least funny 'comedian'

[Stive Pesley]

UK Stand-up is a weird thing isn't it. Straight white males dominate, and there acts are all wildly different.

Yet whenever you see a female/gay/ethnic minority doing stand-up, they almost always base their act on their gender/sexuality/ethnicity to a large degree.

Same as when soap operas have gay/ethnic minority characters - their storylines are generally around their trials & tribulations as a minority.

I have my suspicions as to why that is, but I don't want to ruin another thread with heated political debate ?

 

[SaintRam]

11 minutes ago, StivePesley said:

UK Stand-up is a weird thing isn't it. Straight white males dominate, and there acts are all wildly different.

Yet whenever you see a female/gay/ethnic minority doing stand-up, they almost always base their act on their gender/sexuality/ethnicity to a large degree.

Same as when soap operas have gay/ethnic minority characters - their storylines are generally around their trials & tribulations as a minority.

I have my suspicions as to why that is, but I don't want to ruin another thread with heated political debate ?

 

I think that is due to the fact that all of those traits are still the subject of ridicule among certain areas of society, at least common enough that anyone of them will comment on such an experience at least semi-occasionally; and self-deprecation is often the most effective defense against such ridicule.

Usually these acts are quite self-deprecating, even if it is layered under subtext and its simply easier for those acts to find success on the circuit, and get picked up for TV.

If you go and watch comedy at amateur/semi pro circuits (at local pubs etc.) there are a lot of varied acts who don't do a lot of the type of humor you're referring to, but they find it harder to find success as there is often someone successful (or multiple people) filling their niche.

 

Comedy is, generally, far too accessible and diverse for an act to be genuinely original any more, the vast majority of acts can be compared to others and be very similar - unless you go to those pubs or the hidden away shows at the Edinburgh festival. Shows that are often hilarious (and weird), but won't find success as easily (usually, not at all), as its not as marketable.

And now, TV people who measure demographics etc. have a "type" they want to get for specific slots. So you tend to just get more of the same, only younger.

[Stive Pesley]

34 minutes ago, SaintRam said:

And now, TV people who measure demographics etc. have a "type" they want to get for specific slots. So you tend to just get more of the same, only younger.

That was all along the lines of my suspicions - not that there aren't the comedians out there, but more to do with the "filters" that decide what goes on TV/becomes successful.

A friend of mine did stand-up and was reasonably successful to the point of being on TV a couple of times, but he hated it. Said that the more success he got - the more he realised quite what a cesspit he was lowering yourself into. So he just stopped doing it. Fair play to him!

[SaintRam]

22 minutes ago, StivePesley said:

That was all along the lines of my suspicions - not that there aren't the comedians out there, but more to do with the "filters" that decide what goes on TV/becomes successful.

A friend of mine did stand-up and was reasonably successful to the point of being on TV a couple of times, but he hated it. Said that the more success he got - the more he realised quite what a cesspit he was lowering yourself into. So he just stopped doing it. Fair play to him!

My brother's similar. He's character comedian, who loves doing all the small circuits. Any time he starts generating a decent level of popularity he creates a new character and resets ? 

Although I dont know if hes still as active - my sister in law is though. And she's the same way.

They're a wacky couple. 

[McRainy]

1 hour ago, Chester40 said:

I think it is nearly always men who would say it? Its almost like bonding...we know the same things..find the same things amusing. Maybe its our way of connecting...like how mainly its women who would say 'is that a new coat/ haircut/ shoes... God, it really suits you.'

I don't think it's quite that bad, but as a generalisation maybe women bond more emotionally and intuitively, whereas men bond through things and stuff.

These are gross stereotypes, obviously, and there's probably no clear link with humour, but the differences are noticeable.

As for Stive's point about minority humour, there probably are social constraints on what people can do to find acceptance.

[Igor]

Reeves & Mortimer. 

[GboroRam]

What about political humour? I like the left leaning comedians and recognise some of the names who say they have issues with the Russell Brand/Russell Howard types being on the opposite side of the fence to me. But in my 47 years I don't think I've ever seen a Conservative stand-up act (plenty of comedians mind, just onlt in parliament). I get the argument that satire needs to "punch up" but we had a Labour government, yet comedy against Blair pretty much came from the left again, not the right. 

