Penalty or Not?

[Phuket Ram]

4 hours ago, Ramitupper said:

Harrison swept Bogle's left leg - although it was slight, there was contact and it was enough to bring the player down. The acid test being if it had happened anywhere else on the pitch it would have been a foul, ergo penalty would have been the right decision.

Of course, the referee eventually awarded a free kick to Leeds for Bogle's "foul" on Harrison. So the better question is - was it a foul by Bogle? The answer to that is no. So, still, a penalty would have been the correct decision. Both officials (and some pundits too) - got it wrong. 

[bigbadbob]

24 minutes ago, ossieram said:

Chelsea was the week after and the idiots didn't realise we had been moved and they were throwing seats down on their own.

And I agree most clubs had their mobs back in the 80's, Only a few would lob down wooden seats with metal brackets into an area of the ground where woman and kids could be, and going by the antics of some of yours yesterday that tried to attack the Neptune pub and then had a go by the fanzone outside the ground, they are still stuck in the 80's. 

What happened at the neptune?

[ossieram]

9 minutes ago, bigbadbob said:

What happened at the neptune?

 

I wasn't there but was told by 4 different people that a mob of Leeds tried to attack the pub. I've seen a couple of pictures posted up on facebook from inside the pub and will see if I can find them.

Just seen the pictures again and it shows the police and plenty of people outside the pub, but it's not clear who's who.

[europia]

Yes it was a penalty. The Linesman decided to get in the spotlight and implement his own version of VAR. The ref should have stuck with his decision, so poor refereeing in my opinion.  

[Bob The Badger]

23 minutes ago, The middle man said:

The ref wasn't influenced by any West Yorkshire scum dogs, he was influenced by his linesman who called him over instantly.

If he was influenced by the West Yorkshire scum dogs, then he was equally as influenced by Keogh throwing his arms about and generally having a big paddy.

Yeh and if you were a Derby fan and a regular in here, you'd know I'm 90% tongue-in-cheek.

In any case, the ref has the final decision. If no Leeds players had surrounded him, you know what? Well yeh, he may have overruled a subordinate.

In any case, what are you trying to achieve here exactly?

It's amazing how many fans of other teams come in here proclaiming their objectiveness only to get all defensive.

Seriously, what do you want? 

[Bob The Badger]

27 minutes ago, Inglorius said:

If you review the match footage again the linesman was straight in the refs ear.

Who gives a poo? 

The ref should not have awarded a penalty if he wasn't sure.

He should have stopped the game and asked the linesman.

The fact is, he did award a penalty.

Why did he do that, if he hadn't seen the incident clearly enough?

That isn't how you're meant to referee. 

I'm on the fence of whether it was or wasn't, but I'm not on the fence with the way the officials dealt with it.

That was an utter cluster and amateurish at best.

[Inglorius]

4 minutes ago, Bob The Badger said:

Who gives a poo? 

The ref should not have awarded a penalty if he wasn't sure.

He should have stopped the game and asked the linesman.

The fact is, he did award a penalty.

Why did he do that, if he hadn't seen the incident clearly enough?

That isn't how you're meant to referee. 

I'm on the fence of whether it was or wasn't, but I'm not on the fence with the way the officials dealt with it.

That was an utter cluster and amateurish at best.

You've overlooked my original point which was that the referee wasn't influenced by the Leeds players but by the linesman immediately in his ear. This was in response to your original post.  

I agree that the way it was officiated was bizarre at best.

[The middle man]

9 minutes ago, Bob The Badger said:

Yeh and if you were a Derby fan and a regular in here, you'd know I'm 90% tongue-in-cheek.

In any case, the ref has the final decision. If no Leeds players had surrounded him, you know what? Well yeh, he may have overruled a subordinate.

In any case, what are you trying to achieve here exactly?

It's amazing how many fans of other teams come in here proclaiming their objectiveness only to get all defensive.

Seriously, what do you want? 

I came on to see what the views were of Derby fans of yesterdays game involving our teams.

I then couldn't resist replying to what were in my opinion some ridiculous comments.

And here we are.

BTW, there were as many Derby players surrounding him as Leeds players, watch it again with the impartial glasses on.

