Mucker1884

I think its clear that safe standing is the way forward, so at Derby the south stand should be safe standing, and advertised as such. The away corner could then be split half standing, half sitting. Then enforce the rules, persistent standers are warned, then removed. Simple.
The current situation where persistent standing is stopping people attending an away game, is surely just a matter of observing/enforcing the rules, and a level of courtesy to others. I agree, the clubs doing nothing is really no longer an option.
 

Subbing out to a world leading massive international far-reaching company that "operates from its base in the UK’s sporting stronghold of Manchester" that provides "online, retail and end-to-end event solutions for over 30 partners across various sports", and who also "has relationships with globally recognised English Premier League, La Liga, Bundesliga and Ligue 1 clubs, along with representation across all major US Sports Leagues, Golf, Rugby, F1, esports and Tennis" isn't all it's cracked up to be!
Hopefully Mr Clowes will acknowledge this in due time* and perhaps look to put the club shop back in the hands of the club, ran & managed by DCFC employees.
Currently, Derby County fans, as individuals, are far too small and insignificant for a company such as the mighty Fanatics Mega-Co to give two hoots about.
 
 
 
*I fully appreciate Mr Clowes almost certainly has more pressing matters to prioritise and attend to first, but there's no getting away from the fact that the club shop, the majority of the merchandise within it, the stock levels, and certainly the on-line arm of "The Shop", is a full on bucket of dog-poo, and many of us shy away from actually spending money in there, despite us having the financial means to, and as much as we'd like to!  

In my defence, I was referring to the (any) all-seater stadium, as a whole.  (Clearly we don't have 16,000+ standers in a sell out at Pride Park). 
However, ignoring that aspect, and assuming you are referring specifically to away sections, and specifically Derby away sections, can either of us claim to know how many are standing voluntarily, and how many are simply standing due to other's standing, and blocking their view should they remain seated?  I certainly can't, but that was the point I was trying... and clearly failing... to get across.
It is literally the domino effect in reverse, due to the design of the seating areas.
But I'm fully aware that, yes, the majority of our away fans currently do stand.  That wasn't my point, and I should have made that clearer.
Without further info/data/statistics (Exit Poll!), I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.
I'm not even advocating the current rules.  My opinion on that matters not.  The rules are in place, have been in place for years, and it seems annually, clubs have become more and more lenient towards those that break these rules... and more and more posters on here are occasionally now speaking out against the standers.
So they should... in my opinion.
?

In my defence, I was referring to the (any) all-seater stadium, as a whole.  (Clearly we don't have 16,000+ standers in a sell out at Pride Park). 
However, ignoring that aspect, and assuming you are referring specifically to away sections, and specifically Derby away sections, can either of us claim to know how many are standing voluntarily, and how many are simply standing due to other's standing, and blocking their view should they remain seated?  I certainly can't, but that was the point I was trying... and clearly failing... to get across.
It is literally the domino effect in reverse, due to the design of the seating areas.
But I'm fully aware that, yes, the majority of our away fans currently do stand.  That wasn't my point, and I should have made that clearer.
Without further info/data/statistics (Exit Poll!), I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.
I'm not even advocating the current rules.  My opinion on that matters not.  The rules are in place, have been in place for years, and it seems annually, clubs have become more and more lenient towards those that break these rules... and more and more posters on here are occasionally now speaking out against the standers.
So they should... in my opinion.
?

I agree with what you’re saying re the long term solutions, but for the here and now, clubs can simply announce that they are clamping down, and activating the rules that are already in place. They could even offer an unofficial compromise whereas for the first game, standers are merely warned. Next game, they go out. 
yes, it will take time to come up with long term solutions, to effectively suit all… or the majority.
But at the moment, the majority are losing out, as the minority are being allowed to ignore current rules/legislation. 
I repeat, that is wrong!
 

I'm trying really, really hard not to doubt you mate.  And I am most certainly reluctant to accuse you of deliberate falsehoods, so I'm more than happy to accept what you say.
However, I just find it fascinating, that merely by standing up from a seated position, and losing balance, someone can fall over nine rows of seats, to the tenth row below.
No pushing, no surging, no shoving, no shenanigans, no intoxication.  No clear aisles, but actually over the rows of seats.
And not just once, as you refer to these experiences in the plural.  You are blessed, to have witnessed such scenes.  
 
