t'oldu Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 He's already looking and sounding pretty fraught and saying things that sound familiar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 He's already looking and sounding pretty fraught and saying things that sound familiar.It's not as easy when you take over relegation fodder, rather than a team that's been slowly building and balancing the books under a solid, if unimpressive manager. I'm sure it's just a blip, but I'd be pretty much certain that if they had relegation on the cards with 5-8 games to go, they'll go down. It surely won't come to that though. Jokes aside they've got a good squad, a good manager and should be more than capable of solid top half finish. Fun fact though, anything but a win in their next game will see them have a worse start than we had in 2007-08. Too bad for them they don't have a Newcastle to face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAT Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 I would argue that the fans reluctance to accept his answers and refusal to adapt his tactics to the injuries which made his job untenable. If McClaren had the full backing of the fans he would still be here today and possibly in a better position than we are currently. The last few months of the season were an embarrassment from the fans, the whole atmosphere around the club changed from what was the best period this club has seen since Jim Smith.I think part of the bad performance was also due to players confidence in their ability. Yes the fans didn't help here but I also think the coaching staff as a whole were partly to blame here.Like any relationship that turns bad, it's not down to one person!I think based on the end of last season, we needed to move on from the last two seasons of failings, so I think the coaching staff and club had to separate for this to be done. And as we've now seen, fresh playing staff is needed too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 What part of him only ever rejecting them when their own survival in the Premier League seems complex? It's clear why he stayed until after that. What doesn't make sense would be the club sacking him if he wanted stay and had no intention of going to Newcastle at all. If McClaren had turned down an approach from them after the season, that would have been an entirely different matter, but he didn't. He only turned them down while they were staring relegation in the face. You again go on to claim that he was sacked for results. We don't know that, that is just speculation. Him being sacked for either the results, or because he refused to commit to the club for the following season in the post season meeting with the club management both make equal sense, and I'd suspect it was a bit of both. The fact that he left after a meeting with the owners, and there being much talk that Newcastle didn't want to pay compensation, but would continue to chase him over the summer, the idea that he was sacked so they could replace him then, rather than weeks out from the season would make sense. i've not once said he was sacked for results. Mel Morris said he would have stayed. If that's not good enough for you then fine. It's enough for me though. I've said that his heart had already gone North East and that I understand why he was sacked. I enjoyed his time here too much to start wishing failure on him. The guy got offered his dream job and wanted to take it. I'm not that arsed about that. I don't care that much who comes and goes. I just care about what happens on the pitch.I don't get why people wish failure on him. I don't get a sense of betrayal. I'd like to see him do well at his dream job. He was good for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 i've not once said he was sacked for results. Mel Morris said he would have stayed. If that's not good enough for you then fine. It's enough for me though. I've said that his heart had already gone North East and that I understand why he was sacked. I enjoyed his time here too much to start wishing failure on him. The guy got offered his dream job and wanted to take it. I'm not that arsed about that. I don't care that much who comes and goes. I just care about what happens on the pitch.I don't get why people wish failure on him. I don't get a sense of betrayal. I'd like to see him do well at his dream job. He was good for us. ...where did Mel Morris say he would have stayed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 ...where did Mel Morris say he would have stayed? The canteen at Moor Farm when we got invited up.I'm not saying McClaren didn't want to go to Newcastle or that he didn't contribute to unrest (although the fan meltdown went to a level that probably delighted and surprised the media). But he was set to stay on. Derby reviewed everything though and judging by Clements slip and the way Mac was hired in the first place, I'd imagine they'd already settled on Clement at a time when they were unsure of Mac's intentions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Kevin Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 The dividing line between success and failure is very small ,Steve was / is a good coach but he does not possess the mental strength to be a manager .Also there are many good managers who get get a team so far, but not promoted. I believe there is a certain skill to getting a team over the line some would say luck but it's definitely an art.There is also a case to be made that some managers as well as players are a good fit at one club but not another .I always felt that SM was a good fit at Derby and he may well come to regret the move in time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 The canteen at Moor Farm when we got invited up.I'm not saying McClaren didn't want to go to Newcastle or that he didn't contribute to unrest (although the fan meltdown went to a level that probably delighted and surprised the media). But he was set to stay on. Derby reviewed everything though and judging by Clements slip and the way Mac was hired in the first place, I'd imagine they'd already settled on Clement at a time when they were unsure of Mac's intentionsI'd really have liked to have heard that exchange then. It's just being third hand though, I'd not throw too much weight into it. As much as I hated the fan meltdown, it's not really the business to complain about it in. I don't know, at some level I hope McClaren didn't go to that meeting with them already having had their mind made up. As I've said before, I don't doubt that what happened at the end of last season played a part in the club making the decision as they did, but equally I think their continued uncertainly played a major role. If McClaren had shown up and declared his unconditional support and desire