Shuff264 Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 We've chopped and changed alot recently and its not worked, time we gave someone time and a chance to build. No reason that cant be Mac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 1 minute ago, Purpleram said: You talk like McClaren has never had a thing to do with Derby before or been involved at all with building the squad! My point is a semi-competent manager should be able to make this team chime! Or we are way way war overrating what we've got and the clocks have stopped c2014/15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDeadlySaul Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 26 minutes ago, Purpleram said: You talk like McClaren has never had a thing to do with Derby before or been involved at all with building the squad! My point is a semi-competent manager should be able to make this team chime! Why? This team is the weakest it's been since 2013 and had a disastrous start with Pearson. It will take a little bit of rebuilding to get this team challenging at top again, it's a very similar situation to what Hughton encountered at Brighton where a previously successful side were struggling due to poor transfers etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purpleram Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 37 minutes ago, Mafiabob said: Or we are way way war overrating what we've got and the clocks have stopped c2014/15 Ok, are we seriously saying this team should get 2 points from Burton, Bristol City, Cardiff, Villa and Blackburn!!!! Are these players relegation fodder? I agree they aren't champions, they don't have the bottle for that, but we deffo should be top six, with a decent manager, which we sadly haven't got. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodley Ram Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 We need to keep Mac and build, like Brighton have done, our problem has been confused transfer windows as each manager buys to fit into his particular system, which leaves the new manager with a problem when the players he has don't fit the new system such as Vydra who is a really good player but doesn't fit our current way of playing. For me in the summer Mac needs to buy a big mobile forward who can hold the ball up and has good technique and a strong midfield player who makes powerful runs and is built like a brick @@ house. Our team is nearly there, let Mac take it forward for the next 2-3 years. It's the only way to build success Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 23 minutes ago, Purpleram said: Ok, are we seriously saying this team should get 2 points from Burton, Bristol City, Cardiff, Villa and Blackburn!!!! Are these players relegation fodder? I agree they aren't champions, they don't have the bottle for that, but we deffo should be top six, with a decent manager, which we sadly haven't got. You spelt "did" wrong. We should be top six? Table does not lie..... Macs fault? Nah...... 4 managers in under two seasons has caught up with us. That ain't Macs fault...... Its arrogant to suggest we should be in "top 6" we are where we supposed to be unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRBee Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 6 hours ago, ronnieronalde said: Of course I was going to games then. The style of football at Brighton (2-1), Yeovil (3-0) Brentford (5-0) and Millwall (5-1) was superb (or did you forget about those games?). "we" lost against Froest but I'll still stand my ground and say second half we smashed them and it was only the sending off that stopped us winning the game. No higher than 33% win rate (apart from at both his other clubs - sheff united 47 or 48% and Burton probably around 41%? See that's the thing I struggle with, you're not even arguing based on facts, just something that you've got stuck in your head. OK so NCs win rate at Burton in his current spell is 34.9% ... I exaggerated ...a little , but it isn't what you say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purpleram Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 9 minutes ago, Mafiabob said: You spelt "did" wrong. We should be top six? Table does not lie..... Macs fault? Nah...... 4 managers in under two seasons has caught up with us. That ain't Macs fault...... Its arrogant to suggest we should be in "top 6" we are where we supposed to be unfortunately. It's not arrogant to think we are under performing surely, just voicing an opinion. I hate being the moaner, I have previously supported managers even against my best judgement, but I genuinely feel McClaren will continue to fail, and by keeping him we are delaying the inevitable, which is he will get sacked and we will have another season of this... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 1 hour ago, Purpleram said: How can he not fashion a functioning side out of the players we have? A great or even a competent coach should be able to tweak tactics to get out the best out of the squad he has. If he can't he isn't very good. Look how well the geezer's done at Huddersfield, or Monk at Leeds, how can they get the best out of previously failing teams. It ain't tactics it's getting the best out of the squad you have, inspiring players to run through brick walls for the team. Managers do that with much lesser players than ours, once you hit the first bump in the road, Maclaren is a busted flush. Sorry but Mac out! Well they had a full summer, shifted players out and moulded the squad into their image… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 1 hour ago, Purpleram said: You talk like McClaren has never had a thing to do with Derby before or been involved at all with building the squad! My point is a semi-competent manager should be able to make this team chime! Why? Because we have name players? Football isn't that simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purpleram Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 4 minutes ago, cannable said: Why? Because we have name players? Football isn't that simple. Because I have seen this same set of players play very well, and on their day would give any Championship side a good game. Football ain't that