New management team required - NOW

[GboroRam]

11 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

I don't know, do you? More than one - 32Red are big sponsors. How many of those have stipulations they have to play do you know?

According to The Daily Telegraph, he was the first. So unlikely there's many of them. It was "a new model" that "reinvented the model of sponsorship".

32Red general manager, Nick Banbury, told the Daily Telegraph:

“This record-breaking sponsorship agreement is a significant step for us as we continue to reinvent the model of sponsorship to benefit both club and community.

“Our partnership with Derby County Community Trust and the extended relationship with Derby County Football Club shows a new model for football club sponsorship is possible.”

So odds are, he's on some fairly bespoke kind of contract. 

[BondJovi]

11 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

I don't know, do you? More than one - 32Red are big sponsors. How many of those have stipulations they have to play do you know?

No one does. But Rooney was part of the coaching staff. He had his say and involvement in team selection. He clearly wasn't picked against his wishes as he picked himself for two games!

[Nuwtfly]

4 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

According to The Daily Telegraph, he was the first. So unlikely there's many of them. It was "a new model" that "reinvented the model of sponsorship".

32Red general manager, Nick Banbury, told the Daily Telegraph:

“This record-breaking sponsorship agreement is a significant step for us as we continue to reinvent the model of sponsorship to benefit both club and community.

“Our partnership with Derby County Community Trust and the extended relationship with Derby County Football Club shows a new model for football club sponsorship is possible.”

So odds are, he's on some fairly bespoke kind of contract. 

I would be very surprised if there was another manager in the Championship who is on more money than Rooney. 

[RoyMac5]

6 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

32Red general manager, Nick Banbury, told the Daily Telegraph:

“This record-breaking sponsorship agreement is a significant step for us as we continue to reinvent the model of sponsorship to benefit both club and community.

“Our partnership with Derby County Community Trust and the extended relationship with Derby County Football Club shows a new model for football club sponsorship is possible.”

So odds are, he's on some fairly bespoke kind of contract. 

https://www.gamblinginsider.com/news/7653/wayne-rooney-to-wear-number-32-as-part-of-32reds-Derby-sponsorship

"...Derby County Executive Chairman, Mel Morris CBE, said: "Obviously, the commercial opportunities this creates are widespread and significant. On the back of Wayne joining the club, we have just been offered a record-breaking sponsorship deal with our principal shirt sponsor, 32Red.

"We are keen to leverage Wayne’s involvement and the support of 32Red with our community initiatives, expanding the work such as the Team Talk mental health programme which is supported by our Community Trust and 32Red.

Gambling Insider has been told reports 32Red is contributing to some of Rooney's wages are wide of the mark."

 

[GboroRam]

6 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

https://www.gamblinginsider.com/news/7653/wayne-rooney-to-wear-number-32-as-part-of-32reds-Derby-sponsorship

"...Derby County Executive Chairman, Mel Morris CBE, said: "Obviously, the commercial opportunities this creates are widespread and significant. On the back of Wayne joining the club, we have just been offered a record-breaking sponsorship deal with our principal shirt sponsor, 32Red.

"We are keen to leverage Wayne’s involvement and the support of 32Red with our community initiatives, expanding the work such as the Team Talk mental health programme which is supported by our Community Trust and 32Red.

Gambling Insider has been told reports 32Red is contributing to some of Rooney's wages are wide of the mark."

 

English second-tier soccer side Derby County have been offered a record-breaking sponsorship deal from their shirt sponsor 32Red, with the betting company now set to pay new signing Wayne Rooney’s reported UK£90,000 (US$109,000) weekly wage.

Derby announced earlier this week they had signed England’s record goalscorer on an 18-month player-coach deal. Though it has not been confirmed how much of Rooney’s wages 32Red will pay, it was also revealed the 33-year-old will wear number 32 for Derby, further fuelling the notion that the deal is primarily serving as a commercial opportunity for 32Red.

https://www.sportspromedia.com/news/wayne-rooney-Derby-county-record-32red-sponsorship-deal

As I said - who knows what's in that contract? I don't.

 

[RoyMac5]

9 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

As I said - who knows what's in that contract? I don't.

I agreed that I don't either.

But it would indeed have been ground-breaking if it included a 'must play' clause.

TBH looking at our midfield, bar Bielik, Rooney could still get a game! That isn't why we were in the relegation zone. That was down to a manager's style of play and training. Not down to having to play Rooney - although those points against Norwich will come in handy! ?

[GboroRam]

3 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

I agreed that I don't either.

But it would indeed have been ground-breaking if it included a 'must play' clause.

TBH looking at our midfield, bar Bielik, Rooney could still get a game! That isn't why we were in the relegation zone. That was down to a manager's style of play and training. Not down to having to play Rooney - although those points against Norwich will come in handy! ?

It doesn't have to include a must play clause. But if I were contributing financially towards a player being at the club, I might specify some penalty if he didn't play. 

[RoyMac5]

5 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

It doesn't have to include a must play clause. But if I were contributing financially towards a player being at the club, I might specify some penalty if he didn't play. 

That's no different (in result) to a manager paying a transfer fee for a player and then not picking him. So there was no reason for Cocu to not play Rooney as his financial situation would have been accounted for. Unless you're suggesting that somewhat like with Thorne Cocu was 'forced' by Mel to play Rooney as we needed the money to run the club?

[BondJovi]

4 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

That's no different (in result) to a manager paying a transfer fee for a player and then not picking him. So there was no reason for Cocu to not play Rooney as his financial situation would have been accounted for. Unless you're suggesting that somewhat like with Thorne Cocu was 'forced' by Mel to play Rooney as we needed the money to run the club?