to stay on, and completely ruled out leaving to them, I'd think they'd have given him the chance to take the club forward this season. I of course don't know if that's the case though. At the very least we can agree that the club moved quickly. It's an interesting point though, how much of Nigel's sacking was echoed in McClaren's? I'd hope the club have a shortlist on hand of possible future coaches at all times, but equally I kind of hope that Nigel's fate wasn't already sealed when the players walked out onto the pitch against Forest. With the McClaren situation I'd honestly be shocked if they hadn't had a few coaches already sounded out, including a backup incase Clement decided to not come here, but I'd be horrified if McClaren's fate was decided before that meeting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 Come on Albert, wake up man. You seriously think clubs don't sound out managers before sacking the current one? It would be madness to sack your manager then think right chaps grab a notepad and let's get brainstorming...the kind of thing Fawaz does. Act then think later.I would bet my left testicle Clement had verbally agreed before McClaren went, only reason it took so long to announce was his situation at Real needed tying up first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 Come on Albert, wake up man. You seriously think clubs don't sound out managers before sacking the current one? It would be madness to sack your manager then think right chaps grab a notepad and let's get brainstorming...the kind of thing Fawaz does. Act then think later.I would bet my left testicle Clement had verbally agreed before McClaren went, only reason it took so long to announce was his situation at Real needed tying up first.I what point did I say they'd not have someone sounded out? I even said that. "With the McClaren situation I'd honestly be shocked if they hadn't had a few coaches already sounded out, including a backup incase Clement decided to not come here, but I'd be horrified if McClaren's fate was decided before that meeting. " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 I what point did I say they'd not have someone sounded out? I even said that. "With the McClaren situation I'd honestly be shocked if they hadn't had a few coaches already sounded out, including a backup incase Clement decided to not come here, but I'd be horrified if McClaren's fate was decided before that meeting. "Talking about this bit..."but I'd be horrified if McClaren's fate was decided before that meeting." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 Talking about this bit..."but I'd be horrified if McClaren's fate was decided before that meeting."Ah. So I'm guessing Mel told you that he'd laughed all the way to the meeting, as he'd decided to sack McClaren prior to it. I would be surprised if they hadn't already settled on McClaren, but again, I'd hope that McClaren still had a chance to save himself going in there, as otherwise the meeting served no purpose but as an exercise in dragging him there to sack him. From memory McClaren was on holiday at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 Ah. So I'm guessing Mel told you that he'd laughed all the way to the meeting, as he'd decided to sack McClaren prior to it. At what point did I say that?I would be surprised if they hadn't already settled on McClaren, but again, I'd hope that McClaren still had a chance to save himself going in there, as otherwise the meeting served no purpose but as an exercise in dragging him there to sack him. From memory McClaren was on holiday at the time. With some of the ways managers have been sacked and players released recently though text, over the phone, by email, dragging him into a meeting seems quite professional.I think and this is my theory, Sam got the Clement deal done, club didn't want to mess around, removed McClaren straight away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 At what point did I say that?With some of the ways managers have been sacked and players released recently though text, over the phone, by email, dragging him into a meeting seems quite professional.I think and this is my theory, Sam got the Clement deal done, club didn't want to mess around, removed McClaren straight away.I find it interesting how much disagreement there can be when essentially the central core of all our ideas of what happened amounts to roughly the same in the end. As I've said before, rightly or wrongly the club moved quickly at a time of uncertainty. Some have hard feelings towards McClaren, some don't. I expect in the next year or two we may slowly gain a better idea of the specifics of what happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leon the ram 2009 Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 He brought me the most exciting and upbeat football at Derby I had seen for years, but then he ruined it, through greed, Derby gave him his start "twice" the first time he left i totally understand, because his career blossomed, the second coming was awesome for a season but his departure is shrouded in ill feeling which he brought on himself, his head was turned, he lost the dressing room because he wasn't COMMITTED to Derby County..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie Posted September 16, 2015 Share Posted September 16, 2015 He brought me the most exciting and upbeat football at Derby I had seen for years, but then he ruined it, through greed, Derby gave him his start "twice" the first time he left i totally understand, because his career blossomed, the second coming was awesome for a season but his departure is shrouded in ill feeling which he brought on himself, his head was turned, he lost the dressing room because he wasn't COMMITTED to Derby County.....How could anyone lose a dressing room?It's a big thing with hooks on the wall, down the corridor on the left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyinLiverpool Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 Given McClaren's inability to stop our decline at the end of last season, I do wonder how he's going to drag Newcastle off the bottom.That's 'wonder' not 'care'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
needles Posted September 19, 2015 Share Posted September 19, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosmic Posted September 19, 2015 Share Posted September 19, 2015 Eeesh, down 2-0 at home to a promoted team. I think I can hear the half-time boos from here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derbados Posted September 19, 2015 Share Posted September 19, 2015 Oh dear, he's not going to make it to Christmas at this rate, be careful what you wish for Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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