Blog on Nigel Clough

[Guest]

I'd invite you both to check Burton Albion's history but I don't think you'll admit to possibly being wrong.

 

It wasn't just getting them promoted.

 

He broke numerous records along the way, got to final and semi finals of cup competitions, had the longest winning sequence in the history of the game at that level.

 

When you then put that burton chairman ben "robertson" was the man responsible then it tells me that you don't know enough about his time there to comment.

 

Cox at Mansfield cannot possibly compare to clough at burton. If you think it can then again it shows a total lack of understanding of the two clubs starting point.

Ronnie, I can't really comment on what Clough achieved at burton, as I didnt follow it, I do feel he got the job partly down to his name, however that is irrevalant as it don't affect the way he manages the club.

What I'm wondering, is why in your opinion he hasn't managed to get into the top 6 yet at derby?

[ronnieronalde]

Ronnie, I can't really comment on what Clough achieved at burton, as I didnt follow it, I do feel he got the job partly down to his name, however that is irrevalant as it don't affect the way he manages the club.

What I'm wondering, is why in your opinion he hasn't managed to get into the top 6 yet at derby?

Hasn't had a squad close to good enough apart from last season where he/we relied on too small a squad.

 

I personally think the quality is there now, we just need that centre half and left back, maybe one surprise.

[eddie]

I think that Mostyn clearly supports Derby, but I get the impression that it's not an unqualified support. There are too many "buts" for that. To dismiss the use of local players is, I believe, where he and I differ in our love for the club. For me, having at least some home-grown talent is an absolute must. That's why my favourite players from the Brian era would always include Colin Boulton, Ronnie Webster and Peter Daniel.

[Guest]

Hasn't had a squad close to good enough apart from last season where he/we relied on too small a squad.

 

I personally think the quality is there now, we just need that centre half and left back, maybe one surprise.

Fair enough, I personally think the difference between top 6 and bottom 6 is minimal, I agree around the squad not being good enough through no fault of his own, however I do feel that in his time here we should at least have been flirting at some point with promotion, or and have a cup run.

4 years to me, with the season being over in jan, is to many, but lets hope that its 5 times lucky.

[Guest]

I think that Mostyn clearly supports Derby, but I get the impression that it's not an unqualified support. There are too many "buts" for that. To dismiss the use of local players is, I believe, where he and I differ in our love for the club. For me, having at least some home-grown talent is an absolute must. That's why my favourite players from the Brian era would always include Colin Boulton, Ronnie Webster and Peter Daniel.

Which is a lot easier when we are winning things :-)

[eddie]

I must be befuddled then, thanks for letting me know. 

 

As a secondary point, whoever penned that blog needs to be taught what a balanced article is, it's the biggest sycophantic homage to Clough that I've read second to Eddie's posts on here

 

At least you don't think that I wrote it - or do you?

[RamNut]

Colin Boulton....signed from cheltenham....so not strictly local.

Steve Powell would be a better example.

Colin used to live on silverhill estate and would give out printed autograph sheets to us kids which made him very popular.

[eddie]

Which is a lot easier when we are winning things :-)

 

Two out of three were regulars in the side I supported which was managed by Tim Ward, and the third was the goalkeeping understudy. For me it was easy to feel the same way when we weren't winning things either. If you want to know why, ask Notts Ram why sycophants tend to be like that.

[eddie]

Colin Boulton....signed from cheltenham....so not strictly local.

Steve Powell would be a better example.

Colin used to live on silverhill estate and would give out printed autograph sheets to us kids which made him very popular.

 

Yes, true - but to me signing from a non-league side is almost as good. Same with Roger Davies - they don't have to be born locally but if they come through the reserves, that's fine. Home-grown is every bit as good as local. Same with Sturridge a few years back, of course.

[RamNut]

Yes, true - but to me signing from a non-league side is almost as good. Same with Roger Davies - they don't have to be born locally but if they come through the reserves, that's fine. Home-grown is every bit as good as local. Same with Sturridge a few years back, of course.

