Bald Eagle's Barmy Army

I thought this deserved its own thread. 
 

This was announced at half time yesterday to encourage supporters to come and watch our U15’s on Wednesday who play Chelsea in the final of a cup game. 
 

I’ve been told for the last few years that this group of players are a very good group. 
 

It’s free to watch so get down if you can and support the academy. 

13 minutes ago, On the Ram Page said:

It really is pathetic. Shame I associate you with Jim Smith - you don’t deserve it!

Oh dear - now that is pathetic 

6 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

And the time to raise this is less than 2 minutes after we've just scored 🤣

You just keep looking for likes @G STAR RAM enjoy the glory of the night pal. 

29 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Wow you now even use when we score a goal as a way of slagging someone else off 😂

Pathetic.

Not pathetic. The team is crying out for a decent striker and maybe we might look better going forward if we can get one in January. 

Remove James Collins and guess what. No way Collins would have scored that 

This is god damn awful. 

13 minutes ago, Barney1991 said:

I saw the opposite no movement whatsoever no one willing to take a man on. Collins anomalously walking round 

I think you’ll find that him sprinting  

3 hours ago, Banksy said:

David Clowes and the first-team coaches sat together near to where I was sitting. They also attended the previous tie at Mansfield. Matt Hamshaw and Andy Warrington watched the last 70 minutes of the U21 game against Arsenal on Friday. It's a very recent phenomenon and good to see. None of them joined Nigel Clough on the bench at the U21 game at Mansfield early in the month. Maybe it's not just a coincidence that this has come about since @Ghost of Clough and @Bald Eagle's Barmy Army raised their concerns. I hope so because it's very positive to think that those running the club will take notice of what they see as valid fan opinions.

I think it's great they was there last night, especially the night before the first team have an away game too. I don't think this would have happened before "the talk" that sunny Sunday morning at Clowes pad though.

But, it's all good and well them sat in the stands, we need to see more action on the training pitch and appearances as a first team player. 

You don't produce Bellingham players by them playing U21's and below. 

7 hours ago, ilkleyram said:

According to Radio Derby tonight he was actually at the match. Though I guess that doesn’t fit in with the ‘he hates the academy and young players’ mantra that some are trotting out.

Yea OK 

2 hours ago, jono said:

I doubt Warne would agree with your speculative opinion as to his interest in youth teams. 

Warne doesn't trust youth, have you not heard his interviews? 

1 hour ago, therealhantsram said:

Some players develop. Some players don't. 

Predicting which ones go on to great things is near impossible, even for professionals in the game. 

All depends how they are coached and who's guiding them. 

1 hour ago, Carnero said:

Nixon linking Cruz Allen with Man Utd, Chelsea & Newcastle 🙄

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/24856491/manchester-united-chelsea-newcastle-derby-cruz-allen/

And this is exactly why the academy players need to see a good pathway to the first team otherwise they will be gone. And who could blame them?? 

59 minutes ago, Caerphilly Ram said:

Just looking to promote a tiny bit of balance to the dialogue on here as this last week or so has felt once more like a massive pile on after the Crewe result. 
 

Despite however unlikely some people might think it is, there is still a possibility of a successful league campaign whether that’s with Warne as the manager or someone else. Plenty of games and points left to play for, if you somehow find that laughable that’s up to you. 

Let's just hope for a fantastic win today. 

18 minutes ago, Caerphilly Ram said:

Last season is done, and whilst it’s a fair observation that our performances have been inconsistent since then, there is still an opportunity to change THIS season’s form, performances, results, and yes for those who are desperate for it…perhaps even the manager.
My thoughts both for those so keen to wallow in their perceived realism of how terrible and miserable life is as a Derby fan and those who feel less fed up with it all, there’s still room for some optimism in this season. We could still see an improvement in performances, consistency, the health of players currently at the squad etc and we could also see a change of manager if the team doesn’t look to be heading in the right direction closer to the business end of the season. 
There’s not yet enough wrong at the club or with the team to completely write this season off. 

Don’t want to write the season off, why would we. 
 

Perhaps just write off the ones who aren’t too good at their job. 

9 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

Agreed, the season is 46 matches so I'm glad that we agree that its way too early to be making judgements 👍

Our failings span over 2 seasons since March 23. 
 

BUT, let’s forget about that bit and concentrate on a smaller number of games where we’ve still had some terrible performances. 
 

5th in the league form table 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 who are you trying to kid apart from yourself 

6 minutes ago, Damon1985 said:

Just watched the Luton programme on Sky Sports, Is there a more extreme example of decline / rise?! 

 

The most interesting point was " we realised we couldn't play attractive football" when they were at rock bottom. Now I know we haven't sunk to the conference but we have sunk to our rock bottom!

