Work

[McRainy]

53 minutes ago, King Kevin said:

Every generation gets softer ,I was talking to the old girl over road and she was on about people suffering from stress etc. She's 90 lives on her own ,drives [like a maniac] I'll tell you what  stress is  she said "it's when I was trying to do my ironing and the Germans were bombing us".

It’s easy to cope with the what if you have a convincing why. That generation still lived with a cohesive set of values which gave them a meaningful place in the social order, although, quite frankly, wanting to spend your last few moments before you get blown to bits doing your ironing is pretty mental. 

[TigerTedd]

50 minutes ago, Lambchop said:

I’ve never known what I want to be when I grow up, and I know lots of other people who feel the same way. I know what sort of activities and interests motivate and engage me, but they’re not things I can readily make a living out of. 

For me one of the big issues has been about control of my own time, but I am now realising this is because I am on the autistic spectrum and have PDA; I cannot stand another person determining what I should be doing all day, and how I should be doing it, so the 9-5 feels like hell for me.

Beyond paying the bills and being able to afford fairly modest leisure activities, I’m not interested in money, or ambitious in any way either. I’ve mostly been able to maximise autonomy and independence by qualifying to do work that is well enough paid to work part time; the exception being my last episode of full-time teaching, which sent my anxiety over the edge. 

This is why I’m interested in other people’s experience, because I honestly don’t know how people cope with it. We have a few short years on this planet to discover who we are and what life is about, and so much of it is spent in meaningless drudgery. I always admire people who manage to survive doing something they love, but they seem to be the exception. 

The article on post-work and some of the discussions on UBI start to address this. Where it has been tried, it seems that people flourish and are able to find more creative and fulfilling ways of living, both in terms of work and community relationships.

I expect it will only happen if it proves to be an economic necessity, but the signs are there that the lives of the majority could be more meaningful if they weren’t so shackled as wage slaves. Culturally, though, we are set up to identify ourselves as workers, so a shift away from that may not be easy for everyone. 

You say we have a short time, but if you look at it another way, it’s actually quite a king time, and it’s grtting longer. 

Imagine when were all able to live to 150 and still be fit and healthy. I couldn’t imagine working 100 years in the same job. You could almost live two or three lives in those circumstances. At the age of 50 you could go back to school, completely change your career and start from scratch, with your house all pasos off and your kids all grown up. 

It annoys me that kids are expected to know what they want to do with their lives at the age of 20. 

Im 36 and have already been through 2 major career changes - graphic designer > project manager > phlebotomist. And I still don’t know what I want to be when I grow up. 

[Angry Ram]

I used to love work but not now. I pity those just starting out as the pressure is becoming unbearable.. We used to have real laughs at work but I don’t see anyone doing that now.. Assessments, deadlines, meetings, never being able to shut off.. Too much now. Remember 9 to 5? Now it’s expected that you are available 7 days a week. That thought when you are due back from holiday and you know you are going to walk into 3000 emails and loads of poo.. Ruins the last free days of your break.

Thankfully I am in a position where I am winding down now and work is not so important. No mortgage, kids grown up and fully self sufficient.. Money is ours. I will keep going till I am 60 in 3 years or so. Then review it then. I was happiest driving trucks around London and the south east. Hopefully I will be able get a driving job that will give me 3 days a week and no poxy emails.

 

[Pearl Ram]

@Angry Ram I’m just about to relinquish my HGV License after 30 years. Law changes and technology made lorry driving insufferable for me now.

And don’t kid yourself you don’t get email and texts or messages via the sat nav from your company, many’s a time I thought I was done for the day only to get “Can you just slip over to...” Bah.

Like you I’m winding down now, got myself a cushy little number that will do til the 6 numbers come up. 

[SSD]

1 hour ago, Angry Ram said:

I used to love work but not now. I pity those just starting out as the pressure is becoming unbearable.. We used to have real laughs at work but I don’t see anyone doing that now.. Assessments, deadlines, meetings, never being able to shut off.. Too much now. Remember 9 to 5? Now it’s expected that you are available 7 days a week. That thought when you are due back from holiday and you know you are going to walk into 3000 emails and loads of poo.. Ruins the last free days of your break.

Thankfully I am in a position where I am winding down now and work is not so important. No mortgage, kids grown up and fully self sufficient.. Money is ours. I will keep going till I am 60 in 3 years or so. Then review it then. I was happiest driving trucks around London and the south east. Hopefully I will be able get a driving job that will give me 3 days a week and no poxy emails.

 

I was working full time for 7 years and only in a couple of companies did I feel like I was able to relax a little. Was working nights when Euro 2016 was on and the office had a TV. Whilst the big bosses weren't around we put the games on and end up having buffets, takeaways. It was great! The only time I've ever felt I was having a laugh at work.

