Alf-Inge of Fudge Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I'm not just saying that because we've lost two games. I genuinely believe Clough's man management techniques are the worst I've seen. Countless times he makes sly digs at players, treats them like crap and leaves them out for no apparent reason. He's been in charge for probably the same number of games as those three combined and still can't go a season without there being some kind of rift in the camp. And this is his camp now, no excuses. That's what comes across from an outside POV - he's been at Derby 3.5 years now and there's always something unsettling the team. People have sited "we just need time to settle/gel" as an excuse similar to the Forest situation - but at Forest we had an owner die, the club look like going out of existence, 3 different managers in a year (the last of which came in with only 4 weeks before KO), a boat load of players leave on a free and 7 new signings to bed in - that's when you need to settle, not when you've the same upper heirachy in place for over 3 years. Yes you've got to allow your new players time to settle, but the management should have things sorted by now surely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsmini Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Theo will work harder and score plenty of goals for Derby this season, and the crowd will be chanting.... Theo, Theo, Theo!! Before to long Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 A foolish decision to me, lets take out the fact that he was on the bench on Saturday, which leaves 2 days training at most in which he could have looked poor in. Fans are starting to doubt Clough now big time, people are already questioning his man management of players as well as his tactics, and he drops the top scorer from last season from the team, whilst putting on the sheet, someone who has looked poor to average in most games he has ever featured for Derby. If Clough really thinks that dropping him from the squad is the only way he can get a point across then fair enough, he has his own style, but it comes across to me as poor man management yet again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcnram Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I'm not just saying that because we've lost two games. I genuinely believe Clough's man management techniques are the worst I've seen. Countless times he makes sly digs at players, treats them like crap and leaves them out for no apparent reason. He's been in charge for probably the same number of games as those three combined and still can't go a season without there being some kind of rift in the camp. And this is his camp now, no excuses. Who has he treated like crap or left out for no apparent reason? What/when are those rifts that you are talking about because I don't see or hear any of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chewbacca Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Clough seemed to be over critical of Robinson and Tyson after the Scunny game. Obviously Tyson has reacted well in training and Robinson hasn't. It's the Robinson not being on the bench part that is perplexing to me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcnram Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 A foolish decision to me, lets take out the fact that he was on the bench on Saturday, which leaves 2 days training at most in which he could have looked poor in. Fans are starting to doubt Clough now big time, people are already questioning his man management of players as well as his tactics, and he drops the top scorer from last season from the team, whilst putting on the sheet, someone who has looked poor to average in most games he has ever featured for Derby. If Clough really thinks that dropping him from the squad is the only way he can get a point across then fair enough, he has his own style, but it comes across to me as poor man management yet again. So long as the players are with him which they clearly are, it doesn't matter one iota what the fans imagine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 ...poor man management? I really don't get this nonsense every time it comes up. People seem to just like the sound of it, but really... where is the poor man management? A poor man manage should fail to get the best out of players, yet Nigel has arguably seen many of our players from poor form to the form of their life, and not just once or twice, by many multiple times. There seems to be this myth on here that man management means that you suck up to the players and give them anything and everything they want, when I don't recall a single successful manager ever doing this. When motivating players it is, has and likely always will be a fine line between getting the best out of them and them falling in a bit of a heap, but that's the nature of professional sport. The issue with pushing players to do their best is that you can't always be the friend in the process, sometimes this can go wrong and Nigel has his own way of dealing with this. But whatever your feelings about Nigel's ability to deal with players who he can't see eye to eye with, its hard to argue with his record of getting players playing. What's more apparent is when players do leave the club, they have rarely gone onto bigger and better things, but such things are avoided in these discussions as its not convenient when trying to find a good stick to beat Clough's reputation with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Teale Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Dropping a player is a good way to get them to realise they've not been doing well, or doing enough. You can waffle on at them all day and all night, but unless you show them you're serious nothing is ever going to happen. I honestly don't think having Theo out there would have made a difference either. Tyson and Sammon are now the first choice pairing, so Theo would only have ever come off the bench. Having him and Tyson on up front was never going to be overly useful, and to be honest Bennett can and by the sounds of it did do alright. Theo is the kind of player that the club can't afford to allowed to be lazy. He's not a hugely talented player, he is going to need to put the effort in. Ironically a lot of player spent most of last season that Theo is another one of Nigel's hard working players who lacks talent, but now he's been left out due to not working hard enough we're talking as though Nigel left out someone of Maradona like skill for not running enough. So haveing our top scorer last season and a player who has scored 1 from 1 starts this season wouldnt have made any difference? When him and Tyson started remind me how many we scored? Shouldnt they players listen to the manger especially if he is going on and on? Is dropping them the only way to make them listen? Im sure Fergie has more then one trick to make them listen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ripleyram88 Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 If he's not trying hard enough in training then it is 100% correct that he has been dropped. What example is it to the younger players that we have if he was left in the team? "you don't try hard enough