I never quite took to malcolm christie for some reason,

......although i liked kevin wilson ( Banbury?)

[eddie]

I never quite took to malcolm christie for some reason,

......although i liked kevin wilson ( Banbury?)

 

Yes, that's right. Is he still managing Ilson?

[Ramarena]

Paul Cox has achieved more in his time at both Eastwood and Mansfield than Clough did in his long tenture at Burton - Check out his win ratio compared to Cloughs, pretty impressive. Eastwood have gone on a free fall since he left unfortunately.

It's a shame Eastwoods ground didn't meet the regulations to compete in the playoffs, I'm certain they'd have won them (19 game unbeaten at the time).

He also turned around Mansfields fortunes and made them into a footballing league side again. Kudos to the bloke when there's teams like Grimsby, Luton and Wrexham in the mix.

Clough gets too much credit for his work at Burton, Ben Robertson was/is the real man pulling the strings there.

None of the Burton fans I work with want Clough back there in a hurry and are more than happy with Rowett...

 

I would look at Cotterill's record at Cheltenham as the gold standard. What he did there was very good. He took them from the Southern Prem Divison (same level as Clough started at Burton) to League 1 in just over 5 years, also winning the FA trophy and getting to the 5th round of the FA cup.

 

Although many would not consider him a very good manager at present.

[Alph]

I'm with LeedsRam.

I do think his name was a major contribute to him getting the Derby job. If he was to walk tomorrow would we seek our next manager from a similar level with similar achievements? Unlikely imo. Only if there was an emotional connection.

But I very much agree its irrelevant. He's here now and he's done what he's done. Mistakes have been made and he's also took steps forward. Our academy has had radical changes. We've seen 2 players step up into the NPC pretty easily. We have 3/4 others hot on their heels and I think with Nigel in charge they will get everything they need.

So I'd say he's been hit and miss. There are so many positives and negatives to fire back and forth if he left tomorrow the best way you could fairly describe his time at Derby would be to say "he kept a steady ship".

I think a few managers would have been faster to improve us.

I think a few would of fooked off when they realised there was a ton of cost cutting to be done before you can dream of building your own side.

He's got to push on soon. He really has. Too many fans will start wondering if he's played his role in Derby history and if it might be time for some fresh ideas.

I don't see how his first years here can be called success or failure. They fall to neither of those extremes.

I hope he can push on.

[Mostyn6]

I think that Mostyn clearly supports Derby, but I get the impression that it's not an unqualified support. There are too many "buts" for that. To dismiss the use of local players is, I believe, where he and I differ in our love for the club. For me, having at least some home-grown talent is an absolute must. That's why my favourite players from the Brian era would always include Colin Boulton, Ronnie Webster and Peter Daniel.

 

 

Two out of three were regulars in the side I supported which was managed by Tim Ward, and the third was the goalkeeping understudy. For me it was easy to feel the same way when we weren't winning things either. If you want to know why, ask Notts Ram why sycophants tend to be like that.

 

 

Yes, true - but to me signing from a non-league side is almost as good. Same with Roger Davies - they don't have to be born locally but if they come through the reserves, that's fine. Home-grown is every bit as good as local. Same with Sturridge a few years back, of course.

 

 

Eddie, it's an ideal scenario, but not realistic. The game has moved on massively, and NOT for the better in my opinion, but I don't dismiss 'local talent' per se, I actually dismiss the dismissing of anything. ALL options should be considered. I think you've twisted my stance here Eddie.

 

I'm saying the restriction is a bad thing, NOT using local players is a bad thing. I just want the players to be the best available and not just cos they're local.

 

As I said earlier, the Nigel Clough stance would've robbed us of legends like Stimac, Poom, Wanchope, Biaino, Eranio and Asanovic.

 

Would you have rather Steve Elliott (local - good solid pro) be given 10 years at the club? or Igor Stimac (World Class and DCFC Icon). What about Adam Murray over Stefano Eranio?