[Shorty389]

3 minutes ago, The middle man said:

I came on to see what the views were of Derby fans of yesterdays game involving our teams.

I then couldn't resist replying to what were in my opinion some ridiculous comments.

And here we are.

BTW, there were as many Derby players surrounding him as Leeds players, watch it again with the impartial glasses on.

The difference being that the Derby players walked away when he went to talk to the linesman, whereas at least 2 Leeds players followed 

[The middle man]

10 minutes ago, Bob The Badger said:

Who gives a poo? 

The ref should not have awarded a penalty if he wasn't sure.

He should have stopped the game and asked the linesman.

The fact is, he did award a penalty.

Why did he do that, if he hadn't seen the incident clearly enough?

That isn't how you're meant to referee. 

I'm on the fence of whether it was or wasn't, but I'm not on the fence with the way the officials dealt with it.

That was an utter cluster and amateurish at best.

And if you want to watch a good example of players surrounding a referee and trying to influence him, check out your lot after the Klich "head butt".

 

[DavesaRam]

Johnny come lately here - I missed the match because of a training course, and then babysitting grandchildren in Grimsby who don't have Sky. Apart from that, a great Saturday! I have only seen some highlights, so can't comment too much, but definite penalty, and although it wasn't the whole team, the ref was surrounded with some very threatening and intimidating behaviour, especially the Leeds keeper. I think Derby are unique in that we are the only team to be punished for intimidating the ref, even though loads of teams do it. 

To me the defender took Bogle's leg away, so it was a penalty, but why should he give us yet another penalty> We've had 5 this season already, that should be plenty for any team, except every other team besides Derby. Has anyone counted up how many absolute stonewall penalties we have been denied This season? Given that our penalty conversion rate is 100%, that is a lot of goals due to us, and a lot of better results due to us. Maybe in all honesty we shouldn't even be in the pay-offs/ We shoud already be in the automatics.

BUT: when your performance is as flat as a fart, none of this matters, because you don't deserve anything from the match. With a stadium which has a high proportion of fans who would lose their jobs if they keep churning out inept performances like that they would be sacked, to see players who are paid an absolute fortune for merely playing games getting away with it with impunity is somewhat galling. Yet we are supposed to show our undying, undiluted support and commitment. Commitment is a two-way street, so lets see some balls and application please.

That is also true for Lampard and Morris, who made a right hash of tactics and personnel. I am amazed at what they have achieved this season, and am not worried about if we get to the final or not because of what they have achieved. But we can't keep simply handing the points over as we have done several times this season.

Lets hope we simply go for it with everything we've got, because we have nothing to lose at all on Wednesday. Above all I want us to beat those dirty, cheating ghouls-of-Revie.

[The middle man]

1 minute ago, Shorty389 said:

The difference being that the Derby players walked away when he went to talk to the linesman, whereas at least 2 Leeds players followed 

"2 Leeds players followed" - Wow.

And how would these 2 following Leeds players of influenced what they were discussing?

You see this kind of stuff in just about every game of football, its hardly crime of the century is it.

 

[Bob The Badger]

3 minutes ago, Inglorius said:

You've overlooked my original point which was that the referee wasn't influenced by the Leeds players but by the linesman immediately in his ear. This was in response to your original post.  

I agree that the way it was officiated was bizarre at best.

How do you know he wasn't influenced?

You have no clue what the linesman said, what the Leeds players said or what the referee was thinking.

And you missed my point too.

If you wasn't sure, wtf did he blow?

And if he was sure, wtf did he allow outside influences to sway his opinion.

 

[The middle man]

3 minutes ago, DavesaRam said:

Johnny come lately here - I missed the match because of a training course, and then babysitting grandchildren in Grimsby who don't have Sky. Apart from that, a great Saturday! I have only seen some highlights, so can't comment too much, but definite penalty, and although it wasn't the whole team, the ref was surrounded with some very threatening and intimidating behaviour, especially the Leeds keeper. I think Derby are unique in that we are the only team to be punished for intimidating the ref, even though loads of teams do it. 