in training but because you were good last year your in the team" you need to set this example to other players in the team. Theres no poor man management going on from clough its hardly like he will have dropped him and not told him until his post match interview, im sure they had a chat beforehand. Theo has obviously reacted well, making it very public that he has gone to the game to cheer on the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIMBAUD Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 That's what comes across from an outside POV - he's been at Derby 3.5 years now and there's always something unsettling the team. People have sited "we just need time to settle/gel" as an excuse similar to the Forest situation - but at Forest we had an owner die, the club look like going out of existence, 3 different managers in a year (the last of which came in with only 4 weeks before KO), a boat load of players leave on a free and 7 new signings to bed in - that's when you need to settle, not when you've the same upper heirachy in place for over 3 years. Yes you've got to allow your new players time to settle, but the management should have things sorted by now surely? who says it's unsettling the team? you. what do you know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 On the contrary, other managers such as Tony Pulis & have indeed said positive things about what he has done at Derby - maybe because they are within the game, understand the game and what he has done with the resources available to him. That was when Stoke came with 6,000 wasn't it? I respect Tony Pulis but he is cut from the same cloth as Clough,there are lots of similarities between the two. Both old school, both given time to build, both wear track suits. They both play football the same way and buy players who will die for the shirt. I just hate that style of management, after all football is the beautiful game and should be played first and foremost. Most fans respect what Clough has done with the resources available to him, it's just getting tiresome hearing the same excuses and seeing the same mistakes. 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':(' /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIMBAUD Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 If he's not trying hard enough in training then it is 100% correct that he has been dropped. What example is it to the younger players that we have if he was left in the team? "you don't try hard enough in training but because you were good last year your in the team" you need to set this example to other players in the team. Theres no poor man management going on from clough its hardly like he will have dropped him and not told him until his post match interview, im sure they had a chat beforehand. Theo has obviously reacted well, making it very public that he has gone to the game to cheer on the team. yes and we ask clough the question - he answers honestly and still all the drama queens piss their pants. seems to me that if theo has taken it on the chin and got on with it. NC has often praised him for 'listening' in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 So haveing our top scorer last season and a player who has scored 1 from 1 starts this season wouldnt have made any difference? When him and Tyson started remind me how many we scored? Shouldnt they players listen to the manger especially if he is going on and on? Is dropping them the only way to make them listen? Im sure Fergie has more then one trick to make them listen ...David Beckham... Different managers do different things, and if a player isn't doing what he's asked and there are others who are, then why not give the other players a chance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ripleyram88 Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 So haveing our top scorer last season and a player who has scored 1 from 1 starts this season wouldnt have made any difference? When him and Tyson started remind me how many we scored? Shouldnt they players listen to the manger especially if he is going on and on? Is dropping them the only way to make them listen? Im sure Fergie has more then one trick to make them listen Fergie does drop players. He even sold his arguably best player once (stam) because he did something he didnt like! Being top scorer last season means nothing whatsoever, this is a new season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Also, my favourite complaint I've seen since the match was "we have a 16 and 17 year old up front" (or words to that effect). You know, the other days Hughes was our best player, a sure starter and a future England international, now its a mistake to bring him off the bench along side the other striker on the bench. I also enjoyed seeing on the match chat people immediately complaining when Jacobs and Bennett were to be brought on. Its as though people have no decided that all substitutions are inherently bad if Clough makes them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCFCfranco Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I would say it's wrong to bring Hughes on as a striker seeing as he's a midfielder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alf-Inge of Fudge Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 who says it's unsettling the team? you. what do you know? I know it's unsettling the fans, and unless the "Nigel Clough's not good enough" thread is an illusion I'd say some Derby fans are rightly concerned about Clough's management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Teale Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Fergie does drop players. He even sold his arguably best player once (stam) because he did something he didnt like! Being top scorer last season means nothing whatsoever, this is a new season. Which he has scored 1 in 1 start. A game in which we also scored 5 goals. Not that bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcnram Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I know it's unsettling the fans, and unless the "Nigel Clough's not good enough" thread is an illusion I'd say some Derby fans are rightly concerned about Clough's management. Only the 'drama queens' 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/ph34r' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':ph34r:' /> Every club has them, they are harmless really 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':D' /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I know it's unsettling the fans, and unless the "Nigel Clough's not good enough" thread is an illusion I'd say some Derby fans are rightly concerned about Clough's management. There are people around the world who are concerned that Evolution is being taught in schools, some people are just like that, argumentum ad populum is a fallacy, just because there is a thread about it doesn't mean there's a problem. Had we not conceded that late goal against Ssausagehorpe, then another against Sheffield Wednesday, we'd have gone into the last match taking about our promotion prospects, forums as a general rule over react to a ridiculous degree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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