CapeTownRams Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 PC and everyone at the Club is speaking about how we need to defend from the front.....that includes Martin...and means that he needs to put in his fair shift every game. It's not about madly running around like Sammon but many top class strikers can do that shift and then still have more than enough energy to get the goals. It's not ignorance...it's called 'team play'. If he can't or won't do it then it's either a) laziness or b ) lack of fitness (or both). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Tibbs Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 21 minutes ago, caymanram said: PC and everyone at the Club is speaking about how we need to defend from the front.....that includes Martin...and means that he needs to put in his fair shift every game. It's not about madly running around like Sammon but many top class strikers can do that shift and then still have more than enough energy to get the goals. It's not ignorance...it's called 'team play'. If he can't or won't do it then it's either a) laziness or b ) lack of fitness (or both). Let's leave it to PC, his coaches and the fitness to deal with then? Have you any idea of what is asked of Chris Martin in a game of football? Do you honestly think PC wants Martin to run himself in to the ground? Do you actually think he's unfit? You're throwing some accusations at him that you have absolutely no idea about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 Do people really want Martin running around? After watching him for the best part of three years, the last thing I would want Martin doing is running the channels. The three players around Martin need to be doing the running, but Martin needs to play with his back to goal and play his own game. I find the worst thing you can do with some players is ask them to play a role they aren't comfortable in. If you want a striker to run around, why not choose Weimann? Bent is a classic poacher, he also needs to be played in that capacity or you aren't going to get the best out of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ketteringram Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 3 hours ago, RamNut said: Thorne? I think that if you check the small print in the terms and conditions of the forum, you're not allowed to say anything negative about GT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Vegas Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 Ideally you want your CF to be able to score, drop deep, run in behind, run the channels, harass the opposition and link up the play well. Unfortunately they cost about 80 million - or however much Luis Suarez was. You can only try and play to your striker's strengths. If Clement is unhappy with an aspect of Martin's game, or doens't believe he fits his ideal striker mould, he'll be replaced soon. For the time being though, just let him do what he does best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McMuffin Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 2 hours ago, Ambitious said: Do people really want Martin running around? After watching him for the best part of three years, the last thing I would want Martin doing is running the channels. The three players around Martin need to be doing the running, but Martin needs to play with his back to goal and play his own game. I find the worst thing you can do with some players is ask them to play a role they aren't comfortable in. If you want a striker to run around, why not choose Weimann? Bent is a classic poacher, he also needs to be played in that capacity or you aren't going to get the best out of him. This. And the point about Weimann! Dont know why we've not tried him upfront yet, he could do a similar job to Vardy. Pace and energy to burn could work. Ideal to try him there against Hartlepool I think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfb Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 No two ways about it, it has to be a team strategy and selection that plays to players strengths... which is why i was happy when i saw that PC was saying about the training pre season was about different ways of playing, and picking horses for courses. We saw the results of playing players out of position and trying to get them to play a game not to their strengths or style under previous managers, it doesn't work. Martin is a target man, he's great with his back to goal, he can kick and head a ball, he's got quick feet, a deft touch and guile, he also scores his fair share, how much does he contribute.... we have seen games he's not been in, and most times we dont function as well. Despite those stats (and good work for doing it) for me he's one of the 1st names on the team sheet. I'd like to see Weimann play off him more as a fixed front two Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilf643 Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 IMO a striker should have more pace over say the first 10-15m than the majority of centre halves. There are not many quality ones that don't ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srg Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 2 minutes ago, Wilf643 said: In basic terms, IMO a striker should be able to outrun/be quicker than the majority of centre halves. Can Martin ? What kind of a dumb statement is that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JW37 Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 All strikers and teams score more against weaker opposition... obviously Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilf643 Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 18 minutes ago, Srg said: What kind of a dumb statement is that? it isn't .....how quick is Martin over 15m against an average centre half (in the Championship for example), he isn't. Pace is an integral part of the modern game, i can't think of many first choice strikers at our level and above that is slower than Martin ? Thanks for the welcome by the way ........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srg Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 Just now, Wilf643 said: it isn't .....how quick is Martin over 15m against an average centre half (in the Championship for example), he isn't. Pace is an integral part of the modern game, i can't think of many first choice strikers at our level and above that is slower than Martin ? Thanks for the welcome by the way ........... A good player is a good player. History is littered with phenomenal players who are slow as a donkey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 the first yard is in the head. Many world class strikers had NO pace in a race, but their thinking was faster. Shearer? Sheringham? Fowler? Cantona? Zola? Bergkamp? Klinsmann? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JW37 Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 1 minute ago, Wilf643 said: it isn't .....how quick is Martin over 15m against an average centre half (in the Championship for example), he isn't. Pace is an integral part of the modern game, i can't think of many first choice strikers at our level and above that is slower than Martin ? Thanks for the welcome by the way ........... He's quite slow yes but how many times does he actually have to have a 1v1 sprint against a defender? He holds it up its then up to the wide players and advancing midfielders to get around him and in the space Martin creates by holding it up and dragging a defender out to meet him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridgford Ram Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 Could the (excellent) stats in the initial post be put alongside how many goals Derby have scored against each of those bands? If Martin scores 20% of his goals against a certain band but the whole team score 10% it puts it into perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sexydadbod Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 3 minutes ago, Mostyn6 said: the first yard is in the head. Many world class strikers had NO pace in a race, but their thinking was faster. Shearer? Sheringham? Fowler? Cantona? Zola? Bergkamp? Klinsmann? They weren't exactly fast but I'd say that they were quicker than most defenders they were up against. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sexydadbod Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 3 minutes ago, JW37 said: He's quite slow yes but how many times does he actually have to have a 1v1 sprint against a defender? He holds it up its then up to the wide players and advancing midfielders to get around him and in the space Martin creates by holding it up and dragging a defender out to meet him. That's why people are complaining. His hold up play has been terrible the last 5-6 games, possibly more than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JW37 Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 3 minutes ago, McLovin said: That's why people are complaining. His hold up play has been terrible the last 5-6 games, possibly more than that. No its not been great but i'd also say players arent getting around him enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irobinson Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 9 minutes ago, McLovin said: They weren't exactly fast but I'd say that they were quicker than most defenders they were up against. And Martin aint in this bracket of the aforementioned!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 9 minutes ago, McLovin said: They weren't exactly fast but I'd say that they were quicker than most defenders they were up against. aside of Zola, and possibly Klinsmann, I bet Jake Buxton would win a sprint-race against those listed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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