So, why are comedians doing the circuits generally left of centre? 

[Day]

2 hours ago, StivePesley said:

but I don't want to ruin another thread with heated political debate ?

Why do I not believe you and that in 2 weeks time we're 40 pages deep into Brexit and the life and policies of Donald Trump

[Anon]

2 hours ago, StivePesley said:

Yet whenever you see a female/gay/ethnic minority doing stand-up, they almost always base their act on their gender/sexuality/ethnicity to a large degree.

Many try to ignore it, not out of any sense necessity, just it doesn't fit with their act. The problem is that the media tend to incessantly focus on it. Behold the utterly patronising line of questioning taken by Krishnan Guru-Murthy in this interview, which Richard Ayoade expertly deflects.

 

[Stive Pesley]

29 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

But in my 47 years I don't think I've ever seen a Conservative stand-up act (plenty of comedians mind, just onlt in parliament).

 

There is this guy

https://www.theguardian.com/stage/2017/may/15/tory-comedian-geoff-norcott-brexit-conservative

And of course Jim Davidson is an open Tory and even campaigned in Chad with Amanda Solloway at the last election

 

[Stive Pesley]

15 minutes ago, Anon said:

Many try to ignore it, not out of any sense necessity, just it doesn't fit with their act. The problem is that the media tend to incessantly focus on it. Behold the utterly patronising line of questioning taken by Krishnan Guru-Murthy in this interview, which Richard Ayoade expertly deflects.

 

Haha - yep. He starts off OK with his deliberate joke about Ayoade being a role model for Norwegians growing up in Britain, but then just reverts back to the lazy stuff

[GboroRam]

1 hour ago, StivePesley said:

There is this guy

https://www.theguardian.com/stage/2017/may/15/tory-comedian-geoff-norcott-brexit-conservative

And of course Jim Davidson is an open Tory and even campaigned in Chad with Amanda Solloway at the last election

 

Never heard of the first one. 

Dear old Jim. For some reason I'd forgotten about the old UKIP supporting racist. 

[sage]

2 hours ago, StivePesley said:

There is this guy

https://www.theguardian.com/stage/2017/may/15/tory-comedian-geoff-norcott-brexit-conservative

And of course Jim Davidson is an open Tory and even campaigned in Chad with Amanda Solloway at the last election

 

I always thought this was a character Tory he plays not a real one.

Corbett and Tarbuck were/are Tories.

 

[GboroRam]

1 hour ago, sage said:

I always thought this was a character Tory he plays not a real one.

Corbett and Tarbuck were/are Tories.

 

Before my time... 

[TuffLuff]

19 hours ago, GboroRam said:

What about political humour? I like the left leaning comedians and recognise some of the names who say they have issues with the Russell Brand/Russell Howard types being on the opposite side of the fence to me. But in my 47 years I don't think I've ever seen a Conservative stand-up act (plenty of comedians mind, just onlt in parliament). I get the argument that satire needs to "punch up" but we had a Labour government, yet comedy against Blair pretty much came from the left again, not the right. 

So, why are comedians doing the circuits generally left of centre? 

It’s always something that comes up every once in a while, I think the general points tend to be.

a) ‘the arts’ as a whole are mostly left leaning

b) the comedy audience tends to be left leaning, so it’s difficult to build an audience

c) to call yourself a right wing comic can be a poisoned chalice, mainly because the comics who’ve claimed it have seen it as a chance to stand out from the crowd and go for the UKIP-y crowd (here’s looking at you Lee Hurst and Andrew Lawrence). Essentially some have seen it as a chance to gain some publicity for a bit, but difficult to maintain the audience needed to make a living (which is probably difficult whilst Roy “Chubby” Brown still tours)

Saying all that there are some good right leaning comics about. As previously said, Geoff Norcott has done some great bits on The Mash Report and Simon Evans, without directly saying his allegiances, has made it work too. It can be done, and be funny no matter which way you lean, but the right wing comic soon becomes the ‘comic who dares say what others darent’ which is maybe a bit outdated now. Put it this way, at the Ed Fringe this year they’ll be something like a dozen shows where the comic will have something in their promo like ‘the only Comic who dares to take on the left’...so take that for what it’s worth.

