Keogh vs Shackell

[ramesses]

That was never an option. Who was going to pay for this? You?

With Barker out for the season I don’t see why ‘both’ wasn’t an option.

If…Clough wanted both Shackell and Keogh in the squad then the owners should have backed him. Two quality championship CBs with decent back up shouldn’t be beyond a championship club owned by extremely wealthy individuals - and it wouldn’t have turned us into Portsmouth or Rangers.

I also don’t get the argument that you can’t criticise the board’s spending because it’s not your money to spend. If you can criticise the manager without coaching badges and criticise players without ever having played professional football then you can criticise the level of investment in the squad without first being a multimillionaire willing to dip into your own pocket to help fund squad improvements.

[MuespachRam]

With Barker out for the season I don’t see why ‘both’ wasn’t an option.

If…Clough wanted both Shackell and Keogh in the squad then the owners should have backed him. Two quality championship CBs with decent back up shouldn’t be beyond a championship club owned by extremely wealthy individuals - and it wouldn’t have turned us into Portsmouth or Rangers.

I also don’t get the argument that you can’t criticise the board’s spending because it’s not your money to spend. If you can criticise the manager without coaching badges and criticise players without ever having played professional football then you can criticise the level of investment in the squad without first being a multimillionaire willing to dip into your own pocket to help fund squad improvements.

Clough DIDN'T want Shackell at the club, no one did. Hence why he was marched out....and good riddance. It had nothign to do with money and nothign to do with football.......

[Ramshankered]

Clough DIDN'T want Shackell at the club, no one did. Hence why he was marched out....and good riddance. It had nothign to do with money and nothign to do with football.......

I would beg to differ - I reckon Clough probably wanted both players at the club! What sane manager wouldn't want to keep your most consistent defender and joint top goal scorer? It just happens that an "alleged personal feud" probably mean't both their positions became untenable.

Not sure you should be projected your feelings towards Shackell onto Clough there. At the end of the day, schnitzel happens, the club has moved on & Clough has dealt with it as best as he could.

[Guest]

I would beg to differ - I reckon Clough probably wanted both players at the club! What sane manager wouldn't want to keep your most consistent defender and joint top goal scorer? It just happens that an "alleged personal feud" probably mean't both their positions became untenable.

Not sure you should be projected your feelings towards Shackell onto Clough there. At the end of the day, schnitzel happens, the club has moved on & Clough has dealt with it as best as he could.

An alledged feud denied in an open letter by Davies's Dad, yet it still does the rounds, same as commons season before that, some fans just cant accept that players have to be moved on for finances etc....

Given the gutter press here, if there was even a sniff of anything it would be splashed all over the papers, yet all we have is somebody who makes a rumour up believed by a few.

[Animal is a Ram]

This argument is irrelevant - we don't have Shackell, we have Keogh.

[Stive Pesley]

Now the season is drawing to a close we might want to resurrect this thread for closure.

 

Both players have pretty much completed a full season – ever-present in the team, so a good time to do a like-for-like comparison

 

My view would be that Keogh has definitely been an improvement on Shackell (not just defensively but he's also scored more goals), so that equates good business by the club.

[RodleyRam]

I like Keogh, he seems to fit better with the kind of football we're looking to play and seems to have bonded well into the squad.

 

I think Shackell is perhaps a little more dominant defensively but he was fortunate to have more consistent partners than Keogh has over the course of the season. We also played a bit more of a conservative style last season, which helped to keep the defense a bit tighter than this season.

 

Keogh has possibly made more obvious defensive errors but over all I think he's the better player and will continue to improve next season with a regular partner, be that a fit Bucko, new singing or Barker when he's back. Keogh is first choice for me of all our centre halves, including Barker.

[Ambitious]

I like Keogh, he seems to fit better with the kind of football we're looking to play and seems to have bonded well into the squad.

 

I think Shackell is perhaps a little more dominant defensively but he was fortunate to have more consistent partners than Keogh has over the course of the season. We also played a bit more of a conservative style last season, which helped to keep the defense a bit tighter than this season.

 

Keogh has possibly made more obvious defensive errors but over all I think he's the better player and will continue to improve next season with a regular partner, be that a fit Bucko, new singing or Barker when he's back. Keogh is first choice for me of all our centre halves, including Barker.

 

That couldn't be further from the truth - surely? 

 

Keogh has played with Buxton for the most part of the season - O'Brien a little.

 

Shack started out with O'Brien, then Buxton, then Barker, then Buxton again. 

 

For what it's worth - I'd have 2011/2012 Shackell over 2012/2013 Keogh, BUT, would Keogh has out-performed Shackell this season for what I can tell by Burnley fans.

[DcFc Dyycheee]

I think Shackell is a better defender, but never had the passion Keogh has + Shackell is 3-4 years older.

Overall, I'm happy we sold Shackell to get Keogh, wish we had both though 

[RodleyRam]

That couldn't be further from the truth - surely? 

 

Keogh has played with Buxton for the most part of the season - O'Brien a little.

 

Shack started out with O'Brien, then Buxton, then Barker, then Buxton again. 

 

For what it's worth - I'd have 2011/2012 Shackell over 2012/2013 Keogh, BUT, would Keogh has out-performed Shackell this season for what I can tell by Burnley fans.

 

Maybe my memory is out but I thought Shackell had O'brien for a long stint of games, then Bucko for a few and then Barker for a long stint of games but yeh Barker got injured so probably you're right.