[Bris Vegas]

LOL at saying that's a balanced article..

 

It has his positives like...

 

- Completely transformed the clubs fortunes after taking over when rock-bottom (we were in a LC Semi-Final plus FA Cup 4th round and not even in the NPC relegation zone hardly rock bottom.. And competely changed? I don't see us in the PL)

 

- Clough runs the line for his son's team.. (And?)

 

- Picking up some of the ripist young talent from the tree (Really? Why aren't they in the PL then?)

 

- Clough's ability to spot lower league gems is a skill bladdy blah (Can't be that good as none have made it to the PL.. If you want gems look at Steve Coppell's record for Reading)

 

- Let's people know he's the boss.. Attacking and attractive football (Haha good one)

 

- The future at DCFC is very very bright, every club needs a Nigel Clough (What you mean every club needs a manager who loses more than he wins every season?)

 

And now for the negatives..

 

- I don't claim that Nigel Clough is the most tactically gifted in the world (Wow big negative.. Arsene Wenger and Carlo Ancelotti also aren't the most tactically gifted in the world.. In fact every manager but 1 isn't the most tactically gifted manager in the world)

 

What an unbelievably biast report clearly done by a Clough supporter who has failed to mention one of his most key aspects.. The guy simply can't build a winning football team and has yet to win more games than he's lost in all of his season at football league level..

[eddie]

Eddie, it's an ideal scenario, but not realistic. The game has moved on massively, and NOT for the better in my opinion, but I don't dismiss 'local talent' per se, I actually dismiss the dismissing of anything. ALL options should be considered. I think you've twisted my stance here Eddie.

 

I'm saying the restriction is a bad thing, NOT using local players is a bad thing. I just want the players to be the best available and not just cos they're local.

 

As I said earlier, the Nigel Clough stance would've robbed us of legends like Stimac, Poom, Wanchope, Biaino, Eranio and Asanovic.

 

Would you have rather Steve Elliott (local - good solid pro) be given 10 years at the club? or Igor Stimac (World Class and DCFC Icon). What about Adam Murray over Stefano Eranio?

 

Don't care whether it's realistic or not.

 

I support Derby, not bloody Chelsea. For me it's important that at least some of our talent is brought through the club and nurtured, not every single player just being purchased from a nursery club. It's the reason we have an academy, and it's part and parcel of the future of our club.

 

You see that word up there which I highlighted? SOME!!! Not all. Spouting nonsense about whether I would rather watch Steve Elliott or Igor Stimac just makes you look silly, so intent in making your point that you lost sight of the point you were replying to. I never said that I wanted to see exclusively home-grown or local talent - heaven forbid, I don't hold by the "This is a local club (...for local people)" viewpoint, but it's important that everyone isn't an expensive acquisition from Mexico or Spain too.

[Ambitious]

Doesn't matter where a player was signed, really doesn't.

 

it has no impact on their ability.

[CumbrianRam]

Couldn't care less about how well or not NC did any Staffordshire club, its his fifth year here, what he did at Burton is irrelevant now.

 

Needs to build his achievements here.

[Srg]

Don't agree Clough got the job on merit alone. Seldom see any manager who is managing in the conference move straight to Championship.

That's not a dig at him, just the way I see it.

[uttoxram75]

"stuck around"?? You make it sound like he's been a highly sought after manager with his pick of the jobs! The reason he 'stuck around" is because he's landed a job with an executive salary based on his surname! He's on the gravy-train, why would he get off?

 

Whilst I am optimistic for the upcoming season, don't rewrite history.... Clough cannot be judged a success. He may not be the failure I often say he is, but he isn't the total opposite either!

 

This bit highlighted is the real point of the debate methinks. You say, "Clough cannot be judged a success"....what you mean is,

"Clough cannot be judged a success in my opinion"!

 

In my opinion he can be judged a success. Simples!

 

If he got the sack half way through next season I would say he's left the club in a better state than when he arrived. The current playing squad are worth more than the one he inherited and the wage bill is half.