mwram1973 Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 No sorry, used to defend Keogh, but I can't anymore. It's not Buxton's fault, it's not Christie's fault, it is Richard Keogh. No leadership qualities and he can't even lead by example. He doesn't acknowledge his mistakes either because he just shouts and blames others. Albentosa and Buxton for me. Seemed to remember a certain Peter Shilton used to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuffLuff Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 In my opinion the key to defending I'd trust in what is around you. For example it took a long time last season for Grant, Keogh and Buxton to work at a unit, once it began to work (at the time with Eustace in front) then it looked like we wouldn't concede many at all. I think that the defence problem at this moment is actually the midfield (and this is why I don't think any formation addressed Derbys real problem). It's not a slight on Mascerall but i don't think he has that understanding to protect the back four like Eustace and Thorne have. Hence why I think Keogh is a bit manic at the moment. It doesn't help that the midfield aside Hughes is a bit out of form at the moment, but it's not working as a unit and therefore a lot is put on the defence to break up play too far in our half. Also they keep giving away stupid free kicks in poor decisions. If you re watch the Forest game, how many FKs were given where they could pump the ball into our box for them to scrap against. In that instance I'm not sure how much Keogh can keep doing to get his head to the ball. IMO if you stop giving away FKs in our half then you'd stop the supply/pressure on defence. I don't think it's any coincidence that we have looked our best, for long periods, with Eustace and Thorne as the DM. Also during these periods Keogh gets no criticism?? Again not a slight on Mascarell who is a decent player but reminds me of Valakari. Good for keeping the ball with sideways passes and the odd fancy ball, but he's not effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Like a forum then... Pretty much - although given the intelligence of some people posting on twitter, I'm sure that 140 characters is about 132 too many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howard Canitbé Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Twitter is where sensible debate and polite conversation goes to die. It is quite fun to read though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rambam Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 In my opinion the key to defending I'd trust in what is around you. For example it took a long time last season for Grant, Keogh and Buxton to work at a unit, once it began to work (at the time with Eustace in front) then it looked like we wouldn't concede many at all. I think that the defence problem at this moment is actually the midfield (and this is why I don't think any formation addressed Derbys real problem). It's not a slight on Mascerall but i don't think he has that understanding to protect the back four like Eustace and Thorne have. Hence why I think Keogh is a bit manic at the moment. It doesn't help that the midfield aside Hughes is a bit out of form at the moment, but it's not working as a unit and therefore a lot is put on the defence to break up play too far in our half. Also they keep giving away stupid free kicks in poor decisions. If you re watch the Forest game, how many FKs were given where they could pump the ball into our box for them to scrap against. In that instance I'm not sure how much Keogh can keep doing to get his head to the ball. IMO if you stop giving away FKs in our half then you'd stop the supply/pressure on defence. I don't think it's any coincidence that we have looked our best, for long periods, with Eustace and Thorne as the DM. Also during these periods Keogh gets no criticism?? Again not a slight on Mascarell who is a decent player but reminds me of Valakari. Good for keeping the ball with sideways passes and the odd fancy ball, but he's not effective. Put in a pretty decent corner yesterday, didn't he? He's still learning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peakram Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Putting in a corner isn't anything to do with breaking up play though we all agree he can play a bit but we are citing the defensive frailties not going forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuffLuff Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Put in a pretty decent corner yesterday, didn't he? He's still learning. Not disputing that he has quality, but he doesn't have that presence (or arguably, the intelligence) to play the DM role effectively. He will be a good player one day, but if you want to look at defensive problems you also need to look what is infront of back four as to why it's dodgy. Whether it is Christie (best form has been with Russell infront who gives him protection), Keogh, Buxton or Forsyth. They all need protection and trust the players infront of them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Putting in a corner isn't anything to do with breaking up play though we all agree he can play a bit but we are citing the defensive frailties not going forward. Clean sheet yesterday. Mascarell did his bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RodleyRam Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 I don't personally think Keogh is a calm head. I think he's a decent Champ CH but others have pointed out he almost tries too hard / panics when he's over compensating for those around him i.e. Mascarell. Not that there's always a need for him to do this but it does seem to be a theme. Stick a real leader in there and a genuine calm head and Keogh is much more solid. He does need to stand up and be that calm head, I'm just not sure he has that in him. Decent player though, just not the kind of calm leader we'd really benefit from. Maybe a rest would do him good but I can't see Mac doing that to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Clean sheet yesterday. Mascarell did his bit. At least 3 cracking last ditch tackles to prevent balls played across the box, by my count. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Re: Mascarell, he could help himself out by not fully committing to tackles high up the pitch. v Forest, the stupidity of Hendrick and Bryson left him exposed and he had a problem. He had to defend 3 directions. Now if he goes charging out, like he did for the winner, then he's left himself surrounded by space on all sides. He's out the game. In that situation, and it's s situation that will happen every game because we attack and attacks break down (wouldn't want it any other way), the thing he should do is retreat to where the 2 CB's can protect his back. Where full backs can pinch in and force the ball wide. What Eustace will do sometimes is foul. Resulting in the whole team getting back and him getting booked. That's fine. If Mascarell can't foul then he just needs to make sure the space between him and the CB's is small when he steps out. The crowd will moan that there's no pressure on the ball. They'll shout "go to him then !". Ignore that. They're wrong. He can't really help the space in front and down the side of him. But he can avoid open space behind him. That's something that's easy to fix. He's too eager sometimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Re: Mascarell, he could help himself out by not fully committing to tackles high up the pitch. v Forest, the stupidity of Hendrick and Bryson left him exposed and he had a problem. He had to defend 3 directions. Now if he goes charging out, like he did for the winner, then he's left himself surrounded by space on all sides. He's out the game. In that situation, and it's s situation that will happen every game because we attack and attacks break down (wouldn't want it any other way), the thing he should do is retreat to where the 2 CB's can protect his back. Where full backs can pinch in and force the ball wide. What Eustace will do sometimes is foul. Resulting in the whole team getting back and him getting booked. That's fine. If Mascarell can't foul then he just needs to make sure the space between him and the CB's is small when he steps out. He can't really help the space in front and down the side of him. But he can avoid open space behind him. That's something that's easy to fix. He's too eager sometimes. Are you saying he gets caught too far forward at times? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Are you saying he gets caught too far forward at times? er, yeah... Thanks. ffs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbobram Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 It summed it up against Forest when he tried to make a pass and it went straight out of play, and then decided to moan and make it Christie's fault. A captain doesn't do that. Drop him for a game or two, he needs it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 er, yeah... Thanks. ffs Thing is with Omar, I see him as Hughes replacement, not as a DM. Not saying he's as good as Will yet, but seems more that type of player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 Thing is with Omar, I see him as Hughes replacement, not as a DM. Not saying he's as good as Will yet, but seems more that type of player. Be interesting to see it. Doubt we ever will though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curb Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 Clean sheet wasn't it? Oh woes me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott129 Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 Keogh - played all but a handful of games since he's been here, captained us to a play-off final and up there again this season (potentially joint top depending on Tuesday night). Albentosa - looked quite good in 45 minutes against a League 1 side (and, if anyone even claims to have watched him play before we were linked, you're a goddamn liar). Some fans are idiots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashz09 Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 He just need to learn to pass. Was talking to some randomers who go and watch Derby and every one picks up the way he passes. It's like slow motion the time he actually passes it you know where it's going and who to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroyDyer Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 Keogh - played all but a handful of games since he's been here, captained us to a play-off final and up there again this season (potentially joint top depending on Tuesday night). Albentosa - looked quite good in 45 minutes against a League 1 side (and, if anyone even claims to have watched him play before we were linked, you're a goddamn liar). Some fans are idiots. Or maybe some fans, that can't see a mans limitations despite our league position, and can't see in 45 minutes the calm head and class of a new centre half, are idiots? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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