 

Keogh seems to have had Bucko, O'connor, O'brien, Brayford all chopping and changing until recently when Bucko has been fit for a longer period or time. It just feels to me that Keogh has had less settled partnerships than Shackell but perhaps that's what I want to believe!

 

I'm probably wrong in my recollection though, maybe there hasn't been too much difference in their partners.

[ChaddesdenRam]

Stats say Dcfc kept 7 clean sheets this season.

Last season with Shackell we kept 11 clean sheets. However Shackell was partnered with Barker for a large proportion.

Shackell scored 1 goal a header on debut vs Birmingham.

Keogh has 5 or 6 goals. He is better in attacking situations then.

I would say both are very good in the air. Keogh is quicker across the ground but I would say Shackell is better positioning wise. Shackell is more commanding in terms of leadership.

Two quality championship players.

[RodleyRam]

Stats say Dcfc kept 7 clean sheets this season.

Last season with Shackell we kept 11 clean sheets. However Shackell was partnered with Barker for a large proportion.

Shackell scored 1 goal a header on debut vs Birmingham.

Keogh has 5 or 6 goals. He is better in attacking situations then.

I would say both are very good in the air. Keogh is quicker across the ground but I would say Shackell is better positioning wise. Shackell is more commanding in terms of leadership.

Two quality championship players.

 

yeh but which is better, get off yer fence!

[Henry]

yeh but which is better, get off yer fence!

 

My opinion is Shackell was by far and away the better defender for us, standards required by supporters must have dipped if it is generally thought Keogh is a good defender, or player of the year.

 

The number of errors he makes, or the lack of good positional sense surely has made him an adequate signing at best. He catches the eye with his recovery pace but the best defenders don't get themselves in those last ditch situations very often.

 

Bryson last year, Keogh this year, adequate players, no better than that put up for supporters awards, it surprises me how so many seem to accept mediocrity. Especially when you compare with the sheer class of Will Hughes performances and how good Brayford and Hendrick are.

[Mostyn6]

Shackell for me is a footballer, he reads the game and has good technical ability. His size,shape and speed have determined that he ended up a defender, but I think if he was smaller, lighter, faster etc, could've played any position.

 

Keogh is a warrior. He has no real technical quality or ability, but never hides. There is a lot to be admired about Keogh and if he's beaten, it won't be for lack of trying. Sadly though, he's prone to mistakes and hoofball.

 

As a spectator, I would have Keogh. Shackell may be the best footballer in his back-garden, but it's no good if you ain't committed out on the pitch. I don't agree that Keogh is better on the strength of goals-scored, that's like buying a car because it floats on water better than another car!

 

If I was a manager, I would pick Shackell and hope to inspire him to be as committed as Keogh. If he was as committed as Keogh, he wouldn't be playing at mid-table Championship level.

[ChaddesdenRam]

yeh but which is better, get off yer fence!

Keogh

[ronnieronalde]

Shackell for me is a footballer, he reads the game and has good technical ability. His size,shape and speed have determined that he ended up a defender, but I think if he was smaller, lighter, faster etc, could've played any position.

 

Keogh is a warrior. He has no real technical quality or ability, but never hides. There is a lot to be admired about Keogh and if he's beaten, it won't be for lack of trying. Sadly though, he's prone to mistakes and hoofball.

 

As a spectator, I would have Keogh. Shackell may be the best footballer in his back-garden, but it's no good if you ain't committed out on the pitch. I don't agree that Keogh is better on the strength of goals-scored, that's like buying a car because it floats on water better than another car!

 

If I was a manager, I would pick Shackell and hope to inspire him to be as committed as Keogh. If he was as committed as Keogh, he wouldn't be playing at mid-table Championship level.

 

Come on Mostyn.

 

Have a word with yourself.

 

Keogh is head and shoulders above Shackell as a footballer. He's so much more comfortable on the ball than Shackell ever was.

[The Scarlet Pimpernel]

Shackell for me is a footballer, he reads the game and has good technical ability. His size,shape and speed have determined that he ended up a defender, but I think if he was smaller, lighter, faster etc, could've played any position.

 

Keogh is a warrior. He has no real technical quality or ability, but never hides. There is a lot to be admired about Keogh and if he's beaten, it won't be for lack of trying. Sadly though, he's prone to mistakes and hoofball.

 

As a spectator, I would have Keogh. Shackell may be the best footballer in his back-garden, but it's no good if you ain't committed out on the pitch. I don't agree that Keogh is better on the strength of goals-scored, that's like buying a car because it floats on water better than another car!

 

If I was a manager, I would pick Shackell and hope to inspire him to be as committed as Keogh. If he was as committed as Keogh, he wouldn't be playing at mid-table Championship level.

I could not disagree with you more. Keogh is twice the footballer Shackell is. Shackells passing was/is very poor. How you can say Keogh hoofs it is completely beyond me.

[Henry]

Come on Mostyn.

 

Have a word with yourself.

 

Keogh is head and shoulders above Shackell as a footballer. He's so much more comfortable on the ball than Shackell ever was.

No way is that true, Shackell has a fantastic left-peg.

[Mostyn6]

Come on Mostyn.

 

Have a word with yourself.

 

Keogh is head and shoulders above Shackell as a footballer. He's so much more comfortable on the ball than Shackell ever was.

 

 

I could not disagree with you more. Keogh is twice the footballer Shackell is. Shackells passing was/is very poor. How you can say Keogh hoofs it is completely beyond me.

 

 

<Bananas>

 

And here you have it! People prepared to go against their own mind in order to disagree with someone they don't like! Pitiful

[MuespachRam]

Buxton.