I beg you mate... please, please, please take your phone next time, and video it.  At the very least, you could make £250 of that Jeremy Hill fella, or whatever his name is. 
??

Give me Kumbaya any day of the week over songs about Stan Collymore’s choice of headwear.

Yes. But I draw the line at people taking mars bars into Pride Park, which is a flagrant breach of the rules. We need to root out those yobs!

Used to know! ? ? ?

Mine is the phrase "living my best life".  Someone at work has it as there go to phrase 3 times a day for the last 2 years as they go on and on about doing something else. This will happen soon.
 

Well I won’t be buying Sainsbury’s single donuts for a long time. Nor will I try any virtue signalling again in a hurry.

I think it unfair to blame the club.  They shouldn't be expected to find a way around the problem.
They should, however, be blamed for not policing the rules.
We need a combined and deliberate effort by all clubs.
If standing areas are available, great.  Let the standers use them.
If there are only seated areas available, enforce the rules, kick out the standers!  Let's start ejecting the rule breakers!

Let the standers moan.  Let the standers be the one's to feel hard done to.  Let the standers be the ones to do something about it, and get the rules changed in their favour. 
For now, it is they that are breaking the rules, and those that wish to follow and/or abide by the rules are the ones who are suffering.
That is wrong on every level!  
Wrong.
Wrong.
Wrong.

Totally agree.
Had I been having this conversation at any stage up until around 10 years ago, I'd be encouraging somebody to do something about it.  I'd be all for returning to terrace and seating options, let alone safe standing.  Even the old Leppings Lane terrace could be constructed in such a way as to remain as safe as any seating area, given today's construction materials, methods, and design techniques.
As I'm having this conversation now, I'm not too fussed either way, (as it don't actually affect me personally) hence my comfortable stance at merely abiding by whatever rules are currently in place... or until such rules are changed, to suit the majority.   

At 5am this morning, a pedestrian pressed the button on a pelican crossing, then crossed the road before the lights changed.  In fairness, I was still a few hundred yards away (approaching in my car), and he put neither himself or me in danger.
As I reached the lights, his green man lit up, my lights changed to red... but he had already crossed, and waltzed without a care in the world.
There was no other traffic in view, and no other pedestrians.
In that situation, I would very much like to be able to ignore my red light, treat the crossing like a zebra crossing, and drive on.
But I'm not allowed... so I waited... because they are the rules.
Sometimes, rules are pretty crap, ain't they!  

Without wading into the debates over what's right or wrong, making everyone sit down at away games would reduce the atmosphere in the away end to a campfire sing along. Would be crap.

I think it unfair to blame the club.  They shouldn't be expected to find a way around the problem.
They should, however, be blamed for not policing the rules.
We need a combined and deliberate effort by all clubs.
If standing areas are available, great.  Let the standers use them.
If there are only seated areas available, enforce the rules, kick out the standers!  Let's start ejecting the rule breakers!

Let the standers moan.  Let the standers be the one's to feel hard done to.  Let the standers be the ones to do something about it, and get the rules changed in their favour. 
For now, it is they that are breaking the rules, and those that wish to follow and/or abide by the rules are the ones who are suffering.
That is wrong on every level!  
Wrong.
Wrong.
Wrong.

I think it unfair to blame the club.  They shouldn't be expected to find a way around the problem.
They should, however, be blamed for not policing the rules.
We need a combined and deliberate effort by all clubs.
If standing areas are available, great.  Let the standers use them.
If there are only seated areas available, enforce the rules, kick out the standers!  Let's start ejecting the rule breakers!

Let the standers moan.  Let the standers be the one's to feel hard done to.  Let the standers be the ones to do something about it, and get the rules changed in their favour. 
For now, it is they that are breaking the rules, and those that wish to follow and/or abide by the rules are the ones who are suffering.
That is wrong on every level!  
Wrong.
Wrong.
Wrong.