I think my point is, what if the football we aspire to play like is not possible in our current situation? And to make it worse, what happens if some of our players are above that?! The only situation of DCFC that is consistent is our midfield and despite our recruitment... bird, smith and hourihane seem like our first choice... the same trio that struggled often!

 

Going back to the title... what would you prefer? 

 

Is style possible in league one?! 

It’s like saying Man City would struggle with the team they have in league one. 
 

We’re playing football not rugby. Get it on the floor, pass it around and create opportunities to score. Football is simple. 

4 hours ago, Wolfie20 said:

For pity's sake give it a rest 😉

Erm, no - Warne doesn't care about the academy so until that changes I'll keep saying it. I'm sorry. 

9 hours ago, duncanjwitham said:

Not picking you out particularly with this, it's more of a general comment, but the bold bits get to the root of why I'm so opposed to Warne.

The way I see it, we have everything off-field ready for the Premier League - the fanbase size, the stadium, the training ground etc are all good enough.  Obviously we have no divine right to be in any league, but in theory there's no reason why we shouldn't be in the same group of clubs as the likes of Leicester/Burnley/Fulham/Brighton/Norwich etc who have spent at least as much time in the Prem as they have out of it in recent seasons.  I'm not saying we can win it like Leicester or be top 6 like Brighton or anything, but we absolutely have the potential to get there and stay there, but the onus is on us as a club to make it happen.

Obviously, one way that happens is that a new owner comes along and throws a lot of money at the club.  But there's no guarantee this happens, there's no guarantee it works if it does, and we all know what the potential fallout can be if it goes wrong.  It's certainly not an option we should be relying on.  Another way is just genuine luck, alignment of stars type stuff - you get the right manager at the right time, a bunch of signings all work out and you hit the jackpot.  We came close with Burley+Rasiak+Idiakez... and McClaren+Martin+Bryson... but ultimately fell short.  Again, that's not something you can rely on - you need a lot of things to all hit at once, and even then it might not work.  And it gets harder and harder as the championship gets dominated by clubs with parachute payments.

So IMO we should be doing the one thing that we have some degree of control over, and that's doing our level best to get the most we can out of the academy.  But that means fully committing to it.  When academy players are hitting 17/18/19/20 (it will be different for each players), they need to start being introduced to senior football.  If they aren't they won't progress.  If we take the approach that we can't play youth players now, we need to get promoted first, then you're basically writing off the current generation of academy players.  They won't get the first team exposure they need and won't kick on. 

So if we do get promoted what happens?  We can't afford to play academy players, we need to get stabilised in this league first.  And then?  We can't afford to play academy players, we need to kick on for the top 6 now.  And then?  We can't afford to play academy players, we need to get promoted to the prem first.  If your attitude is "we can't afford to play them now", then you won't be able to play them when they're good enough later, because they won't get good enough.

You can't just have an academy sat on the sidelines and hope it produces players now and then.  If you want to be like Southampton and have a steady stream of them, you have to gear the whole club up to make it happen.  You play similar styles of football across all age groups, you gear your transfer policy to not block promising players, you commit to giving youngsters first team chances when they're ready and if they take it you let them run with it.  And from what I can see, we can't do any of that with Warne in charge.  So we're just stuck hoping a youngster pops up, fully formed, once in a blue moon.  And that's one of the big advantages we could have over similar sized clubs that we are just choosing to throw away.

I have no idea if Weston is good enough, I've never seen him play.  But by all accounts he did well when he came on, and scored a good goal.  If you give him say 20 minutes against Barnsley and he scores again, then okay, maybe we've got something here.  If he then starts against Crewe and scores, then we've got a potential first team striker for nothing.  And if he doesn't do any of that then fine, he goes back to the U21s and maybe gets another shot in a month or 2.  But right now, we've just got a guy that scored a goal once and then never played again, which is no use to anyone.

Sorry everyone for the long post, but I genuinely think appointing Warne was a catastrophic mistake for a lot of reasons.  The ridiculous short-termism of "he was brought in to achieve promotion quickly" sums it up - it's like there's no thought as to what happens when we do get promoted.  And when I see fans almost actively celebrating it ("I don't care about academy players, we won 3-0" type stuff) I just find it a bit sad really.  I want the club to be in the premier league, I want the club to play good football, and I want to see academy players getting into the first team and doing well, and I want the club to be actively trying to make all that stuff happen, not just flailing around doing stuff at random and hoping that one day it might work.

(and breathe...)

Great post and exactly my thoughts. 

42 minutes ago, Rev said:

He probably remembers playing under Captain Bucko at Mansfield, and I'm pretty sure Barker will remember playing a hundred odd games with Jake.

