May Contain Nuts Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 We're fighting relegation because we started the season with the following squad GK: Marshall, Roos, Ravas DEFENCE: Byrne, Buchanan, Wisdom, Forsyth, te Wierik, Clarke, Davis, Soloman MIDFIELD: Rooney, Bird, Sibley, Knight, Shinnie, Evans, Holmes, J Brown, Ibrahim ATTACK: Marriott, Whittaker, Shonibare, Jamahl Hector-Ingram (+Jozwiak a few games in) ..by the time Lawrence & Waghorn were ready to play (and as a point of order they weren't cited as 'saviours' despite what some claim) we were already in crisis mode, trying to avoid conceding at all costs because... well look at the squad! Where were the goals? Marriott, JHI, Whittaker? All not wanted & let to leave the club by Rooney. He hasn't managed to get Waghorn scoring or tease more end product out of Jozwiak, he doesn't use Sibley, Knight hasn't been a goal threat, and it remains to be seen whether he can (or even wants to) do anything with Lawrence. People are kidding themselves if they think Rooney would have been able to get much more from the first 10-12 games. A little, perhaps, but nothing significant. We also had the ridiculous situation of having all of Cocu, vd Weerden, Scheepers, Rooney, Rosenior & Given as first team coaches with Justin Walker & Shane Nicholson thrown in for good measure. Even the reduced 'coaching committee' once Cocu left was too many separate voices as Rooney quickly realised - it it any wonder things turned into a convoluted mess of contrasting ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 3 hours ago, Chris_Martin said: Maybe not, but we're not as bad as you think The league table simply doesn’t lie at this point in the season and neither does it for the other teams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 31 minutes ago, Coconut said: We're fighting relegation because we started the season with the following squad GK: Marshall, Roos, Ravas DEFENCE: Byrne, Buchanan, Wisdom, Forsyth, te Wierik, Clarke, Davis, Soloman MIDFIELD: Rooney, Bird, Sibley, Knight, Shinnie, Evans, Holmes, J Brown, Ibrahim ATTACK: Marriott, Whittaker, Shonibare, Jamahl Hector-Ingram (+Jozwiak a few games in) ..by the time Lawrence & Waghorn were ready to play (and as a point of order they weren't cited as 'saviours' despite what some claim) we were already in crisis mode, trying to avoid conceding at all costs because... well look at the squad! Where were the goals? Marriott, JHI, Whittaker? All not wanted & let to leave the club by Rooney. He hasn't managed to get Waghorn scoring or tease more end product out of Jozwiak, he doesn't use Sibley, Knight hasn't been a goal threat, and it remains to be seen whether he can (or even wants to) do anything with Lawrence. People are kidding themselves if they think Rooney would have been able to get much more from the first 10-12 games. A little, perhaps, but nothing significant. We also had the ridiculous situation of having all of Cocu, vd Weerden, Scheepers, Rooney, Rosenior & Given as first team coaches with Justin Walker & Shane Nicholson thrown in for good measure. Even the reduced 'coaching committee' once Cocu left was too many separate voices as Rooney quickly realised - it it any wonder things turned into a convoluted mess of contrasting ideas? The following squad was down to Cocu. We've just seen Rooney get 5 players in with almost no outlay I imagine. If you think Cocu couldn't say who he did and didn't want on his management team then how has Rooney managed? Don't you think, as Curtis Davies has mentioned, that Cocu's coaching being over-complicated and training somewhat dull, didn't help either?! Cocu had us heading to Laegue 1. That will take some turning around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Contain Nuts Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 19 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: The following squad was down to Cocu. We've just seen Rooney get 5 players in with almost no outlay I imagine. If you think Cocu couldn't say who he did and didn't want on his management team then how has Rooney managed? Don't you think, as Curtis Davies has mentioned, that Cocu's coaching being over-complicated and training somewhat dull, didn't help either?! Cocu had us heading to Laegue 1. That will take some turning around. As expected, just blame absolutely everything on Cocu, it's automatic and an easy out. My post didn't even claim that any of it couldn't be attributred to him, I was objectively pointing out the reasons why we're where we are. Not defending Cocu or criticising Rooney. Fact is whoever was in charge at the start of the season, that squad was not going to get positive results. We've just seen Rooney get 5 players in... but whether or not they make a positive contribution and prove good enough / suited to a relegation battle remains to be seen. We'll see how transformative he's been now Bielik's out. So far, so Rotherham 3-0 Derby. ps Was Cocu planning on having us relocate to a different country? France has Ligue 1, Germany has the Bundesliga 2, where's Laegue 1? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ram-Alf Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 25 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: The following squad was down to Cocu. We've just seen Rooney get 5 players in with almost no outlay I imagine. If you think Cocu couldn't say who he did and didn't want on his management team then how has Rooney managed? Don't you think, as Curtis Davies has mentioned, that Cocu's coaching being over-complicated and training somewhat dull, didn't help either?! Cocu had us heading to Laegue 1. That will take some turning around. Bogle and Lowe said similar to Curtis Davies once they'd signed for the Blades, Makes you wonder if others who are still here had the same thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 12 minutes ago, Coconut said: As expected, just blame absolutely everything on Cocu, it's automatic and an easy out. Lol. Well he was the manager. Who else gets players into the squad? Seriously silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Contain Nuts Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 17 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: Lol. Well he was the manager. Who else gets players into the squad? Seriously silly. It's posts like this that make it pointless talking to you. One eyed scapegoating baalocks. You know full well that the manager is only one part of the recruitment process, and plays no part in contract negotiations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rammy03 Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 14 minutes ago, Coconut said: It's posts like this that make it pointless talking to you. One eyed scapegoating baalocks. You know full well that the manager is only one part of the recruitment process, and plays no part in contract negotiations. I think both cocu and Mel are to blame for this season. This has been in the making for a few years now and it's caught up with us. That is Mel's responsibility. The team we started the season with was poor by our standards but it's still good enough on paper to have us mid table. That is cocus responsibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Contain Nuts Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 3 minutes ago, Rammy03 said: I think both cocu and Mel are to blame for this season. This has been in the making for a few years now and it's caught up with us. That is Mel's responsibility. The team we started the season with was poor by our standards but it's still good enough on paper to have us mid table. That is cocus responsibility. How so? Even with CKR improving the attack and Bielik offering a defensive shield & driving forward from midfield under Rooney (starting with Wycombe) we've only scored 13 goals in 14 games (works out at 42 goals a season), with 4 of them in one match and having failed to score in 6 of them. CKR & Bielik have 7 of that 13, so over 50% How would we go about finishing mid-table with a team which would struggle to score 20 goals between them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BramcoteRam84 Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 We’re where we are because of our horrendous start to the season. 6 points from 13 games is one of the worst starts ever in the championship. Always meant this was going to be a battle, as demonstrated by the fact we are 6th in the form table since Rooney took charge and we’re still 4th bottom. No one is saying we’re a top six side. We will have a dip and we don’t have much margin for error. We don’t score enough goals but under Rooney we create good chances in most games, early season we didn’t create anything. With the additions I’m confident we will score more. We have 19 games left to get 24 points which should see us safe on 52. Even with a dip in form that is very achievable at 1.26 points per game. If we keep the current 1.57 points per game up then we will be much more comfortable. If it does go to the wire, we’ve got Birmingham and Wednesday at home in the last 3 games. It’s in our hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Coconut said: It's posts like this that make it pointless talking to you. One eyed scapegoating baalocks. You know full well that the manager is only one part of the recruitment process, and plays no part in contract negotiations. Lol. You need to convince people that all the little bitty bits you throw out are huge reasons why it wasn't down (for various specifics) to Cocu! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Martin Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 3 hours ago, Sparkle said: The league table simply doesn’t lie at this point in the season and neither does it for the other teams Yes we are in a relegation battle at the moment. But that is because of Cocu. You cannot say we are a bad team now when the table since Rooney has been in charge has us in the play offs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abu Derby Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 We should have dispensed with Phil’s services four or five weeks sooner. It was patently obvious what was going to happen when the awful form (also including the calamitous collapse towards the end of last season) was taken into account. We’d have saved our season if action had been taken sooner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Contain Nuts Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 1 hour ago, RoyMac5 said: Lol. You need to convince people that all the little bitty bits you throw out are huge reasons why it wasn't down (for various specifics) to Cocu! What a bizarre post. If something is a significant factor in where we find ourselves I'll point it out and try to find a fair and reasonable as to how and why it happened. How very dare I! I'll say this, a full season under Cocu, despite the various off-field antics making it one of the most tumultuous seasons in our recent history (thanks in part to the irresponsible and shitty leadership of @Finch's favourite... it's no wonder he applauded your post because he hates anyone who criticises Keogh) and despite all the complaints about his style of play or any comments about training we managed to finish tenth We had a mid-season run of winning 10 in 17, scoring at least one goal for 18 matches in a row (35 goals in 18 games) with a squad arguably weaker than the one we have now. I'll be delighted if Rooney's squad & signings produce that sort of form for the remainder of the season. There's no excuse not to, you can't blame Cocu forever.... well, you can, but that's your petty business. Unlike yourself I'm trying to take a fair and even-handed look at our current situation and how it's happened. That takes more effort than you're willing to put in. Does that mean I think Cocu would have turned it around this season? No. Does it mean I think he should still be our manager? No. Does it mean that I'm not fully behind Rooney and the good things he's done so far? Again, no. I don't need to convince anyone of anything, it's a pointless and thankless task. If we get relegated from the position we're in right now though, that won't be Cocu's fault, he left with 34 games remaining! Thankfully I think bringing Roberts in may prove to be a masterstroke, so I still can't see that happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brammie Steve Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 Championship football management may be thankless but it pays pretty well! To both heroes and zeroes apparently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Martin Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 3 hours ago, Coconut said: We're fighting relegation because we started the season with the following: Cocu. edited for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Contain Nuts Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 10 minutes ago, Chris_Martin said: edited for you. Genuine question despite your pathetic troll post. Where do you reckon we'd be in the table if we'd sacked Cocu on the eve of the first game of the season and given the job to Rooney there and then? I'd go for 5 more points and 17th place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramit Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 Ah, the blood pressure cooking possible impending doom scenario. Are we having fun yet? At least we're not bored. Safe mid-table position is so overrated, don't ya think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rammy03 Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 3 hours ago, Coconut said: Even with CKR improving the attack and Bielik offering a defensive shield & driving forward from midfield under Rooney (starting with Wycombe) we've only scored 13 goals in 14 games (works out at 42 goals a season), with 4 of them in one match and having failed to score in 6 of them. CKR & Bielik have 7 of that 13, so over 50% How would we go about finishing mid-table with a team which would struggle to score 20 goals between them? This team from the start of the season on paper you'd expect to finish mid table. Very unlikely we'll do that now but that's down to our horrendous first half of the season. Once you hit rock bottom it's very difficult to turn it around to such an extent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Contain Nuts Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 6 minutes ago, Rammy03 said: This team from the start of the season on paper you'd expect to finish mid table. Very unlikely we'll do that now but that's down to our horrendous first half of the season. Once you hit rock bottom it's very difficult to turn it around to such an extent. I mostly agree when you add the new loans, CKR & Bielik Without Bielik I remain unconvinced but we'll see how Rooney navigates that and how well Baningime does... fingers crossed! 'This team' now isn't 'the team' Rooney had producing top 6 form and it's very different in balance to 'that team' we could name at the start of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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