BIllyD Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 5 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: So we don't open up until we have forced all of them 2m to have the vaccination? No I'd open up regardless, I'm just wondering what your thoughts are on them potentially stopping other treatments based upon their decision. Once you open up you increase their risk of catching it, ending up in hospital and potentially denying someone else a space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 4 minutes ago, BIllyD said: No I'm talking about proving the effectiveness of a vaccine not making decisions based upon the adequacy. You say why listen to the government based upon their previous bad calls and then call upon them to open the country up without any figures to back it up. Something that you have been very vocal about, if your basis on opening the country back up is solely based upon protecting your own family, whilst it's an admirable one, thankfully the government take a wider longer look at what is required. Ive not advocated extending the lockdown, that seems to be something you and others on here seem to throw around when someone doesn't agree with you, not quite sure why but if just thought I'd clear that up again. Ive mentioned the number of deaths in people under 50 with no underlying health conditions. I've mentioned the percentage of hospital admissions made up of the groups that will have been vaccinated. Not really sure what figures you would need beyond this if the goal is to protect the NHS and save lives. If you think my thoughts stop solely at the door of my family you are very much mistaken, mine are not the only children being robbed of their childhood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 4 minutes ago, BIllyD said: No I'd open up regardless, I'm just wondering what your thoughts are on them potentially stopping other treatments based upon their decision. Once you open up you increase their risk of catching it, ending up in hospital and potentially denying someone else a space. That is what hospitals are for. Every time I go out in my car I am risking being in a car crash and taking up a hospital bed and denying someone else a space. Every time I smoke a fag I am risking getting lung cancer and taking up a hospital bed and denying someone else a space. Every time I drink alochol I am risking liver diesease and taking up a hospital bed and denying someone else a space. Every time I eat fatty foods I am risking heart disease and taking up a hospital bed and denying someone else a space. Sure you get the picture. At no point in time did I appoint the Government to control the risks I take in my life. If they show me something that proves I am significantly increasing my chances of ending up in hospital and dying then perhaps I will re-assess but at the moment there is very little to suggest that is the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9255903/Matt-Hancock-hopes-treatable-virus-disease-live-like-flu.html Doesn't sound like the government, its advisors and its scientists think we can eradicate it completely at any time in the future. Another point to take into account when expressing an opinion on when to open up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 3 minutes ago, Norman said: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9255903/Matt-Hancock-hopes-treatable-virus-disease-live-like-flu.html Doesn't sound like the government, its advisors and its scientists think we can eradicate it completely at any time in the future. Another point to take into account when expressing an opinion on when to open up. You only need to look at Australia as evidence that this thing is not going away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uptherams Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 10 minutes ago, Norman said: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9255903/Matt-Hancock-hopes-treatable-virus-disease-live-like-flu.html Doesn't sound like the government, its advisors and its scientists think we can eradicate it completely at any time in the future. Another point to take into account when expressing an opinion on when to open up. Anyone who thinks this is ever going away is a fool. At the very least states and regimes will be releasing strains onto populations they are at odds with over the coming years and decades. Countries shutting down, deep recessions. This can't be put back in it's box. Australia is a great example.They are effectively entering a cold war with China. The CCP will continue to send 'Covid care packages' over the coming years. It's at a point where they shut down a large portion of the metropolitan areas over a dozen cases. CCP will be rubbing their hands. Barely have to try to impose Dave onto Australia from now on. Germ warfare is here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIllyD Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 23 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: That is what hospitals are for. Every time I go out in my car I am risking being in a car crash and taking up a hospital bed and denying someone else a space. Every time I smoke a fag I am risking getting lung cancer and taking up a hospital bed and denying someone else a space. Every time I drink alochol I am risking liver diesease and taking up a hospital bed and denying someone else a space. Every time I eat fatty foods I am risking heart disease and taking up a hospital bed and denying someone else a space. Sure you get the picture. At no point in time did I appoint the Government to control the risks I take in my life. If they show me something that proves I am significantly increasing my chances of ending up in hospital and dying then perhaps I will re-assess but at the moment there is very little to suggest that is the case. Speed limits, excessive tax etc etc, I think you get the picture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 3 minutes ago, BIllyD said: Speed limits, excessive tax etc etc, I think you get the picture. So not a complete ban on cars, tobacco, alcohol and fatty foods, people allowed to moderate their own risk, yes I get the picture. In your example the speed limit is the masks and the excessive taxes are social