archied Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 16 minutes ago, ramblur said: Depends what you mean by sustainable.If you're talking completely self sufficient,then forget it. Even under the Americans,with the relative austerity of the Clough years, they were still having to cover fairly significant cash losses on operations. I think 'sustainable' in our case will just relate to the amounts Mel would be prepared to put in on an ongoing basis,should we fail to be promoted. It always makes me smile when some slag Mel off and wish we still had the Americans, they forget that the Americans really wanted out as they realised it was a money pit trying to run a championship club , they did a nice steady job but didn’t want to carry on pumping money in even just to stand still Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papahet Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 We wouldnt be anywhere near FFP if GSE were still here. Morris has totally cocked up all the work they did with his 14-15 spending spree. How many new contracts handed out since that Wembley final? Martin last year when he wasnt even at the club. Rowett not even a year into his contract and another deal thrown on the table. Thorne didnt warrant one, Alex Pearce and Forsyth, Bryson 5 friggin years... He gets a ton of plaudits but Mel Morris is the sole reason we would fail FFP, not anyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Scarlet Pimpernel Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 What about our previous chief executive? Didn't he sanction the contracts while he as here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papahet Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 Rush left in May. Pearce, Thorne and Forsyth all handed new deals in the last 4 months. Jamie Hanson offered new terms -another player nowhere near the standard required. Russell was offered improved terms, glad he left because he didnt warrant a better deal here for another 3 years on most likely 20 odd grand a week. Who agreed to Bent and Baird having extensions? Why was Rowett given a new deal so soon into his contract? Then Morris has the cheek to bemoan FFP every other sentence at these fan forums. Stop bloody wasting money on new contracts for Alex friggin Pearce and Chris Martin then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archied Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 23 minutes ago, Papahet said: We wouldnt be anywhere near FFP if GSE were still here. Morris has totally cocked up all the work they did with his 14-15 spending spree. How many new contracts handed out since that Wembley final? Martin last year when he wasnt even at the club. Rowett not even a year into his contract and another deal thrown on the table. Thorne didnt warrant one, Alex Pearce and Forsyth, Bryson 5 friggin years... He gets a ton of plaudits but Mel Morris is the sole reason we would fail FFP, not anyone else. Yea but your missing the point GSE wouldn’t still be here , they wanted out because it was a money pit even trying to stand still never mind trying to move the club forward and we have fans who will not want to be Ipswich type club bobbing around mid table in the championship ,,, clough junior working on gse budget was ( sensible sustainable one) was outed and is vastly underrated and disliked by big numbers of derby fans for it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archied Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 10 minutes ago, Papahet said: Rush left in May. Pearce, Thorne and Forsyth all handed new deals in the last 4 months. Jamie Hanson offered new terms -another player nowhere near the standard required. Russell was offered improved terms, glad he left because he didnt warrant a better deal here for another 3 years on most likely 20 odd grand a week. Why was Rowett given a new deal so soon into his contract? Then Morris has the cheek to bemoan FFP every other sentence at these fan forums. Stop bloody wasting money on new contracts for Alex friggin Pearce and Chris Martin then. Was nt it mac2 who wanted Chris Martin on improved contract and Mel backing him ? Mistakes have been made no doubts but we are by all accounts still inside ffp though having to work hard at and we are still promotion contenders so I’m not too inclined to slate Mel Morris ,, interesting point is who would gse offloaded us to had Morris not wanted to buy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 10 minutes ago, archied said: ... interesting point is who would gse offloaded us to had Morris not wanted to buy They might have got us promoted and sold us to the highest bidder, if we're playing what ifs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papahet Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 MM backing Mac by giving Martin a new deal at the end of Jan, only to sack Mac at the start of March is MM in a nutshell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 2 hours ago, ramblur said: Depends what you mean by sustainable.If you're talking completely self sufficient,then forget it. Even under the Americans,with the relative austerity of the Clough years, they were still having to cover fairly significant cash losses on operations. I think 'sustainable' in our case will just relate to the amounts Mel would be prepared to put in on an ongoing basis,should we fail to be promoted. I take your point. just trying to work out what is a reasonable level of annual spend for us. This season the Ince sale has given some wriggle room. I'm trying to work out whether vydra has to go to fund further turnover of the squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 43 minutes ago, Papahet said: Then Morris has the cheek to bemoan FFP every other sentence at these fan forums. Stop bloody wasting money on new contracts for Alex friggin Pearce and Chris Martin then. There's a difference between 'bemoaning' and simply stating a fact that we have to operate within FFP. Why haven't you mentioned the other thing that came up,viz that other clubs were trying to get the rules changed, whilst we want them to stay the way they are,and intend to stay within the limits? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 6 minutes ago, RamNut said: I take your point. just trying to work out what is a reasonable level of annual spend for us. This season the Ince sale has given some wriggle room. I'm trying to work out whether vydra has to go to fund further turnover of the squad. Impossible to tell. If we managed to sell Martin and Bryson, we'd get both cash and profit on sales. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 On 15/03/2018 at 18:11, ramblur said: That's why I said taken as a pair. I reckon their joint current values exceed the total paid for the two of them. You mean it's a bogof? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 5 minutes ago, ramblur said: Impossible to tell. If we managed to sell Martin and Bryson, we'd get both cash and profit on sales. I can't see us getting more than £2m for both. Could be wrong. I like both players but gary seems to have made it clear that they are not wanted so i assume low fees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 5 minutes ago, RamNut said: I can't see us getting more than £2m for both. Could be wrong. I like both players but gary seems to have made it clear that they are not wanted so i assume low fees. Potential profits on the 2 might offset sale at a loss on another/other player/s (far from ideal,I know), which would then bring in more cash.I suppose it all adds up,and we don't know whether or not Mel's willing to chip in with anything towards transfers (although I wouldn't particularly expect him to). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papahet Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 What ticks me off is you have clubs like Fulham who can turn happily down 20 million offers for Tom Cairney from Premiership sides. Ryan Sessegnon is another who they've managed to keep hold of pretty easily - I'd imagine go for anywhere from 30 upwards. Then on top of that they've managed to bring in a player of significant class like Mitrovic. How can a club who barely manages 15k gates be in such a good position financially compared to us? They could easily fetch 50 million from Cairney and Sessegnon sales, yet seem very little pressured in cashing in. The second someone comes in for one of our better players they are off like a rocket. If someone offered a quid more than we paid Watford for Vydra, I'd expect him to be sold because we are such mugs in the market. Why have we suddenly found ourselves in a situation where we have to sell X player to generate a few quid to sign someone? Morris has thrown us back 3 or 4 years, looks like another rebuild is required on a shoestring budget. We wasn't a million miles away when he arrived, so why was the over the top Summer/Clement spree required? Absolute madness and it'll likely to haunt us for a good few years to come. Never got the love for Morris, other than spending a few bob on Moor Farm (which only adds to the value of the club when he cashes in anyway), he hasn't done a great deal right in my eyes. Comes across a very grumpy man at these fan forums also, with every answer which comes out his mouth twisted and turned into something FFP related, moaning about other clubs wages, low receipts or the new line of having to work "differently" in the upcoming window related - something he got us into in the first place with his OTT spending spree anyway. The accounts would look a damn sigh better if he hadn't signed players on ridiculous wages for ridiculous money, most likely at a ridiculous age Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 18 minutes ago, Papahet said: What ticks me off is you have clubs like Fulham who can turn happily down 20 million offers for Tom Cairney from Premiership sides. Ryan Sessegnon is another who they've managed to keep hold of pretty easily - I'd imagine go for anywhere from 30 upwards. Then on top of that they've managed to bring in a player of significant class like Mitrovic. How can a club who barely manages 15k gates be in such a good position financially compared to us? They could easily fetch 50 million from Cairney and Sessegnon sales, yet seem very little pressured in cashing in. The second someone comes in for one of our better players they are off like a rocket. If someone offered a quid more than we paid Watford for Vydra, I'd expect him to be sold because we are such mugs in the market. Why have we suddenly found ourselves in a situation where we have to sell X player to generate a few quid to sign someone? Morris has thrown us back 3 or 4 years, looks like another rebuild is required on a shoestring budget. We wasn't a million miles away when he arrived, so why was the over the top Summer/Clement spree required? Absolute madness and it'll likely to haunt us for a good few years to come. Never got the love for Morris, other than spending a few bob on Moor Farm (which only adds to the value of the club when he cashes in anyway), he hasn't done a great deal right in my eyes. Comes across a very grumpy man at these fan forums also, with every answer which comes out his mouth twisted and turned into something FFP related, moaning about other clubs wages, low receipts or the new line of having to work "differently" in the upcoming window related - something he got us into in the first place with his OTT spending spree anyway. The accounts would look a damn sigh better if he hadn't signed players on ridiculous wages for ridiculous money, most likely at a ridiculous age Mel has backed his managers the problem being that the managers either chose the wrong players or played them incorrectly or they were simply not very good managers. Football is a simple game complicated by other teams trying to beat you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 1 hour ago, archied said: Yea but your missing the point GSE wouldn’t still be here , they wanted out because it was a money pit even trying to stand still never mind trying to move the club forward and we have fans who will not want to be Ipswich type club bobbing around mid table in the championship ,,, clough junior working on gse budget was ( sensible sustainable one) was outed and is vastly underrated and disliked by big numbers of derby fans for it Sorry, but I really think Clough had it after the Crawley game for me personally. Also this working to the budget thing. I’d say Burnley and Blackpool in his time here had smaller budgets, Cardiff at a push too..... and one thing in common? All got promoted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearl Ram Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 I’m about as up to the back teeth with FFP as I was/am with global warming. Whilst I don’t doubt their existence, I always feel they are used as an excuse to hide/deflect from incompetent decisions at the highest level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spanish Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 56 minutes ago, Papahet said: What ticks me off is you have clubs like Fulham who can turn happily down 20 million offers for Tom Cairney from Premiership sides. Ryan Sessegnon is another who they've managed to keep hold of pretty easily - I'd imagine go for anywhere from 30 upwards. Then on top of that they've managed to bring in a player of significant class like Mitrovic. How can a club who barely manages 15k gates be in such a good position financially compared to us? They could easily fetch 50 million from Cairney and Sessegnon sales, yet seem very little pressured in cashing in. maybe this is an example of the advantages of prem money. It's only going to get worse. WBA will come down with a pot of gold. Sunderland is an exception I think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papahet Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 38 minutes ago, Sparkle said: Mel has backed his managers the problem being that the managers either chose the wrong players or played them incorrectly or they were simply not very good managers. Football is a simple game complicated by other teams trying to beat you Backed and then sacked. Granting Mcclaren his wish of getting Martin's future tied down to the club, only to sack him a month later without Mac and Martin being reunited was Mel at his finest. Before than we had Mel bigging up Paul Clement stating he was going to be here for the long haul and referring to him has our Alex Ferguson at one point - sacked a month or two after that remark(?). Those two, closely followed by Mel giving Pearson reigns to reshape the squad with an outgoing Martin replaced by Vydra. Only to sack Pearson early October and rehire the man he originally sacked in 2015. Morris has had a shocker in his tenure so far, an absolute shocker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.