Judging by the late payments of wages, the transfer embargo a few times... I would say finances were tight enough for such a thing to be possible.

[GboroRam]

17 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

That's no different (in result) to a manager paying a transfer fee for a player and then not picking him. So there was no reason for Cocu to not play Rooney as his financial situation would have been accounted for. Unless you're suggesting that somewhat like with Thorne Cocu was 'forced' by Mel to play Rooney as we needed the money to run the club?

I'm saying I don't know what's in the contract, but some form of penalty is not to be unexpected. Likewise we've seen players sign with a "payment at X number of appearances" clause, which has prevented them playing. 

Contracts are not simple things. I do not profess to know the inner workings of anyone's contract. But it's a far stretch to make that Cocu played Rooney because he wanted him playing. Even Rooney decided he didn't want Rooney playing.

[May Contain Nuts]

Assuming the first Wycombe game as his first in 'sole charge', Rooney's performance without Bielik:
Won 4, Drawn 4, Lost 7. Goals scored 14, Goals against 21

Extrapolated over the course of the season so far that would put us on... oh, 42-43 points from 40 games, exactly as we have now!  (but 37 GF / 56 GA)

....but that's with a fit CKR from the start, & then with Gregory (who has contributed reasonably well) & the other loanees from Feb.

I think it's fair to say that it's not necessarily Rooney's management, playing style or training regimes that's lead to us being outside of the relegation zone, and that had he been working with the squad we had at the start of the season we'd be very much in it.

[RoyMac5]

22 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

But it's a far stretch to make that Cocu played Rooney because he wanted him playing. Even Rooney decided he didn't want Rooney playing.

Those two are not necessarily related except in so far as it seemed the squad wasn't happy with Cocu's football. If there was no 'must play' clause then Cocu picked him to play. However if that was owing to financial 'pressures' from above that was something for Cocu to sort out with Mel.

[RoyMac5]

20 minutes ago, Coconut said:

I think it's fair to say that it's not necessarily Rooney's management, playing style or training regimes that's lead to us being outside of the relegation zone, and that had he been working with the squad we had at the start of the season we'd be very much in it.

Why would Rooney have chosen the same squad at the start of the season that Cocu did?

[TomTom92]

Cocu had to go and I was not in Rooney’s corner at the start at all. Then he won me round by winning and getting us outside the relegation zone. However our performances/results of late have not been good enough. 
  
No point getting rid now as the players still seem to be trying. However once the season is over we need to have a long think about whether Rooney’s the man to lead us forward. 
  
The whole club seems rotten to me and I’m not sure we’ll be any better off come this time next season.

[Ram-Alf]

48 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

I'm saying I don't know what's in the contract, but some form of penalty is not to be unexpected. Likewise we've seen players sign with a "payment at X number of appearances" clause, which has prevented them playing. 

Contracts are not simple things. I do not profess to know the inner workings of anyone's contract. But it's a far stretch to make that Cocu played Rooney because he wanted him playing. Even Rooney decided he didn't want Rooney playing.

Ken Bates stopped Seth Johnson on 49 games for Leeds I believe, As playing 50 games would have stipulated more wages/payment to DCFC.

[Wolfie]

24 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Why would Rooney have chosen the same squad at the start of the season that Cocu did?

What choice would he have had?. Our bench was full of kids earlier in the season.

[RoyMac5]

Just now, Wolfie said:

What choice would he have had?. Our bench was full of kids earlier in the season.

The poster was making up a scenario - it didn't happen if you noticed?

If you're making up a scenario why should Rooney have to be stuck with Cocu's choice? So maybe that is hampering him somewhat presently?

[Wolfie]

4 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

The poster was making up a scenario - it didn't happen if you noticed?

If you're making up a scenario why should Rooney have to be stuck with Cocu's choice? So maybe that is hampering him somewhat presently?

Like the made up scenario that Cocu wanted Rooney to play, despite it being obvious to any onlooker that he wasn't earning his place on merit?. I don't believe that happened either.

A few posters on here keep referring to Cocu being sacked. He wasn't. He left by mutual consent. Who knows why Cocu decided to agree to leave? I don't, but taking the flak for poor results while having to field players who were a liability and costing points would be up there on my list if it were me.

 

[May Contain Nuts]

42 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Why would Rooney have chosen the same squad at the start of the season that Cocu did?

Who's to say he would have had much of a choice, or that our much maligned contract negotiation & recruitment teams would have fared any better at keeping / bringing in his choice of player?

It would depend on when exactly his theoretical earlier appointment took place.

We can only go on the squad we had (and now have), not some squad we've made up in our head to include signings we don't even know who are! You can only look at who has been brought in, even if the circumstances weren't ideal.

Let's say for example in the summer Rooney took over and made similar quality / the same signings as in January - Gregory, Baningime, Roberts, Mengi & Edmondson  -  that would mean that we probably wouldn't have signed Colin Kazim-Richards or Jozwiak, we may not even have brought Matt Clarke back thinking Davies & Mengi would be our main CB pairing.

There's been very little from anyone aside from Gregory you could pinpoint as making a marked difference to the team, so given the impact (or lack of) most of his signings so far have made, and potentially the players we may have lost it's hard to argue that Rooney's been hamstrung by any signings Cocu made or that he'd have bought better

As I've said previously though, I don't want Rooney sacked and we need to give him a proper transfer window to see what sort of player he really wants - I just hope some of the Jan loans weren't indicative of it!

[Rampant]

36 minutes ago, TomTom92 said:

The whole club seems rotten to me and I’m not sure we’ll be any better off come this time next season.

Sadly, this is my main thought too.

On the manager debate, IF we went down the route of change once again then Chris Wilder is an obvious first choice for me.