complicated. Also why ask if you then simply quote your prejudices as an answer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronnieronalde Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 28 minutes ago, DRBee said: OK so NCs win rate at Burton in his current spell is 34.9% ... I exaggerated ...a little , but it isn't what you say. Like I said earlier DrBee, you don't use facts for your arguments just a personal feeling and a bit of grudge. Which is fair enough by the way, we don't have to agree. His wiki page is there, have a read of that and see if it sounds like he's been a failure and drab everywhere he's been. It's a shame they've edited the page and taken out his first spell in charge of Burton, where his win rate was above 40% over a 700 game spell, where each season they were competing and finishing at their highest ever level. I think he finished in worse finishing position twice in 9? For five of those seasons they were competing part time in a full time league. Each season he achieved a record of some sort, whether it was consecutive league wins, clean sheets, unbeaten, goals scored, finishing position. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigel_Clough I did find this page however. I think it says exactly what I said it would. HIs win record at Burton was 43% You don't need to like him, you don't even need to agree with me, never mind like me. BUT.... if you're going to pull him apart or keep having digs, at least try to be a bit more balanced. http://www.managerstats.co.uk/managers/nigel-clough/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 15 minutes ago, Purpleram said: It's not arrogant to think we are under performing surely, just voicing an opinion. I hate being the moaner, I have previously supported managers even against my best judgement, but I genuinely feel McClaren will continue to fail, and by keeping him we are delaying the inevitable, which is he will get sacked and we will have another season of this... 4 managers in 2 years..... let that sink in. This is the main problem, no stability, it's paramount we stick with Mac. He needs time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB SPORTS Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 1 hour ago, Tombo said: I'm a big McClaren fan, but I definitely see the comparisons with the 14/15 collapse. We missed Thorne and Martin then too. This time we could be missing Keogh for a bit too. It's worrying that we still haven't dealt with that really, but on the flipside you have to realise that it's hard to play without your key players for the system. So I'm mixed on the subject. Still a Mac fan but he's not getting away with absolutely everything. I would advise all fans to take that standpoint because it's a nice compromise between wrist-slasher and happy-clapper and you'll get in much fewer pointless arguments over the internet. I have said this elsewhere I think we miss Forsyth too. I looked at the win stats at the weekend: With Forsyth 62 wins from 118 games 52.54 % Without Forsyth 32 Wins from 80 games 40% (Source Soccerbase). Whilst I don't think Craig is a world beater I think he is a very important to our system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 45 minutes ago, Purpleram said: You talk like McClaren has never had a thing to do with Derby before or been involved at all with building the squad! My point is a semi-competent manager should be able to make this team chime! I think you have a point here about whether or not mac can inspire. I have had leaders I would die in a ditch for. And those you'd go through the motions to do a competent job for. Does mac look like he inspires? He personally doesn't need to if there is a member of the coaching team who can play cheerleader. In short - are mac and his team getting all they can out of the players? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swadieram Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 3 minutes ago, HantsRam said: I think you have a point here about whether or not mac can inspire. I have had leaders I would die in a ditch for. And those you'd go through the motions to do a competent job for. Does mac look like he inspires? He personally doesn't need to if there is a member of the coaching team who can play cheerleader. In short - are mac and his team getting all they can out of the players? That's far to to much sense to be in this site Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 31 minutes ago, Purpleram said: Because I have seen this same set of players play very well, and on their day would give any Championship side a good game. Football ain't that complicated. Also why ask if you then simply quote your prejudices as an answer? I guarantee you now, every single side in this division will play well at some point, no matter how good or bad the squad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purpleram Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 19 minutes ago, Mafiabob said: 4 managers in 2 years..... let that sink in. This is the main problem, no stability, it's paramount we stick with Mac. He needs time But that's not an argument for keeping McClaren, it's an argument for sticking with the incumbent even if he's the wrong man. I agree, to a degree, we have all laughed at clubs who sack managers with alarming regularity, and I understand the need for stability, but now is not the time to stick with such a poor hand, I would twist again, but I get why people differ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purpleram Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 3 minutes ago, cannable said: I guarantee you now, every single side in this division will play well at some point, no matter how good or bad the squad Ok Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ram2508 Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Maybe our players over acheive and mac had got them playing above their ability. And now they have faltered through not being able to play above their level for a sustained period? Same core of players with several managers and same result come after christmas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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