A little ponder on the Clement/Wassell season

[cannable]

3 hours ago, Mr Giggles said:

It all seems so clear now that what we did was wrong, yet we were all agreeing with it whilst it was happening...

I never understand comments like this 

Yeah, fair enough, but the fans aren’t the ones being paid to get decisions like that right rather than so catastrophically wrong 

[SaintRam]

I think we made a lot of mistakes, in hindsight. Not just in appointment.

The first in my opinion was that McClaren wasn't ambitious enough in the summer after the playoff final, we'd have had a much better season. Instead, we were light on squad depth and when the injuries started to hit we were firefighting with loans.

Our first team had proven themselves capable, hence the decision to not really enter the market, but we had very few injuries in that former season. Our players behind most of the first teamers were poor.

Just one season after those messages of loyalty were made to the players, new managers came in and wanted to change things.

After that, I think all the mistakes have been discussed plenty.

 

[Mostyn6]

the betrayal was binning off McClaren.

[Ram8]

Pearson’s tenure was such a disaster zone that I actually entertained the idea for a while that he had such a deep grudge against Derby County that he deliberately joined as manager to completely destroy everything (style of football, morale of best players, etc.) that had been built up previously by McLaren ..

I’m no fan of Rowett’s management style either, but compared to Pearson, he’s relatively harmless (RELATIVELY!) .. 

[PistoldPete2]

On 01/05/2018 at 12:56, TuffLuff said:

Reading between the lines of the Russell article, it seems that by the end of the season that there were a lot of unhappiness and splits in the camp. Although there was quite a bit of talk about ‘a clear out’ needed at the time, I think it’s starting to come apparant that there were some unrepairable problems that go beyond football that are still being resolved at the club.

So what caused it? The making of a leadership group? Signing too many players? Poor management? I mean it’s probably a mix of a lot of things,but then it still points to some consistently poor decisions being made. But it’s interesting that there are quite a few players who have never really found their form again at Derby, some have now had fresh starts and gone from strength to strength which suggests they weren’t really happy here or needed to move on.

I know for a fact that Russell wasnt happy with Clement, but am surprised at his unhappiness after that.. Mac 2 and Rowett are Russell fans I think and Rowett wanted him to renew his contract, so maybe it went beyond just the managers and he fell out with some of the players. i guess we will never know, but it was a real surprise that he didnt renew his contract when it was offered. 

[archied]

11 hours ago, Moist One said:

the betrayal was binning off McClaren.

Really ? Perhaps the betrayal was maclaren getting player to be loyal to him and the club and turn down prem moves then not doing the same when the first sniff of prem interest in him came along ? But hey if it suits to make maclaren the victim with no part in any of it crack on.

Me I fully believe that if when Newcastle came calling maclaren had come out very firmly and clearly stated that he had a very good group of young players who had bought into him and what he/they were building at derby county and was going nowhere then things would have turned out very differently and I believe we would have gone up injuries or not ,,,, or even season after ,,, 

dont give a **** what anybody else thinks as for me that’s what killed us off and started the decline into a forced rebuild

[Angry Ram]

15 hours ago, Mr Giggles said:

It all seems so clear now that what we did was wrong, yet we were all agreeing with it whilst it was happening...

I think you speak for yourself, not everyone.. Plenty disagreed with what was happening since that QPR game. Plenty still are. 

[Bob Gnarly]

6 minutes ago, Angry Ram said:

I think you speak for yourself, not everyone.. Plenty disagreed with what was happening since that QPR game. Plenty still are. 

I suppose I didn't quite get my point over the way i meant to. I meant there was plenty of buzz of what could be at the time that it clouded all the really poor management if the club

[Day]

 

[Bob Gnarly]

12 hours ago, cannable said:

I never understand comments like this 

Yeah, fair enough, but the fans aren’t the ones being paid to get decisions like that right rather than so catastrophically wrong 

I wasn't trying to have a dig at the fans as such, we had a right to be excited, the way we were looking and everything. The poor management of the certain people within the club was clearly the problem.

[RoyMac5]

21 minutes ago, archied said:

dont give a **** what anybody else thinks as for me that’s what killed us off and started the decline into a forced rebuild

Jackanory. But it doesn't say much for the players mental attitudes then does it.

[Mostyn6]

1 hour ago, archied said:

Perhaps the betrayal was maclaren getting player to be loyal to him and the club and turn down prem moves then not doing the same when the first sniff of prem interest in him came along ?

you mean Steve McClaren? the manager who stayed at the club until he was sacked?

[archied]

57 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Jackanory. But it doesn't say much for the players mental attitudes then does it.

 

17 minutes ago, Moist One said:

you mean Steve McClaren? the manager who stayed at the club until he was sacked?

No more jackanory than any others opinions thoughts put forward ? 