They do exist, but I think it’s a very difficult thing to do well essentially 

[Duracell]

On 25/07/2018 at 10:26, StivePesley said:

UK Stand-up is a weird thing isn't it. Straight white males dominate, and there acts are all wildly different.

Yet whenever you see a female/gay/ethnic minority doing stand-up, they almost always base their act on their gender/sexuality/ethnicity to a large degree.

?

 

I’m not sure I agree with the first paragraph. Straight-white-male comedians may seem very different to us, but we watch them all the time, so the nuances seem very different. I can’t imagine Kevin Bridges doing a sell out tour of South Carolina, for example - he’s very different to what they’d find palatable.

There’s a huge spectrum of white male comedians, from McIntyre to Lee, from Evans to Mortimer...but they all have their fans because they make jokes about something you can relate to. Even the surreal ones.

So when someone comes along who has very different experiences, it’s harder to relate and it’s more noticeably different. It goes from “ha ha, yes, that’s a good observation/that’s a bit like that thing I do” to “why are mentioning your ethnic family all the time?!”

We laugh at the people that we either think are like us, or behave the way we wish we could/want to be one day.

This probably explains why I found Tim Lovejoy hilarious at 9 years old and as funny as a cup of cold sick at 23.

[Stive Pesley]

18 minutes ago, Duracell said:

There’s a huge spectrum of white male comedians, from McIntyre to Lee, from Evans to Mortimer...but they all have their fans because they make jokes about something you can relate to. Even the surreal ones.

Yeah that's kind of what I meant - but the things I relate to aren't because we'I'm a straight white male. They are because I'm a human being. They arent limiting their comedy. You dont ever hear a comedian say "have you ever noticed, as a straight white male, this thing happens..."

 

 

[TuffLuff]

39 minutes ago, Duracell said:

I’m not sure I agree with the first paragraph. Straight-white-male comedians may seem very different to us, but we watch them all the time, so the nuances seem very different. I can’t imagine Kevin Bridges doing a sell out tour of South Carolina, for example - he’s very different to what they’d find palatable.

There’s a huge spectrum of white male comedians, from McIntyre to Lee, from Evans to Mortimer...but they all have their fans because they make jokes about something you can relate to. Even the surreal ones.

So when someone comes along who has very different experiences, it’s harder to relate and it’s more noticeably different. It goes from “ha ha, yes, that’s a good observation/that’s a bit like that thing I do” to “why are mentioning your ethnic family all the time?!”

We laugh at the people that we either think are like us, or behave the way we wish we could/want to be one day.

This probably explains why I found Tim Lovejoy hilarious at 9 years old and as funny as a cup of cold sick at 23.

One of the issues though, and in fairness is slowly starting to be addressed, that in comedy clubs and on tv, comedy has been represented mostly by white (majority posh) males. So material onstage is from that perspective and has alienated others. It is beginning to be addressed now but we are still someway off.

Brendon Burn’s podcast Dumb White Guy brought up some great points about it over his episodes about a year ago which probably make the point much better than what I just have.

[BobbyTheReadingFan]

On 25/07/2018 at 15:06, GboroRam said:

Never heard of the first one. 

Dear old Jim. For some reason I'd forgotten about the old UKIP supporting racist. 

Can't stand Jim Davidson 

I saw him on local news recently. He is a key ambassador for a charity that gets homeless ex military folk back into housing and get back on track. 

He said something similar to "we need to be careful as some ex military just want a free ride and abuse the help..." 

it was a dreadful thing to say and tarnished the entire news story and interview. 

[Chester40]

2 hours ago, BobbyTheReadingFan said:

Can't stand Jim Davidson 

I saw him on local news recently. He is a key ambassador for a charity that gets homeless ex military folk back into housing and get back on track. 

He said something similar to "we need to be careful as some ex military just want a free ride and abuse the help..." 

it was a dreadful thing to say and tarnished the entire news story and interview. 

I can't stand him either really...but he's just gone up in my estimation. Don't think you can doubt his devotion to the cause as he's been doing the work for ever. So I like his guts for speaking the truth.

There will always be people taking advantage. Whether its this example...or its charity workers or care workers, or people on benefits, cor people claiming disabilities...there will always be a minority who abuse the system and stigmatize the majority. If the wrong people are taking funding from those who truly deserve it I am glad someone is shining a light on it so my money goes the right place.