It was more a comment of that Warne probably doesn't know where the academy is at Derby 

1 minute ago, RoyMac5 said:

Has Warne decades of experience in playing youth? I suppose he must have brought some players through Rotherham's academy?

Dan the man knows his stuff Roy - can't mess with his knowledge 🤣

1 hour ago, Dan_Ram said:

We haven't seen a lot of them yet but the people who pick the team, who see them every day in training, who have decades of experience in coaching youth teams and knowledge of the step up between youth to senior football have seen them and aren't picking them. 

Ah OK, you sound like an expert at this. 

2 minutes ago, Banksy said:

Bucko comes across really well on the interview I think. Full of passion, realism, common sense and knowledge. He proved as a player that he had the character and grit to make the maximum use of his own abilities and he probably reached the maximum potential he could possibly achieve before he retired. I think our young players are in good hands while he is around. He seems to have a patriarchal air about him and seems set on bringing those he thinks are ready to the attention of the head coach. I hope Warne knows that he's dealing with a no-nonsense football genius 😆. COYR.

Probably a good chance Warne has never heard of Jake Buxton 🤣

5 hours ago, Dan_Ram said:

They aren't good enough yet, otherwise they'd be in the first team...

Who would you suggest from the U21s that is currently better than our starting XI?

Brown might be the only one close IMO. Robinson, Weston, Fapetu, Wheeldon all have potential but not 1st team quality yet.

I'm talking about bringing in 20-24 yr olds that have league experience. Unfortunately we are looking at Ireland, Scotland, lower leagues & Premier league cast-offs, because that's the pool we are fishing in at the minute.

They aren’t good enough yet???

We haven’t seen anywhere near enough of them to make that sort of comment. 
 

Most of our first team arent good enough. 

3 hours ago, Banksy said:

Your thoughts align very much with my own which have developed since Warne joined us. I recognise why Warne was chosen; because of his recent successes in gaining promotion from this division. But over the last 12 months I have become increasingly concerned as to whether he will be able to repeat that feat here and now because of how the modern methods have found their way down to Division One and have overtaken his previously tried and trusted methods. Warne has never accumulated in a single season the number of points attained by the three clubs promoted last season; 92 points may well have seen us not promoted last May. He was outstripped by the younger and emerging McKenna and Schumacher at Ipswich and Plymouth in particular. So far this season the same might be said about John Moussinho at Portsmouth and Liam Manning at Oxford (now replaced by Des Buckingham). All four represent the trend in moving to younger coaches rather than those with an previously established reputation. They seem to be breaking the mould of long ball being best to reach the Championship. Warne, by contrast, seems to be a one-trick-pony who knows no other way than what he’s tried before and seems to have little idea of how to change what is not currently going to plan.

That brings me to the longer term strategic plan for the club with the rebuild of both the academy and the first team, which presently seems to be going in polar opposite directions. The senior team are stuck with Warne’s style while the academy teams continue to follow the style of the Elite Player Performance Plan (EPPP) encompassing a possession and passing game. For me the latter is essential if we are to retain our Category One Academy status because Warne’s methods would simply bring about catastrophe in PL2. The academy managers and coaches recruited for the rebuild seem to have been recruited for their experience and adherence to EPPP in bringing through young professionals to the first-team as has been done here before.

It must be remembered that when they reach that stage, their development is still continuing; it is not suddenly complete. But when they get there they have to dismiss much of what they have been taught to fit in with what Paul Warne wants. It must be confusing, even wasteful, for them I feel and I wonder if it is an underlying reason for why Bird, Sibley and Knight have perhaps not performed at the level we came to hope and even expect from them earlier in their careers? Having said all of that, I am now thinking that unfortunately Paul Warne represents a square peg in a round hole at Derby County and he alone does not fit into the overall plan. I am doubtful about his willingness or ability to change.

When the first team are not playing I watch the academy sides and my thoughts have become more entrenched since the start of the season. But at the end of the day, I’m not a professional coach but just a mere fan. That, like I expect with many supporters, always leaves room for self-doubt about the strength of our own opinions. However, yesterday when reading the EFL paper, I was warmed to come across an article about the new breed of coaches which is a topic that has recently been mentioned several times on here. In much more depth it addressed the subject under discussion. I have done my best to scan the double-page spread in three sections for anyone interested in reading it.

This is why we're struggling to attract players

6 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

Just for a bit of balance, Portsmouth have yet to lose a game this season and are only top by 1 point and 5 points ahead of 5th place. 

Perhaps just a bit of consistency would make me happy. 
 

Consistency in results, performances, what he says - but unfortunately everything he says and does doesn’t fill me with any confidence. 
 

There’s so many mixed messages you don’t know what to believe.