distancing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIllyD Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 3 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: So not a complete ban on cars, tobacco, alcohol and fatty foods, people allowed to moderate their own risk, yes I get the picture. In your example the speed limit is the masks and the excessive taxes are social distancing. Yup, restrictions that may be needed going forward to control the risk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uptherams Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 10 minutes ago, BIllyD said: Speed limits, excessive tax etc etc, I think you get the picture. So are all the authoritians proposing we ban processed food, force everyone to exercise, ban alcohol and cigs too. Give people food packages so they don't overeat? Healthy people should not be punished because others consciously make the wrong choices. Many on this thread don't even leave their homes. Cardiovascular disease will get the men, not Covid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIllyD Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 33 minutes ago, Norman said: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9255903/Matt-Hancock-hopes-treatable-virus-disease-live-like-flu.html Doesn't sound like the government, its advisors and its scientists think we can eradicate it completely at any time in the future. Another point to take into account when expressing an opinion on when to open up. I expect it will be around for a long time yet, which is why in my opinion it's essential to get it right this time. All being well the figures will come in and show how effective the vaccine has been and we can start to put that plan in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIllyD Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 3 minutes ago, Uptherams said: So are all the authoritians proposing we ban processed food, force everyone to exercise, ban alcohol and cigs too. Give people food packages so they don't overeat? Healthy people should not be punished because others consciously make the wrong choices. Many on this thread don't even leave their homes. Cardiovascular disease will get the men, not Covid. Sorry pal, not sure what you are saying or what your point is ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 12 minutes ago, BIllyD said: Yup, restrictions that may be needed going forward to control the risk. Yep, restrictions proportionate to the risk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith Happens Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 2 minutes ago, BIllyD said: I expect it will be around for a long time yet, which is why in my opinion it's essential to get it right this time. All being well the figures will come in and show how effective the vaccine has been and we can start to put that plan in place. will always be I think, the virus which caused the pandemic in the late 60s is and is included in annual flu jabs. we probably have to accept we will vaccinate people each year and for whatever reason, the jab not protecting someone or undiagnosed underlying condition or just bad luck, that people will die each year. We accept 20k deaths a year from flu, we will probably have to accept there will be significant deaths each year from covid. What the level of acceptance is i don't know as would rather no one had to die but its life I guess that people will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIllyD Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 7 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: Yep, restrictions proportionate to the risk. Which is exactly my point, once in two weeks time the vaccine is proved effective, a road map can be put in place to open up the country again. Unfortunately a vaccine isn't effective if 2m people refuse to take it, therefore you have to take i to account the impact of this proportionate to the risk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 Just now, BIllyD said: Which is exactly my point, once in two weeks time the vaccine is proved effective, a road map can be put in place to open up the country again. Unfortunately a vaccine isn't effective if 2m people refuse to take it, therefore you have to take i to account the impact of this proportionate to the risk. What is all this road map about though? If the vaccine is effective then why the need for a road map? If 2m refuse to have the jab then that is their choice and them moderating their own risk. Or are you ok with them holding the other 68m in this nation to ransom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith Happens Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 4 minutes ago, BIllyD said: Which is exactly my point, once in two weeks time the vaccine is proved effective, a road map can be put in place to open up the country again. Unfortunately a vaccine isn't effective if 2m people refuse to take it, therefore you have to take i to account the impact of this proportionate to the are you talking 2 million of the people invited so far or overall? I thought take up so far was good, I'd read something like 96% ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 4 minutes ago, BIllyD said: Which is exactly my point, once in two weeks time the vaccine is proved effective, a road map can be put in place to open up the country again. Unfortunately a vaccine isn't effective if 2m people refuse to take it, therefore you have to take i to account the impact of this proportionate to the risk. And if they aren’t we carry on with the country locked down forever ??♂️, Remove as appropriate ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 2 minutes ago, Archied said: And if they aren’t we carry on with the country locked down forever ??♂️, Remove as appropriate ? Whether vaccines work or not we cannot carry on like this forever , that harsh fact has to be faced Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gone Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 We’ve been in lockdown for so long now can’t wait to get you and about again, does anyone know if Blockbusters and Woolworths opening times are still the same ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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