led the walk across the pitch right in front of the away fans and he was applauding us all the way. Of course he was booed and sworn at by some. I think he did this to deflect some of that abuse away from the players. They also came up to the away fans and applauded us - luckily by then there were far fewer of us in the ground and so their reception was a bit better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeds Ram Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 11 minutes ago, YorkshireRam said: I do judge people that boo (but especially abuse), I think they're not particularly logical individuals... surely a raucous display of positive noise at the beginning of a 2nd half would inspire the players more than disgruntled booing? At full time, booing might be okay but targeting individuals is pathetic. Anyone that has played competitive sport at any level knows that off-days happen when things just don't quite click, individually or collectively, that obviously happens to Derby too but I just don't see how spouting negativity has any productive impact at all? We have very different perspectives on this. So people who boo and shout are stupid now? The actual feeling which booing and shouting represents is one of frustration because they actually care a lot. They generally feel let down that representatives of our club have been absolutely shocking and simply have not performed to the minimum standard. Most fans that I know can accept the odd off day where things don't quite seem to click but that wasn't the brentford performance.. It was an absolute shambles from beginning to end and it could easily have ended up 5 or 6-0. Even the manager said the players were arrogant and basically didn't try hard enough first half. That's not just a matter of not 'quite clicking'. Well on the stream I was watching all i could hear both halves were the Derby fans getting behind the team which didn't seem to do much good... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YorkshireRam Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 15 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said: We have very different perspectives on this. So people who boo and shout are stupid now? The actual feeling which booing and shouting represents is one of frustration because they actually care a lot. They generally feel let down that representatives of our club have been absolutely shocking and simply have not performed to the minimum standard. Most fans that I know can accept the odd off day where things don't quite seem to click but that wasn't the brentford performance.. It was an absolute shambles from beginning to end and it could easily have ended up 5 or 6-0. Even the manager said the players were arrogant and basically didn't try hard enough first half. That's not just a matter of not 'quite clicking'. Well on the stream I was watching all i could hear both halves were the Derby fans getting behind the team which didn't seem to do much good... I think the fundamental misunderstanding might be with you. I very carefully chose my wording so as not say stupid or unintelligent, just a lack of comprehension as to how they vent their frustration and how it impacts the players and subsequent performances I get massively frustrated and was seething after the brentford game, it just never seemed sensible to berate the players or staff as a way of venting. Ultimately I want the team to be as successful as possible and to me, keeping that frustration to myself and getting some perspective (early in the season, critical injuries, still adapting etc) just seems more productive than trying to abuse our own team in the heat of the moment... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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