 

My last full-time job I'd go on holiday and I'd have a mountain of emails, 95% of them were utter **** and was working before work and after work hours. No time to enjoying being with family. Hated the corporate office world, hated it. Constant crap off bosses who wouldn't let me sit down. My dad said to me you might as well be self-employed or freelance. It's less stressful than working for a company apparently.  

[CornwallRam]

I reckon that distribution of labour and wealth is going to be the key issue which societies will have to deal with in the current years.

It looks inevitable that within a century most current jobs will be automated. There'll be new ones created, but it's easy envisage a situation where 95% of people have no work available to them. Yet, if the wealth food and shelter generated by automation is shared out, there'll be plenty to go around.

Yet how will people cope without work? How will workers cope with working whilst so many others aren't. Will the workers be wealthy, the owners be rich and the rest be kept in perpetual poverty? If money functions as it does now then salaries would have to be massive but tax rates also be over 90%. Will some people work today's normal hours and have the standard 50 year careers? Or will the majority work for 8 hours per week? Maybe everyone will have to retire after five years of work?

Whatever happens, we'll have to stop blaming those out of work when there are no jobs for them to do. But will there be a pay-off for people living lives of leisure paid for by the endeavour of others? Maybe only workers are allowed to kids? Perhaps medicine will keep everyone alive for centuries? In that case will only workers be allowed to live past a hundred?  

[PistoldPete2]

5 hours ago, Angry Ram said:

I used to love work but not now. I pity those just starting out as the pressure is becoming unbearable.. We used to have real laughs at work but I don’t see anyone doing that now.. Assessments, deadlines, meetings, never being able to shut off.. Too much now. Remember 9 to 5? Now it’s expected that you are available 7 days a week. That thought when you are due back from holiday and you know you are going to walk into 3000 emails and loads of poo.. Ruins the last free days of your break.

Thankfully I am in a position where I am winding down now and work is not so important. No mortgage, kids grown up and fully self sufficient.. Money is ours. I will keep going till I am 60 in 3 years or so. Then review it then. I was happiest driving trucks around London and the south east. Hopefully I will be able get a driving job that will give me 3 days a week and no poxy emails.

 

Spot on. I gave up my job last year. Aboslutley fed up...  I would get in well before 9am and already there would be dozens of emails, none of it spam, all demanding my attention. Phone calls , system generated reminders, internal and external meetings to attend utterly impossible to attend to them all.  And as you say go on holiday and you wonder why you bother you come back to  backlog of stuff that's built up while youve been away. 

[SSD]

There’s no surprise why so many people go off sick with stress. I remember me and my colleague went up for a typical BS meeting. My bosses boss went completely mental at her for doing a small mistake that could have been fixed no problem at all. Completely went over the top and she burst into tears. I ran out after her and offered her lunch to give her support, being nice. I called the bloke a disgrace.

 

The world is going too fast for us to cope mentally. Everything is now now now. Rolls Royce are absolute gits for massive unrealistic demands behind the scenes. 

 

 

[Ronish Baxter]

I started working at a young age, probably when I was 17 or 18 years old. At first started with some petty jobs but gradually moved on to a job that offered a stable career as well as decent money. I don't know whether everyone feels the same way but, after a cdertain point of time I think every job seems to be a bit dull and boring. I have a family to support, pay my bills and all but I really do yearn for a job that would give me the freedom instead of making it to the office everyday. However with freelance jobs, the chances of earning a decent amount requires you to dedicate a lot of time. So, far don't know what the future holds but moving on and thinking of making the most of this life by travelling to places and enjoying.

[TigerTedd]

Consider the society in Star Trek (bare with me). They have a completely money-less society. 

People still work, and join star fleet and things, but I don’t think they get paid for it. They seem to have built a society in their where work is it’s own reward, every job is a vocation. You work if you want to, and plenty of people want to. 

Cos the jobs are generally a bit cooler. Boring jobs are automated, and humans are left to pilot space craft (although that could probably be automated too). 

I always wondered about captain Cisco’s dad though. He runs a restaurant. Why do you need a restaurant when replicators meet your every need? And who would pay for food in a money-less society with free food readily available. 

But maybe it’s just his choice, what he wants to do. He likes to cook, he wanted to open a restaurant. So he did. And people come and enjoy the ambience, and he doesn’t charge, cos he doesn’t have to, he just does it for the love of owning a restaraunt. I suppose it doesn’t even matter if no one shows up. 

All seems a bit outlandish based on our experiences and beleifs now. But as hay article said, it won’t be done overnight revolution, but one day we’ll wake up, and we’ll realise we’re living in the new reality. 

I didn’t even realise til I read that article, it sounds a lot like I’m currently living the post work dream. There’s probably lots of other people like me who don’t even know that post-work is a thing. They probably think their lifestyle is not normal. Probably thinking about getting a ‘normal’ 9 to 5 job. But they’re actually part of a new wave. 