At 5am this morning, a pedestrian pressed the button on a pelican crossing, then crossed the road before the lights changed.  In fairness, I was still a few hundred yards away (approaching in my car), and he put neither himself or me in danger.
As I reached the lights, his green man lit up, my lights changed to red... but he had already crossed, and waltzed without a care in the world.
There was no other traffic in view, and no other pedestrians.
In that situation, I would very much like to be able to ignore my red light, treat the crossing like a zebra crossing, and drive on.
But I'm not allowed... so I waited... because they are the rules.
Sometimes, rules are pretty crap, ain't they!  

You don’t think they are already turning a blind eye given that the South stand at Pride Park remains standing for the full 90 minutes?
Not only that, the club also regularly use pictures of the away support stood up to thank them across social media channels.
No encouragement needed from my part. 
Rail seats will be installed at many clubs over the next few years, I would imagine these will be installed in away ends which will cause major issues between the sitters and standers. May as well but a system in place now where fans are familiar with what they are getting into when purchasing tickets.

Virtually every club ignores there own ground regulations for the easy option. No one complains about standing in the South stand, you know that’s going to happen. What David says is what used to happen, standing at the back, sitting at the front, but enforce it. Our biggest problem at the moment is that our allocations are selling out meaning if you’re not happy with your seat you can’t move somewhere else.
 

The problem is it’s not a criminal offence to stand in a seating area so the police are not interested, it is against ground regulations, so by buying a ticket you agree to those regulations. So then it’s down to enforcement which is the stewards job, but the stewards are told not to be confrontational so they can ask someone to sit down ( which they rarely do) but if they refuse then nothing else happens.

On the sitting v standing debate, it should be quite easy for the club to fix.
Most games we are selling out away allocations, makes little sense to release tickets by blocks, especially when you combine it with the priority system. If you are going to reward fans loyalty, don’t stick them away in the corner of the stand for wanting to buy the ticket early.
Have 2 categories, singing blocks and family/over 50s blocks.
The family/over 50s block should be seen by fans as seated blocks and a family friendly atmosphere. There would be no restrictions preventing a 25 year old fan that would prefer to sit as well from purchasing tickets in these blocks, however if you go in there and stand then expect to be told to sit your arse down by those around you.
Singing sections, expect to stand and hear the more fruity side of the English language.
The club would have someone word it better without actually advertising any blocks as standing which goes against the ground regulations. Rotate the blocks per game so one category is not always being given the best views.
No football fan should ever feel unable to attend away games for fear of feeling unsafe and unable to see the game, right now the club are doing a terrible job at ensuring fans don’t feel this way.
So many stories on here where older fans have had verbals off younger fans either in their seat, or refusing to sit down so they can see, not right at all. It’s a complete lottery of who you will find yourself among and that one game, that one coked up 18 year old could end the away travels of another fan.
Do better Derby.

I stood up lonely, as not allowed,
Floating on high, o'er the crowd.
"Si'Daarn", they hollered, all around.
"This is an all-seater kind o' ground".
So down I sat, with a heavy heart,
Like at a wedding, a mere spare part.
And then they all stood, and began to roar,
I'd missed the freakin' goal, regards, B4.
?
 
 
 
*To the tune of "I wandered lonely as a cloud", by J.R. Hartley, but you all knew that, right?  
 
 
 

I agree with what you’re saying re the long term solutions, but for the here and now, clubs can simply announce that they are clamping down, and activating the rules that are already in place. They could even offer an unofficial compromise whereas for the first game, standers are merely warned. Next game, they go out. 
yes, it will take time to come up with long term solutions, to effectively suit all… or the majority.
But at the moment, the majority are losing out, as the minority are being allowed to ignore current rules/legislation. 
I repeat, that is wrong!
 

I think it unfair to blame the club.  They shouldn't be expected to find a way around the problem.
They should, however, be blamed for not policing the rules.
We need a combined and deliberate effort by all clubs.
If standing areas are available, great.  Let the standers use them.
If there are only seated areas available, enforce the rules, kick out the standers!  Let's start ejecting the rule breakers!

Let the standers moan.  Let the standers be the one's to feel hard done to.  Let the standers be the ones to do something about it, and get the rules changed in their favour. 
For now, it is they that are breaking the rules, and those that wish to follow and/or abide by the rules are the ones who are suffering.
That is wrong on every level!  
Wrong.
Wrong.
Wrong.