Harry and Meghan

[SaintRam]

3 minutes ago, ramit said:

Why is that?  Why are they considered fair game when most other discrimination is frowned upon?

I'm not sure there is evidence of them actually being discriminated against.

I don't know if the studies been done but I've never heard about a ginger wage gap, or reduced work opportunities for them, etc.

[Srg]

2 minutes ago, SaintRam said:

I'm not sure there is evidence of them actually being discriminated against.

I don't know if the studies been done but I've never heard about a ginger wage gap, or reduced work opportunities for them, etc.

This thread has fallen so far that there's a legit debate about a ginger wage gap. This is phenomenal stuff.

[SaintRam]

1 minute ago, Srg said:

This thread has fallen so far that there's a legit debate about a ginger wage gap. This is phenomenal stuff.

I'm perfectly happy to push this thread into more and more absurd areas until it dies, to be honest ? 

[ramit]

16 minutes ago, SaintRam said:

I'm not sure there is evidence of them actually being discriminated against.

I don't know if the studies been done but I've never heard about a ginger wage gap, or reduced work opportunities for them, etc.

Targeting a group of people to make fun of them is a form of discrimination, akin to bullying.

i see it done here quite often, just wondered why that is.

[ramit]

17 minutes ago, Srg said:

This thread has fallen so far that there's a legit debate about a ginger wage gap. This is phenomenal stuff.

Which you continue discussing, albeit without any substance, except to mock for the sake of mocking.

Got a problem with me?  Address me directly.

[Srg]

3 minutes ago, ramit said:

Which you continue discussing, albeit without any substance, except to mock for the sake of mocking.

Got a problem with me?  Address me directly.

Me continue discussing? I've barely contributed to this thread. 

This thread is just a bunch of mainly middle aged white blokes talking about a subject they don't have first hand experience of, hence I'm steering clear of being involved in it. There's discrimination wherever you want to find it, and modern times dictate people to be offended about whatever they want to be offended about more than ever. Me personally? Discrimination is whenever you are choosing someone over someone else or stopping someone doing something because of race, colour, creed or gender. If you want to bring in someone being a bit of a ginge as a problem, that's trivialising real issues.

Anyway, back to not being involve in this absurdity.

[ramit]

12 minutes ago, Srg said:

Me continue discussing? I've barely contributed to this thread. 

This thread is just a bunch of mainly middle aged white blokes talking about a subject they don't have first hand experience of, hence I'm steering clear of being involved in it. There's discrimination wherever you want to find it, and modern times dictate people to be offended about whatever they want to be offended about more than ever. Me personally? Discrimination is whenever you are choosing someone over someone else or stopping someone doing something because of race, colour, creed or gender. If you want to bring in someone being a bit of a ginge as a problem, that's trivialising real issues.

Anyway, back to not being involve in this absurdity.

i am no fan of the "woke" constantly offended crowd, yet i oppose discrimination of any kind.  We don't see it the same way, that's alright.

One point i want to address though.  If ginger discrimination is real, dismissing it is trivialising the problem to the max.

[DarkFruitsRam7]

1 hour ago, Angry Ram said:

Was probably a bit harsh in hindsight.. Apologies.

Thanks, no problem.

[Stive Pesley]

39 minutes ago, ramit said:

i am no fan of the "woke" constantly offended crowd

Yeah I mean you can’t even make a lame joke about gingers without someone taking it seriously in the context of the wider discrimination debate these days

[ramit]

33 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said:

Yeah I mean you can’t even make a lame joke about gingers without someone taking it seriously in the context of the wider discrimination debate these days

Taking something seriously does not equate taking offense.  Targeting a group of people with lame jokes on their physical appearance is callous, it causes hurt and resentment and i repeat it is a form of bullying.  The responses i have gotten so far makes me suspect that red headed folks may be so mocked in your country that if they dare mention it they only get more of the same.

i am a dumb blonde btw

[Srg]

2 minutes ago, ramit said:

Taking something seriously does not equate taking offense.  Targeting a group of people with lame jokes on their physical appearance is callous, it causes hurt and resentment and i repeat it is a form of bullying.  The responses i have gotten so far makes me suspect that red headed folks may be so mocked in your country that if they dare mention it they only get more of the same.

i am a dumb blonde btw

Strawberry blonde, per chance?

 

Sorry, that was too easy.

[SaintRam]

3 minutes ago, ramit said:

Taking something seriously does not equate taking offense.  Targeting a group of people with lame jokes on their physical appearance is callous, it causes hurt and resentment and i repeat it is a form of bullying.  The responses i have gotten so far makes me suspect that red headed folks may be so mocked in your country that if they dare mention it they only get more of the same.

i am a dumb blonde btw

At school age people are bullied for being ginger; people are bullied for literally anything there though and its certainly not treated as acceptable. Because bullying just isn't.

