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Ollie Watkins - Signed for Brentford


Arsene Titman

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7 minutes ago, Kernow said:

It is a fair point though, because it does seem like a bargain.

£500k for Curtis Davies is a bargain. £2mil for Huddlestone is a bargain. Hughes was a bargain for Watford. All only had one team reported to be in for them.

I can't really think of a reason for it, there must be some sort of agreement early on in these deals before they become common knowledge. Sometimes those agreements are broken when players change their mind, but if you're true to your word then there's no point in teams bidding for a player they won't get.

Could be the next Deli Alli, no idea, just always puzzles me when I see so many fans calling for a player that will have had so little TV time, let's be honest most of our opinions are gained from highlight shows or YouTube videos, literally impossible to watch that much football to have great knowledge on players across all leagues.

When you drop as low as Exeter though the TV time is severely limited so I find it hard to understand how so many can rate this kid so highly to say Derby have missed a trick here when 22 other clubs also didn't move.

Maybe the likes of Burton wouldn't be able to afford that but you're talking 20 odd clubs that don't have a place in their team for a goalscoring future star? 

I will be watching out for him more closely next season, see how he gets on, won't be eating any humble pie though as I've never knocked the lad, just questioned the validity of opinions on him

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I was told by my work mates, who had connections With Ollie Watkins that he was 100% leaving Exeter this summer and going to a championship club. I wonder, if Ollie had told them this, surely his agent must have been dealing with a few championship sides who had shown interest in him. We will never know if, come the 11th hour besides Brentford were we in the running as well.  

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On Monday, February 13, 2017 at 21:08, plymouthram said:

A workmate of mine, who is a regular at Exeter city matches(being an avid fan of the Grecians) told me last week that word is its a done deal and Ollie Watkins is joining the Rams in the summer for £2.25M. He states that a couple of home games ago the fans were talking about it on the terraces. So if its true it could be a good deal for both clubs.

 

On Tuesday, February 28, 2017 at 19:24, plymouthram said:

Just been told today by one of my work mates. His step-son is in the Exeter City squad (do not want to give his name) But like Ollie Watkins he lives in the Torbay area and was taking Ollie home from Exeter (they share lifts) when Ollie's phone went. It was Steve Mac informing him that he had spoken to his club and put in a verbal bid in for £4M and that Tidsdale (Manager) had stated he wanted more. This is not a made up story because this work mate of mine is not one to spin a tale and was not aware of the interest by Derby until his step-son told him about the incident. As you can gather I live in Plymouth and work in the Newton Abbot area, so you can take this as a good scoop.

Lol. ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

 

 

Anyway good luck to the lad at Brentford though. 

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10 hours ago, Derby_EnglandLoyal said:

 

Lol. ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

 

 

Anyway good luck to the lad at Brentford though. 

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1 hour ago, rammieib said:

Kind of depressing that Brentford are going into the season with Watkins and Jota as they creative wide guys and we are going in with Weimann and Russell. I know who I'd prefer to have.

Yeh - Weimann and Russell thanks

Wouldn't mind Jota but Watkins is totally unproven at this level - Where Russell has been a pivotal part of two playoff teams and Weimann has played (and looked decent) on a semi-regular basis in the Premier League

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15 minutes ago, cheron85 said:

Yeh - Weimann and Russell thanks

Wouldn't mind Jota but Watkins is totally unproven at this level - Where Russell has been a pivotal part of two playoff teams and Weimann has played (and looked decent) on a semi-regular basis in the Premier League

Russell was pivotal? Think you need to look up the definition of Pivotal. Think you could have put many players into his position in those two teams and the outcome would be similar.

Weimann did look OK in the Premiership I agree - he's looked dog awful in the Championship.

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7 minutes ago, rammieib said:

Russell was pivotal? Think you need to look up the definition of Pivotal. Think you could have put many players into his position in those two teams and the outcome would be similar.

Weimann did look OK in the Premiership I agree - he's looked dog awful in the Championship.

I do wonder sometimes if people have forgotten what watching Derby was like 6-7 years ago - Even in 12/13 we finished respectably mid-table and had the likes of Jacobs, Tyson and Ben Davies as wingers

Russell has been a consistent pick by a series of managers - Was wanted by now Premier League Brighton to help their promotion push - Has scored 9 league goals in each playoff season (there were only 6 wingers who got more than that last season) - Whoscored.com rated him the 4th best winger in the league 13/14 so I think we can consider him and Wardy to be pivotal

I also think maybe go back and watch Ben Davies for a bit before writing off Weimann - He was a perfectly respectable winger for us for a season or so - Solid mid-table material - And Weimann is light years ahead of him in quality

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1 hour ago, cheron85 said:

I do wonder sometimes if people have forgotten what watching Derby was like 6-7 years ago - Even in 12/13 we finished respectably mid-table and had the likes of Jacobs, Tyson and Ben Davies as wingers

Russell has been a consistent pick by a series of managers - Was wanted by now Premier League Brighton to help their promotion push - Has scored 9 league goals in each playoff season (there were only 6 wingers who got more than that last season) - Whoscored.com rated him the 4th best winger in the league 13/14 so I think we can consider him and Wardy to be pivotal

I also think maybe go back and watch Ben Davies for a bit before writing off Weimann - He was a perfectly respectable winger for us for a season or so - Solid mid-table material - And Weimann is light years ahead of him in quality

We're now looking at the performances he put in 3 to 4 years ago. I'm looking at the performances he gave us last season. One goal in 23 games and 1 assist (I'm taking the 1 assist from someone else's post) so by the same right you are comparing his form of 4 years ago, I'm comparing his form of last season. You have to admit a 1 in 21 man as a winger is not good enough surely?