To me the defender took Bogle's leg away, so it was a penalty, but why should he give us yet another penalty> We've had 5 this season already, that should be plenty for any team, except every other team besides Derby. Has anyone counted up how many absolute stonewall penalties we have been denied This season? Given that our penalty conversion rate is 100%, that is a lot of goals due to us, and a lot of better results due to us. Maybe in all honesty we shouldn't even be in the pay-offs/ We shoud already be in the automatics.

BUT: when your performance is as flat as a fart, none of this matters, because you don't deserve anything from the match. With a stadium which has a high proportion of fans who would lose their jobs if they keep churning out inept performances like that they would be sacked, to see players who are paid an absolute fortune for merely playing games getting away with it with impunity is somewhat galling. Yet we are supposed to show our undying, undiluted support and commitment. Commitment is a two-way street, sets see some balls and application please.

That is also true for Lampard and Morris, who made a right hash of tactics and personnel. I am amazed at what they have achieved this season, and am not worried about if we get to the final or not because of what they have achieved. But we can't keep simply handing the points over as we have done several times this season.

Lets hope we simply go for it with everything we've got, because we have nothing to lose at all on Wednesday. Above all I want us to beat that dirty, cheating ghouls-of-Revie.

Seriously fella, what replays are you watching? seriously?

There is zero contact, ZERO, Harrison gets a slither on the ball.

Is there a way to post video in here?

[toddy]

Makes no difference whether it was a pen or not. 

It was not given.

And has no bearing on the poor Derby performance.

[Bob The Badger]

3 minutes ago, The middle man said:

And if you want to watch a good example of players surrounding a referee and trying to influence him, check out your lot after the Klich "head butt".

 

Well, my not-so-bright friend, TV CLEARLY showed that Klich headbutted Tomori, there was no doubt. None.

However, the penalty is/was in doubt, even after ad nauseam replays. 

Klich would have had a straight red if the ref didn't foolishly turn his back to run away. And the moron deserved a straight red too.

And btw, I am old school, one of the reasons I dislike Wilson if for his incessant diving and over reacting

Leeds clearly were the better team yesterday and should probably have won by more, but you are a classic example of why most of the country detest Leeds.

The corrupt Don Revie helped with starting and stoking that fire, but you continue to pour petrol on it.

Good work fella!

 

[Bob The Badger]

4 minutes ago, toddy said:

Makes no difference whether it was a pen or not. 

It was not given.

And has no bearing on the poor Derby performance.

Yeh actually, it was given.

But no, it had no impact on an abject performance from Derby.

[The middle man]

3 minutes ago, Bob The Badger said:

Well, my not-so-bright friend, TV CLEARLY showed that Klich headbutted Tomori, there was no doubt. None.

However, the penalty is/was in doubt, even after ad nauseam replays. 

Klich would have had a straight red if the ref didn't foolishly turn his back to run away. And the moron deserved a straight red too.

And btw, I am old school, one of the reasons I dislike Wilson if for his incessant diving and over reacting

Leeds clearly were the better team yesterday and should probably have won by more, but you are a classic example of why most of the country detest Leeds.

The corrupt Don Revie helped with starting and stoking that fire, but you continue to pour petrol on it.

Good work fella!

 

Come on then, what is it Ive said that makes me a "classic example of why most the country detest Leeds".

Having a different opinion to you? Pointing out where I think certain people may be wrong?

What?

[VulcanRam]

The behaviour of the referee to me looked like he blew too early, was worried he'd made a mistake and used the linesman as a get out of jail card. 

Of course I wanted it to be a penalty. But I would not have been happy at all if it had been given against us had the tables been turned. Close call either way.

The ref has caused this. He should only have blown if he was sure, which he quite obviously wasn't. If he thinks its a penalty having seen it from where he was, and blows to signal it, which he did, nothing the linesman says should make a difference. 

 

[The middle man]

8 minutes ago, VulcanRam said:

The behaviour of the referee to me looked like he blew too early, was worried he'd made a mistake and used the linesman as a get out of jail card. 

Of course I wanted it to be a penalty. But I would not have been happy at all if it had been given against us had the tables been turned. Close call either way.

The ref has caused this. He should only have blown if he was sure, which he quite obviously wasn't. If he thinks its a penalty having seen it from where he was, and blows to signal it, which he did, nothing the linesman says should make a difference. 

 

Pretty much spot on.