In adulthood; it's more of an in-joke for the UK. It is always tongue-in-cheek; at least in my and everyone I've ever known's experience. I've never know anyone to sincerely think differently of people with orange hair than they do anyone else just because of it.

[ramit]

25 minutes ago, SaintRam said:

At school age people are bullied for being ginger; people are bullied for literally anything there though and its certainly not treated as acceptable. Because bullying just isn't.

In adulthood; it's more of an in-joke for the UK. It is always tongue-in-cheek; at least in my and everyone I've ever known's experience. I've never know anyone to sincerely think differently of people with orange hair than they do anyone else just because of it.

Thank you for that explanation, i gladly confess i still have much to learn about UK culture.

As a former recipient of extreme bullying, i suppose i am overly quick to see signs of bullying elsewhere.

[Stive Pesley]

1 minute ago, ramit said:

Thank you for that explanation, i gladly confess i still have much to learn about UK culture.

As a former recipient of extreme bullying, i suppose i am overly quick to see signs bullying elsewhere.

Well it is a form of bullying and god knows the ginger kids at our school were consistently mocked for their hair colour and pale freckly skin

I think it’s wrong and won’t condone any type of body-shaming, but we’re at the point in the woke/anti-woke debate where if someone makes a ginger joke, it’s too tiresome to even bother trying to pull them up on it because you just get “woke-shamed”

For the record my "ginger privilege" joke on this thread was not body-shaming, but  based on the long-standing British urban myth that James Hewitt is Prince Harry’s secret father based on not much more than the fact that they both have ginger hair.

[SaintRam]

14 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said:

Well it is a form of bullying and god knows the ginger kids at our school were consistently mocked for their hair colour and pale freckly skin

I think it’s wrong and won’t condone any type of body-shaming, but we’re at the point in the woke/anti-woke debate where if someone makes a ginger joke, it’s too tiresome to even bother trying to pull them up on it because you just get “woke-shamed”

For the record my "ginger privilege" joke on this thread was not body-shaming, but  based on the long-standing British urban myth that James Hewitt is Prince Harry’s secret father based on not much more than the fact that they both have ginger hair.

They don't mind, their soullessness prevents them from feeling any kinda way about it. My red-headed other half confirmed this for me very early in our relationship.

EDIT: To clarify, my entire point is focused on adulthood. No form of anything even possibly construed as bullying at young ages should be condoned.

 

And, imo - the state of mind should simply be, if you're offending/upsetting the subject of your commentary you should stop. Always. Unless that was your intention in which case you're a Bamford

It never needs to get complicated beyond that; and its the fact that it constantly does - as brigades of people get offended on behalf of other people, that all this spiralling debate started, making things worse, and likely wont end.

[Stive Pesley]

22 minutes ago, SaintRam said:

And, imo - the state of mind should simply be, if you're offending/upsetting the subject of your commentary you should stop. Always.

Of course - but how do you always know? It's a bit of a British trait to laugh along with the joke that you're the butt of. Then go home and cry yourself to sleep

[SaintRam]

12 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said:

Of course - but how do you always know? It's a bit of a British trait to laugh along with the joke that you're the butt of. Then go home and cry yourself to sleep

Not sure about that, I never slept.

And sure, you're not always going to know - although in the vast majority of cases such interaction is saved, when being directed at a subject, for members of the same social group. And in that case that information should get to you eventually as long as said social group isn't held together with flimsy thread.

As for the other cases, its far more reasonable and manageable to attempt to minimise them by making people as aware as possible of the context, environment and tone to better control misinterpretation than it is to attempt to change huge swathes of our culturally deep-rooted social interactions; which is what attempting to cull the type of humour entirely is trying to do.

Lastly, as for the cases when it is not misinterpretation and it is directed at a subject that is not a member of a social group, i.e. a stranger - that is just bullying.

[Comrade 86]

3 hours ago, SaintRam said:

I'm perfectly happy to push this thread into more and more absurd areas until it dies, to be honest ? 

And how's that working out? ?

[SaintRam]

2 minutes ago, 86 Schmokes & a Pancake said:

And how's that working out? ?

Not great. I wasn't expecting anyone to actually engage in a conversation started by the mention of a Ginger pay gap.

Underestimated the seriousness of the individuals in the Jim Smith room, clearly. 

I'll return to watching and waiting for it to spiral into a fight.

[Rev]

5 minutes ago, SaintRam said:

Not great. I wasn't expecting anyone to actually engage in a conversation started by the mention of a Ginger pay gap.

Underestimated the seriousness of the individuals in the Jim Smith room, clearly. 

I'll return to watching and waiting for it to spiral into a fight.

God  (@David) has granted you untold powers, embrace it and use them.