Cwyka and Maguire

[RotherhamRam]

Talking of bottom lips it was embarrassing watching him virtually burst into tears at Peterborough because he was so out of depth and he knew it. Maguire and Cywka would give infinately more to the team than him, but because of Clough's petty schoolboy squables we're having to watch the same thing over and over again. It's pathetic.

Now you are talking crap he has given Maguire and Cywka chances but they bring nothing to the pitch. You talk about Clough holding grudges need to look closer at home. They are playing *****, plain and simple they give no effort this season he has given them chances. The pathetic comments like this is the reason why threads turn into arguments and actually hold no basis for arguments.

Debates are great as long as people actually consider everything instead of holding onto things. He has not lambasted any player this year if anything he has supported them when they have not deserved it.

Look at the players you are backing and ask the question why have they not produced this year when they are on the pitch and actually make it impossible to not play them.

[Day]

Sorry RR but if crap is being spoken here....

Maguire has had 2 league starts, that isn't a chance. When a manager signs a player they always say he's going to need a few games to settle in, give him time.

If you honestly think 2 games is giving a player a chance then I have to say you are the one talking crap here.

[RotherhamRam]

Sorry RR but if crap is being spoken here....

Maguire has had 2 league starts, that isn't a chance. When a manager signs a player they always say he's going to need a few games to settle in, give him time.

If you honestly think 2 games is giving a player a chance then I have to say you are the one talking crap here.

When you are down to scraps up front and you can not provide evidence to even keep in the side when we have no one up there then yes 2 games is enough. If he was good enough we would have seen it. He has also had sustitution appearances and nothing. When you have nothing up there it is not too difficult to actually show that you can play the game and that you want to play for the team.

Robinson is not the most talented player lets be frank but gives 100% when on the pitch, runs, tracks back, tackles, pull defenders busts a gut to get to the end of the ball. His skill level can be forgiven for the effort he puts on the pitch and we have struggled recent weeks when he is not in the side. That is what Maguire and Cywka should be doing but got no where near. How many games do you want to give him. Priskin played better then them 2 held the ball up and he has been there for 2 days having to get used to the team quickly. His knowledge of the game and movement got him his goal.

That is why I don't rate him that is why I don't think he should be picked and that is why Clough has got it right. Maguire would have done nothing tonight and neither would have cywka.

It was the fact that our limited squad meant we had to rely on Brayford, Bailey, Green and Barker who are not match fit and coming back from injuries is what cost us in the last 30 mins not because those two were not in the suad.

[Bris Vegas]

So you think Clough made a mistke in the transfer market ad wasted $400k odd on Maguire?

I think Cywka and Maguire are technically too good for Clough.. Well his style. No technical player can look good if your job is to chase lost balls into the corner or have 90 minute ariel duals with 6'3 defenders..

Someone who likes playing football on the ground like Brendan Rodgers would get the best out of those two

[ben_dcfc]

When you are down to scraps up front and you can not provide evidence to even keep in the side when we have no one up there then yes 2 games is enough. If he was good enough we would have seen it. He has also had sustitution appearances and nothing. When you have nothing up there it is not too difficult to actually show that you can play the game and that you want to play for the team.

Robinson is not the most talented player lets be frank but gives 100% when on the pitch, runs, tracks back, tackles, pull defenders busts a gut to get to the end of the ball. His skill level can be forgiven for the effort he puts on the pitch and we have struggled recent weeks when he is not in the side. That is what Maguire and Cywka should be doing but got no where near. How many games do you want to give him. Priskin played better then them 2 held the ball up and he has been there for 2 days having to get used to the team quickly. His knowledge of the game and movement got him his goal.

That is why I don't rate him that is why I don't think he should be picked and that is why Clough has got it right. Maguire would have done nothing tonight and neither would have cywka.

It was the fact that our limited squad meant we had to rely on Brayford, Bailey, Green and Barker who are not match fit and coming back from injuries is what cost us in the last 30 mins not because those two were not in the suad.