[eddie]

I work from home as a consultant in order to supplement my pension.

[Stive Pesley]

I'm glad you started this thread - I was thinking of something similar, for purely selfish reasons as I'm in a bit of a quandary regarding work at the moment, and what to do with my life.

So much stuff that people are saying is striking chords though. I dont know where to begin

Once I've cleared my Monday morning backlog of emails I'll get back to you

[Angry Ram]

Wonder if I am too late to start training to be an oceanographer? Would have been my dream career 

Bobbing about in a boat studying sharks off the coasts of the US, South Africa and Australia. Now that's job satisfaction. 

If I am honest, I might have missed that particular boat. Hmmm back to Nat Geo channel. 

If only I was old when I was young, I might have made some different choices about bunking off school.

[eddie]

11 minutes ago, Angry Ram said:

Wonder if I am too late to start training to be an oceanographer? Would have been my dream career 

Bobbing about in a boat studying sharks off the coasts of the US, South Africa and Australia. Now that's job satisfaction. 

If I am honest, I might have missed that particular boat. Hmmm back to Nat Geo channel. 

If only I was old when I was young, I might have made some different choices about bunking off school.

You would have to change your name to Angry McAngryface.

[1of4]

4 hours ago, Angry Ram said:

Wonder if I am too late to start training to be an oceanographer? Would have been my dream career 

Bobbing about in a boat studying sharks off the coasts of the US, South Africa and Australia. Now that's job satisfaction. 

If I am honest, I might have missed that particular boat. Hmmm back to Nat Geo channel. 

If only I was old when I was young, I might have made some different choices about bunking off school.

Sounds an idyllic job but getting to the match on a Tuesday night might be a bit of a push.

[ketteringram]

4 minutes ago, 1of4 said:

Sounds an idyllic job but getting to the match on a Tuesday night might be a bit of a push.

It's a win win then! 

[Stive Pesley]

I see people saying quite often that they are bored rigid by retirement, and maybe you don't know until you've tried it but I can't imagine I would ever be bored of not having to fill my day with work, just to put food on the table

I'm 48 later this year and been in full-time work since I was 20. My ethos in that time has never changed. I work so that I have enough money to feel secure and enjoy my life outside of work. I've never had a job where I felt any kind of affinity to my employer, or what my employer does. In most cases, I find employer's embarassing attempts to talk about culture and motivation excruciating. Don't get me wrong, it's important to have a job that you can at least tolerate. Whenever I've stopped enjoying my job, I've changed jobs. Some days I enjoy my job, rather than just tolerate it but those days seem rarer and rarer.

Something changed maybe about 10 years ago? Employers used to treat things like pay rises and bonuses as important tools in motivating and rewarding employees. But these days employers seem to think they are something to be avoided, and that actually having a job is reward enough. And the idea of having to work outside of your contracted hours used to be an exception, which was appreciated. These days it seems like the norm, and again - we should just be lucky to have a job.

I should be clear I'm talking about large organisations here - not small companies, I'm sure their are plenty of exceptions, but it seems like we are dehumanised in the dogged pursuit of profit and/or shareholder value

I've been offered voluntary redundancy on a quarterly basis for the past 5 years, not because there is no work, but because they can pile that work on to fewer people, and cheaper people. I'm reaching the point of seriously considering it, and then just get a low stress job on half the money.

 

 

[ketteringram]

39 minutes ago, StivePesley said:

I see people saying quite often that they are bored rigid by retirement, and maybe you don't know until you've tried it but I can't imagine I would ever be bored of not having to fill my day with work, just to put food on the table

 

 

 

Just curious. Are you actively planning for retirement? With an age in mind maybe? 

[McRainy]

48 minutes ago, StivePesley said:

I can't imagine I would ever be bored of not having to fill my day with work

I never get bored. I haven’t worked for over three years, and most of my working life has been part time.

I was self employed as a therapist for many years, and that was my happiest experience of work. I felt that what I was doing was worthwhile, and it engaged my mind and my heart. Even with that I eventually got to the burn out point where I felt I was no longer fully engaged, so I stopped. I went and lived on an island for a bit doing cooking and cleaning, and then came back to teaching. 

Currently I am fortunate to have enough behind me not to need to work. I should probably be investing it, or doing something sensible, but I’ve decided to give myself time to focus on creative work, which is what I really enjoy. Whether I can make any money out of it, I don’t know, but you’re a long time dead, so I want to give it a year or two. 

I have a house, but no pension or provision for the future, I’m on my own (kinda). I just feel that life is now, the future is uncertain and a one way ticket in any case.

People who work with the dying say that the most frequent regret is looking back on years wasted chasing after money and security, and not being true to yourself. I’d hate to feel like that. 

[King Kevin]

Reading this thread makes me realise what a charmed life I have had .It's quite sad when a large part of your life isn't fun.