For me, I'd expect 15 goals/assists total from my wingers in 40 games. If we want to be top 2 (realistically top 6) I think that's a genuine return to expect. If you think Russell and Weimann will deliver than OK - but recent form including pre-season suggests not.

Also - the fact we know GR is looking to strengthen these positions is evidence enough he doesn't believe what we currently have is good enough.

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2 hours ago, rammieib said:

Russell was pivotal? Think you need to look up the definition of Pivotal. Think you could have put many players into his position in those two teams and the outcome would be similar.

I was looking at his 13/14 form because you asked me about it in the quote above - I said he was pivotal in our 3rd place finish - You questioned that - I went and made an argument that he was

1 minute ago, rammieib said:

We're now looking at the performances he put in 3 to 4 years ago. I'm looking at the performances he gave us last season. One goal in 23 games and 1 assist (I'm taking the 1 assist from someone else's post) so by the same right you are comparing his form of 4 years ago, I'm comparing his form of last season. You have to admit a 1 in 21 man as a winger is not good enough surely?

For me, I'd expect 15 goals/assists total from my wingers in 40 games. If we want to be top 2 (realistically top 6) I think that's a genuine return to expect. If you think Russell and Weimann will deliver than OK - but recent form including pre-season suggests not.

Also - the fact we know GR is looking to strengthen these positions is evidence enough he doesn't believe what we currently have is good enough.

As for your goals/assists target - Who cares if the team gets promoted - You might want to check how many of Huddersfields wingers hit that target - How many of Brightons and Newcastles other than Knockaert and Ritchie

I've quoted the stats on another thread (Toral?) but if you compare to his contemporaries even last season he wasn't 'bad' - He just wasn't as good as he had been previously - Ask Eden Hazard about the 15-16 season - Even world class players can have a whole bad season - There is no reason whatsoever that Russell with a bit more confidence couldn't be good for us next season

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8 minutes ago, cheron85 said:

I was looking at his 13/14 form because you asked me about it in the quote above - I said he was pivotal in our 3rd place finish - You questioned that - I went and made an argument that he was

As for your goals/assists target - Who cares if the team gets promoted - You might want to check how many of Huddersfields wingers hit that target - How many of Brightons and Newcastles other than Knockaert and Ritchie

I've quoted the stats on another thread (Toral?) but if you compare to his contemporaries even last season he wasn't 'bad' - He just wasn't as good as he had been previously - Ask Eden Hazard about the 15-16 season - Even world class players can have a whole bad season - There is no reason whatsoever that Russell with a bit more confidence couldn't be good for us next season

If the team gets promoted, you're right I don't care. If we win every game 1-0 (Our defence looks solid!) and between the front 6 they all contribute 1 in 6 games, of course I'd take that. Reality is somewhat different.

We get excited about someone like Toral simply because we don't have any evidence to say whether he would be any good or not so we always take the positive side (Helps being a foreigner). He could be as awful as Weimann and there is every chance to it.

By the way, Brighton had four players in double digits of goals and 16 different scorers.

Huddersfield only had two players but again, 16 players contributed with goals.

Derby had Ince (21 combined goals and assists), Bent 13 goals, and nobody else contributed double digits between both. Both those players have gone or become unavailable. Granted Martin will replace Bents contribution.

Our wingers last season:

Russell - 6 combined

Anya - 4 combined

Blackman - 1 combined

Camara - 2 combined

Weimann - nothing in a Derby shirt. (2 or 3 goals for Wolves?)


So everything combined from all our other players doesn't get near to what Tom Ince gave us.

Its critical for the success of this season that we have two wingers that contribute 15 goals/assists combined for all. We're mid table without it. If you genuinely think the existing players can do that then OK but I don't have any evidence to the case they can.

 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, rammieib said:

By the way, Brighton had four players in double digits of goals and 16 different scorers.

3 strikers and 1 winger

4 minutes ago, rammieib said:

Huddersfield only had two players but again, 16 players contributed with goals.

1 striker and 1 winger - Same as us last season

Oh and we had 17 goalscorers last season - Not sure what the point of that was? We didn't get enough goals in the first stage of the season...

7 minutes ago, rammieib said:

Its critical for the success of this season that we have two wingers that contribute 15 goals/assists combined for all. We're mid table without it. If you genuinely think the existing players can do that then OK but I don't have any evidence to the case they can.

You're writing off Russell for having a single bad season - Even world class players like Eden Hazard can have a bad season

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Lol comparing Russell to hazard, completely different type of player. I wonder how many last ditch tackles or goal line clearances hazard made last season? I'm guessing no where near as many as Russell. Russell is a good solid championship winger who does a job for the team and helps out a lot defensively, providing the platform for others to score/ create goals. Give the guy a break 

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30 minutes ago, hughesy 1984 said:

Lol comparing Russell to hazard, completely different type of player. I wonder how many last ditch tackles or goal line clearances hazard made last season? I'm guessing no where near as many as Russell. Russell is a good solid championship winger who does a job for the team and helps out a lot defensively, providing the platform for others to score/ create goals. Give the guy a break 

:blink:

Would you like to talk to someone professional about that head wound?

I was comparing a single element of their careers - Notably that both have had a poor season at some point - Hazard had one in 15/16 - Russell had one in 16/17 - No other elements of the players have been compared

Russell would win in a fight with Hazard for instance - Because he is a little scottish nutter - But that has zero relevance to anything...

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1 minute ago, cheron85 said:

:blink:

Would you like to talk to someone professional about that head wound?

I was comparing a single element of their careers - Notably that both have had a poor season at some point - Hazard had one in 15/16 - Russell had one in 16/17 - No other elements of the players have been compared

Russell would win in a fight with Hazard for instance - Because he is a little scottish nutter - But that has zero relevance to anything...

He wouldn't win a beauty contest though?

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