dcfcfan1 Posted September 29, 2016 Share Posted September 29, 2016 Mels has ****** up I have given up on us going up the same way I have given up on dating women Hahahhaa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lokidoki Posted September 29, 2016 Share Posted September 29, 2016 8 minutes ago, dcfcfan1 said: I have given up on us going up the same way I have given up on dating women then it's the "w" word for you then.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssendonRam Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 On 28 September 2016 at 18:18, ITSD said: Good to see a sensible post. The only point I disagree with you on is the appointment of Pearson- it never looked like it would work out, and I think Mel bowed to fan pressure, which I thought was a mistake at the time. I can barely think of a worse criticism of an owner than bowing to the fans' pressure. Sadly, it has been a concern I have had for quite some time now; over McClaren, over Clement, and now over Pearson (although in the precise opposite way to how you mean it.) If he is reacting to the white noise from the fans, then he will never succeed for Derby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddy Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 7 hours ago, reveldevil said: Radio Derby. If the 'altercation' involved Mel and Nigel, why the need for a suspension and investigation? Because of it being so volatile and so close to punches being thrown. I am quoting Ian Dowie, Danny Murphy, Jim White here. It has also been mentioned in The Mail, The Guardian, before this post gets deleted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcfcfan1 Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 7 hours ago, Lokidoki said: then it's the "w" word for you then.... Im used to that by now hahaha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StantonRam Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 4 hours ago, EssendonRam said: I can barely think of a worse criticism of an owner than bowing to the fans' pressure. Sadly, it has been a concern I have had for quite some time now; over McClaren, over Clement, and now over Pearson (although in the precise opposite way to how you mean it.) If he is reacting to the white noise from the fans, then he will never succeed for Derby. Mel is a fan who has money and power. The upsides (investment, passion, commitment, visible public figurehead etc) and downsides (getting too personally involved, capriciousness, tendency to panic etc) have been well highlighted in this thread. Having a fan as owner is like each seat at the iPro having electronic buttons so that fans can vote after the match on different issues e.g. Stay or Go? 442 or 433? Stick or Twist? Snog/Marry/Avoid? etc. If that had been the case, with the results being immediately followed by action, the outcome would have been pretty much the same as Mel's actions. When we panic so does he. When we point out, rightly, that Hughes is not Thorne and that 433 works better for us than 442, within a few games it comes to pass, even at the price of getting rid of/paying off yet another manager. It's a cliché, but 'be careful what you wish for because you might just get it'. We have an owner who thinks like us, and it has proved to be a mixed blessing. The thing about Mel is that he's not going anywhere, so any incoming manager should know very well what they are taking on and who runs the show, and if they can't work with that then best not to apply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuffLuff Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 13 hours ago, G STAR RAM said: So when makes a call it is HIS decision but when he invests millions it is OURS? Well, no, because that's not what I was saying at all. I think it's a little harsh to extract that one bit from my overall point as well? My point was that the last two permanent appointments have been the wrong. Now when one was sacked and the other currently suspended, is that the wrong conclusion to make? As I said before hindsight is glorious on these matters, but these mistakes end up costing a lot of money. In pay offs, transfers of players from the regime who might not now fit etc etc not to mention how far it can set back your club for the season. Yes there is misfortune, and many fans would say Pearson and Clement were the ones they wanted but fans do not have the insight into the club (or the wage) to make that complete decision. Surely we should be identifying the risks, potential effect on players/staff etc and seeing whether it's worth it? As I originally put, just because he's put money into the club doesn't mean he shouldn't take any of the brunt as he put those people in those positions. There's a difference of investment and sensible investment. But as I said originally i am playing devils advocate, a little at least. A lot of what has happened at Derby has been out of his control and he's had to make decisions. My point is just born from the situation that it seems to be more turmoil that has followed us since the last days of mclaren. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ewe Ram Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 On 28/09/2016 at 11:08, JaguarRam said: I could listen all day but I have never, ever understood the criticism of Mel. I hope he is our chairman for many, many years to come and I if I met him I would thank him for his contribution to the club. Well said. I for one have seen this season, yes after only 9 games, attendances dropping, booing from the stands, a team of square pegs in round holes, bottom of the league position. I assume all these saying he's trigger happy wanted that to carry on. Not me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 1 hour ago, TuffLuff said: Well, no, because that's not what I was saying at all. I think it's a little harsh to extract that one bit from my overall point as well? My point was that the last two permanent appointments have been the wrong. Now when one was sacked and the other currently suspended, is that the wrong conclusion to make? As I said before hindsight is glorious on these matters, but these mistakes end up costing a lot of money. In pay offs, transfers of players from the regime who might not now fit etc etc not to mention how far it can set back your club for the season. Yes there is misfortune, and many fans would say Pearson and Clement were the ones they wanted but fans do not have the insight into the club (or the wage) to make that complete decision. Surely we should be identifying the risks, potential effect on players/staff etc and seeing whether it's worth it? As I originally put, just because he's put money into the club doesn't mean he shouldn't take any of the brunt as he put those people in those positions. There's a difference of investment and sensible investment. But as I said originally i am playing devils advocate, a little at least. A lot of what has happened at Derby has been out of his control and he's had to make decisions. My point is just born from the situation that it seems to be more turmoil that has followed us since the last days of mclaren. Sorry if I mis-read your point. On the point of what it has cost the club to get rid of these managers, I don't think either of their successors (Clement and Pearson) could complain about lack of transfer funds or wage budgets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Teale Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 You could argue that Mel realized that he had made a big mistake in employing Pearson and instead off just sitting there was strong enough to make the change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ram1964 Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 On 28/09/2016 at 09:43, jono said: Mrs Hemsley actually said "we don't pay taxes, taxes are for little people" .....and she ended up in prison .. For tax evasion. of course it does depend on how you define rich, but in the UK the Richest 10% of the population pay more than 50% of all tax revenue so, demonstrably the rich pay tax. just saying. I pay my taxes ? am not rich,and thrn continue to pay stealth taxes 70%+ tax petrol,70%tax cigarettes,20 % vat on literally everything. To say the rich dont pay taxes,I would say i would be rich if i didnt psy my taxs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 43 minutes ago, ram1964 said: I pay my taxes ? am not rich,and thrn continue to pay stealth taxes 70%+ tax petrol,70%tax cigarettes,20 % vat on literally everything. To say the rich dont pay taxes,I would say i would be rich if i didnt psy my taxs Ahhh but would you be rich ? .. If no one paid taxes they would be paying to mend their cars every 5 minutes because roads would be even worse than they are already. And you would have to pay someone to teach your children or mend your broken leg. You'd also end up buying a gun and paying a builder to put a wall round your house to protect you and yours from n'er do wells. regardless of anything else, governments need tax revenue to provide universal needs in an efficent organised way. Now the belief as to how well that is done and the fairness of the tax burden placed on us by differing groups is called... politics i do t think the tax on road fuel is a stealth tax .. It's really clever .. You use the road you pay the tax based on your usage. If you are rich enough to afford and enjoy a gas guzzler fair doos but you pay more by virtue of its guzzling... There is no escape .. Pretty fair and sensible to me AND cheap and easy to collect. If you do a lot of miles and HAVE to travel then buy an ecobox and encourage innovators to produce frugal machines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddy Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 7 hours ago, emjlc02 said: You could argue that Mel realized that he had made a big mistake in employing Pearson and instead off just sitting there was strong enough to make the change. Well he was the right man last Friday. Remember to was not for football reasons Pearson got suspended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t'oldu Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 And the Telegraph agent now says he made the story about managers up ..................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddy Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 1 minute ago, t'oldu said: And the Telegraph agent now says he made the story about managers up ..................... Nothing to do with the Telegraph, the original story was out within an hour or so after Pearson's suspension. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philmycock Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 9 hours ago, emjlc02 said: You could argue that Mel realized that he had made a big mistake in employing Pearson and instead off just sitting there was strong enough to make the change. Which is great, but he can't keep doing it every season, one day he needs to make the correct appointment and just crack on with it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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