Give him more than two games to prove himself, especially with them being down to the bare bones up front. Maguire's a completely different player to Robinson, he wants to have the ball in to feet and to be able to create something, whereas Robinsons game is to put defenders under pressure and chase lost causes. With the team just playing hoof ball then it is going to be difficult for a player like him. His last start was against Cardiff and the midfield was non-existant that night, he had a bad game but had nothing at all to work with. To say he would have done nothing yesterday is a bit silly given the impact he had coming off the bench at middlesborough, there was certainly more chance of him or Cywka doing something than Doyle.

Do you think Ben Davies is good enough? I don't, but seeing as he's a Clough favourite i bet you do. When he joined last season, coming in to a struggling team like Maguire he made little to no difference, but yet clough stuck with him. Surely Maguire deserves the same opportunity. The same with Cywka, take away the forest game, and he's started just the 2 games. The first of which he scored in and then was out of the team for four games, twice out the squad, picked behind a 15 year old. This must have done loads for his confidence, great management by Clough. Any player needs a run of games in the team, reserve games are not the same and 4/5 games should constitute a real chance to prove yourself.

Plus comparing them to Priskin doesn't work, he's an out an out striker, whereas Cywka has never appeared to be that to me. When he was playing well last year it was out on the right where he formed a great partnership with Brayford. Maguire aswell seems like a player to play just off the striker so asking them to hold up the ball from our hoofs upfield is completely unrealistic

[Mr Tibbs]

Have you actually watched these players play this season, when they get a chance they don't take it. They play in the reserves and are not pushing the 1st team. Look at the players and their efforts before asking why clough not picking them.

Time players on the edge of the first team grew a set of balls rolled up their bottom lip and put extra time on the training pitch and say look at me and then when you get on the pitch work your ballacks off instead of waiting for the game to come to you

Yeah I've seen them and the little they have shown, both with a bit if goal scoring instinct, has been much much than Conor Doyle.

If your a big fan of game changing Doyle than fair enough but those 2 have much more ability than him. They are better than him, I don't actually think there's an argument about that!

[AndyB]

I agree both Cywka and Maguire are clearly better than Doyle, I can't understand why Doyle keeps appearing in the matchday 16 when other midfielders or forwards are fit?

[curb]

When you are down to scraps up front and you can not provide evidence to even keep in the side when we have no one up there then yes 2 games is enough. If he was good enough we would have seen it. He has also had sustitution appearances and nothing. When you have nothing up there it is not too difficult to actually show that you can play the game and that you want to play for the team.

Robinson is not the most talented player lets be frank but gives 100% when on the pitch, runs, tracks back, tackles, pull defenders busts a gut to get to the end of the ball. His skill level can be forgiven for the effort he puts on the pitch and we have struggled recent weeks when he is not in the side. That is what Maguire and Cywka should be doing but got no where near. How many games do you want to give him. Priskin played better then them 2 held the ball up and he has been there for 2 days having to get used to the team quickly. His knowledge of the game and movement got him his goal.

That is why I don't rate him that is why I don't think he should be picked and that is why Clough has got it right. Maguire would have done nothing tonight and neither would have cywka.

It was the fact that our limited squad meant we had to rely on Brayford, Bailey, Green and Barker who are not match fit and coming back from injuries is what cost us in the last 30 mins not because those two were not in the suad.

You're constantly making excuses for the indefensible, Clough's decisions cost us again yesterday, he brought back too many players in one go when we had Hendrick there on the bench, yes he needs a rest but one more game wouldn't have bothered him. Then we've got Cywka and Maguire not involved and he brings on Doyle who is obviously so out of his depth at this level it's embarrassing, taking off Ward as well, your having a laugh aren't you?

We were never going to win at West Ham because they've got better players all over the pitch (cue stock excuse No.s 17, 46 &103; wage bill, no investment, injury list), but I'd have expected us to make a better fist of it than that.

Did you hear Sam's comment? '442 wasn't working so we changed it second half.' What was Clough doing while Sam was changing his tactics round to win the match? Sat glued to his seat with his arms folded sulking like a petulant child.

Take your head out of Clough's arse for a second and look at it without the rose tinted spectacles..

[Alph]

I agree both Cywka and Maguire are clearly better than Doyle, I can't understand why Doyle keeps appearing in the matchday 16 when other midfielders or forwards are fit?