I mean the Steve mclaren that pissed about rather than state clearly that he was going nowhere as players had committed to him and what he was building at the club and he was going to stay and finish the job with them ,,

you can go on about who sacked who and why and the rights and wrongs of it till the cows come home ,,, me I fully believe having watched the whole situation unfold that mclaren s failure to totally quash the Newcastle move was the start of a chain of events that destroyed what clough had built and mclaren expanded on ,,, 

its not blaming as its history now and can’t be changed but painting some as goodies and some as baddies is ballocks , for me that was the start of a chain of events where none of them were blameless from mclaren to players to Morris’s and as usual us fans the losers , so as I say ,crack on with fairy stories if that helps but don’t expect me to not evaluate fairly the events that unfolded and form a reasonable opinion based on them 

[Mostyn6]

1 hour ago, archied said:

 

No more jackanory than any others opinions thoughts put forward ? 

I mean the Steve mclaren that pissed about rather than state clearly that he was going nowhere as players had committed to him and what he was building at the club and he was going to stay and finish the job with them ,,

you can go on about who sacked who and why and the rights and wrongs of it till the cows come home ,,, me I fully believe having watched the whole situation unfold that mclaren s failure to totally quash the Newcastle move was the start of a chain of events that destroyed what clough had built and mclaren expanded on ,,, 

its not blaming as its history now and can’t be changed but painting some as goodies and some as baddies is ballocks , for me that was the start of a chain of events where none of them were blameless from mclaren to players to Morris’s and as usual us fans the losers , so as I say ,crack on with fairy stories if that helps but don’t expect me to not evaluate fairly the events that unfolded and form a reasonable opinion based on them 

absolute nonsense as far as I am concerned, for 2 reasons.

1, He categorically said he was Derby manager and would not comment on speculation. Therefore, he wasn't actually leaving. If your wife says you're going to start sh*gging <insert fit famous lady's name>, what are you going to say if you haven't been asked.

2, He was linked in December. We were still top in March. 

[archied]

9 hours ago, Moist One said:

absolute nonsense as far as I am concerned, for 2 reasons.

1, He categorically said he was Derby manager and would not comment on speculation. Therefore, he wasn't actually leaving. If your wife says you're going to start sh*gging <insert fit famous lady's name>, what are you going to say if you haven't been asked.

2, He was linked in December. We were still top in March. 

Will have to agree to disagree ,I’m sure we both followed the saga as it unfolded and formed our own opinions from what we saw,heard and read ,,, me I wouldn’t have had him back the second time and would not have him manage us ever again ,, you would and that’s your choice ,, I’m sure there’s enough fans that kind of see things in your way and in mine to label either view nonsense though,,

saying your derby manager and won’t comment on speculation doesn’t cut it for me ,, it’s too far from saying you are derby manager and although flattered by the speculation you will be remaining as derby manager to complete the job you are doing ,,, it’s not just mac I will be the same if rowett does the same 

[Mostyn6]

@archied he WAS sacked though. He didn't leave in what... 7 months of being linked with Newcastle? 

Thanks for taking the time to respond though and can respect even though cannot understand your differing POV.

[BramcoteRam84]

If Mel had bided his time and not sacked him we’d have got some compensation from Newcastle. His head had been turned no doubt about it and wouldn’t have stayed Derby manager. 

It all went wrong with the 15/16 signings! Now was that Clement or was it Chris Evans? Or was it Sam Rush?

That summer spending has set us back at least 3 years!

[Rev]

2 minutes ago, BramcoteRam84 said:

If Mel had bided his time and not sacked him we’d have got some compensation from Newcastle. His head had been turned no doubt about it and wouldn’t have stayed Derby manager. 

It all went wrong with the 15/16 signings! Now was that Clement or was it Chris Evans? Or was it Sam Rush?

That summer spending has set us back at least 3 years!

********

[eddie]

2 hours ago, archied said:

Will have to agree to disagree ,I’m sure we both followed the saga as it unfolded and formed our own opinions from what we saw,heard and read ,,, me I wouldn’t have had him back the second time and would not have him manage us ever again ,, you would and that’s your choice ,, I’m sure there’s enough fans that kind of see things in your way and in mine to label either view nonsense though,,

saying your derby manager and won’t comment on speculation doesn’t cut it for me ,, it’s too far from saying you are derby manager and although flattered by the speculation you will be remaining as derby manager to complete the job you are doing ,,, it’s not just mac I will be the same if rowett does the same 

People believed what they wanted to believe.

[BondJovi]

12 hours ago, Moist One said:

absolute nonsense as far as I am concerned, for 2 reasons.

1, He categorically said he was Derby manager and would not comment on speculation. Therefore, he wasn't actually leaving. If your wife says you're going to start sh*gging <insert fit famous lady's name>, what are you going to say if you haven't been asked.

2, He was linked in December. We were still top in March. 

Whilst what McClaren said on the speculation was good enough for me to trust him, i know plenty of others who didn't. He did enough to ensure no bridges were burnt. Local media seemed to have a tough time letting the rumour go which didn't help. As long as rumour lingers in football there will be doubt. That season ended in a mess and left some cracks. We got an untried manager in, injuries caused panic buys and we have been trying to paper over the cracks since. The pressure and expectation to get promoted does us no favours.