Because he works hard and does his best to follow instructions.

I don't agree that he should be in the 16 btw, it's just why he is.

It's a lovely thought that "you cant ask more than 100%" but the harsh reality is that you need 100% effort isn't always enough in any job.

Gimme a lazy Commons anyday. There was atleast a chance of something magical.

You can find ways to get players to give you effort, you can't find ways for players to give you more ability.

I dunno. Nigel is perhaps naive?

[bcnram]

Cwyka has not got the slightest idea what he is going to do with the ball. He sets off on a run with his head down never thinking to look up to see a pass. That is the reason why he runs up so many blind alleys.

Maguire doesn't seem to have the mental strength at the moment. A classis example was in the last game played at home, when he lost the ball and just sat down on his backside for a few seconds as if he was in a school match.

Both of them have got to learn in the reserves and prove themselves in training. Personally, I think that Cwyka will not make it. Maguire needs to toughen up. As for Doyle, I don't think he has enough to make a career at this level either, but was worth a punt to see how he developed.

[Bris Vegas]

I'd rather have 11 lazy Commons than 11 workhorses like B.Davies

[haywood8]

Both Cywka (e.g. Reading away) and Maguire (e.g. Portsmouth home) have done more than Doyle has ever done in the first team.

Agree,but Clough wants them to do it for the reserves first,then earn their chance.Doyle scored 2 v Rotherham & put a shift in.

Players cant get confused...work your socks off in training & reserves to EARN a starting position.He has no place for EGOS.

I personally like this "old school " approach.

[haywood8]

So you think Clough made a mistke in the transfer market ad wasted $400k odd on Maguire?

I think Cywka and Maguire are technically too good for Clough.. Well his style. No technical player can look good if your job is to chase lost balls into the corner or have 90 minute ariel duals with 6'3 defenders..

Someone who likes playing football on the ground like Brendan Rodgers would get the best out of those two

Heard from a reliable source that Clough tried to pull out of deal when he heard that Maguire ran with a bad crowd.

[CumbrianRam]

Effort will only get you so far, you need quality too.

Bit odd that NC used to be know as an intelligent striker, though't he'd like intelligent, exciting attacking players but there you go.

[CumbrianRam]

Heard from a reliable source that Clough tried to pull out of deal when he heard that Maguire ran with a bad crowd.

His fault for not doing his homwork (if true...)

[Bris Vegas]

Effort will only get you so far, you need quality too.

Bit odd that NC used to be know as an intelligent striker, though't he'd like intelligent, exciting attacking players but there you go.

And Keith Hill at Barnsley used to be a defender yet his teams play attractive expansive football - odd eh..

[NothernRam]

Is it so hard to spell his name correctly?

STRIKER Chris McGuire has been told he must become more consistent to earn a place in Derby County's team.

The 22-year-old Scot has started only two League games since he signed from Aberdeen in the summer for a compensation package worth around £470,000.

[url=http://www.thisisderbyshire.co.uk/story-14045303-detail/story.html?]http://www.thisisderbyshire.co.uk/story-14045303-detail/story.html?

[kong]

must not do something different:, might be considered having flair

[bcnram]

must not do something different:, might be considered having flair

That is not what Johnny Metgod said...... They want Maguire to hold the ball up - which he was not doing. They also want him to get out of the habit of always trying to control the ball with the outside of his foot as it is more difficult and clearly he is not good enough to do that consistently. Nothing to do with knocking flair out of him, everything to do with getting him to contribute to the team more consistently.

[ianm]

That is not what Johnny Metgod said...... They want Maguire to hold the ball up - which he was not doing. They also want him to get out of the habit of always trying to control the ball with the outside of his foot as it is more difficult and clearly he is not good enough to do that consistently. Nothing to do with knocking flair out of him, everything to do with getting him to contribute to the team more consistently.

It's amazing how a guy who fails to consistently hold the ball under pressure has made it into pro football. Real basics that should be drummed into any forward from 10 years and younger, if you can't hold and lay off the ball as a youngster you would struggle to get in any of the top junior sides, even in the local leagues.