The Politics Thread 2020

[Stive Pesley]

48 minutes ago, Uptherams said:

?? Of course they are ??

That's your evidence? Fair enough

I'm not even defending WHO or the CCP, as I'm sure they have plenty to answer for, I'm just curious as to how you've stated as fact that they have covered stuff up, rather than just alleging it. See also your statement of fact about cyber attacks from China.

I have no problem with people alleging this stuff, but I have a problem with people dressing up allegations as fact - especially if they are the same people who regularly pull up other people on that sort of behaviour.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself

 

 

[TramRam]

30 minutes ago, Bob The Badger said:

1. Firstly, it's not the first time Trump has done this. Twice before he's been arsy with Asian looking woman, asking one where she was from. He doesn't do that to other people. It was a pretty soft ball question to any politician worth their salt.

2. Secondly, I think you're referring to his new press secretary Kayleigh McEnany, who is an utter plank.

She managed to lie literally more than she told the truth at her first press briefing. She said with a straight face that Trump has never lied about any of his affairs or the claims made against him of sexual misconduct, even though he was caught lying on Airforce One saying he didn't even know who Stormy Daniels was, and there are over 20 credible claims against him.

She was known before getting the job as the woman who argued (trolled) on TV to suggest Obama started ISIS and claimed that the message coming out of Charlotteville by the right wing was one of love and inclusiveness.

She's also a birther supporter and said on live TV that Obama's brother still lives in a hut in Kenya and denies attacks on blacks by white Police Officers are ever racist.

OTOH, she looks remarkably like almost every woman Trump has ever had an affair with or been accused of being sexually inappropriate with.

So there is that.

1. I'll take your word for it, But then the Asian Journalist saw fit to bring her ethnicity into it, With prompting from Trump.

2. Yes that's the female, Only saw her the once, She did a fare job in turning the questioning onto the press, As for her being "an utter plank" again i'll take your word for it.

3. As for the rest of your attack on her...again i'll take your word for it.

Politics is a little like Comedy, A quick fire comeback can do more damage than a fully loaded AK47, This part of Politics has died, Trump imo has no humour and can only "flounce off" for him to believe he's won the argument.

Good journalism died when they stopped telling the truth for a major headline.

[G STAR RAM]

56 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said:

Because they are just conspiracy theories at the moment. Unless you have concrete evidence?

So China and WHO response being slow is a conspiracy theory but the UK Government response being slow is fact? How does that work out of interest? 

[Bob The Badger]

8 minutes ago, Uptherams said:

Litterally everytime a journalist is being a dick, one way or another, he asks where they are from are who they work for, or shuts down someone for trying to put the President on the naughty step, to score points rather than ask a serious question. 

No he doesn't. That's not even close to being true.

Love him or loathe him, he simply can't be bothered with this nonesnse. Anyone else who thinks they'd tolerate this guff on a daily basis, is deluding themselves. 

He's brash, arrogant, direct, egotistical, speaks his mind and isn't diplomatic. But the amount of accusations thrown at him are ridiculous. People project their personal problems on to him. 

You need to keep up because I rarely hear him accused of anything that isn't true and demonstrably so. If you want to share some I'm happy to respond and actually dig to find the truth.

Instead of talking and asking about the actions of the CCP, or The WHO, or what is potentially the biggest political story in modern politics..Obomagate, we get this nonesnse. 

Many of his press conferences have been over 2 hours long. He is getting asked questions across the board, but he can't stop himself making ridiculous claims that he then gets called out on it. Plus he pulled the US out of the WHO, so there's not a lot they can ask about that with the US on the outside looking in.

I'm not sure what you mean with Obamagate. If it's that Obama called Trump out for corrupting the Justice Department (which he clearly has - it is supposed to be independent from the Executive branch of Government) by dropping charges against a man who Obama warned him about during the transition - the Security Services knew Flynn was a security risk and still Trump hired him - then yeh we should be earing more about that.

I just can't believe people still can't see most of the media for what it is. They are telling people what to think, feel and do. 

Staggeringly you have this the wrong way round. Trump is trying to control the media and they are refusing to play ball.

And it's not just left leaning media, he falls out with everybody. He has had numerous tantrums about  the right-wing Fox News  because they reported some facts he didn't like and because they have supported some fellow journalists. He goes ape poo if Fox even report poor poll numbers, he's a control freak of biblical proportions.

He's eve fallen out with Matt Drudge who is about as far right as you can get and a huge Trump supporter to start with. The Drudge Report is now openly hostile to Trump because of his raging incompetence and constant lying.

I couldn't stand Thatcher, but she'd have dealt with all this in her stride and wouldn't have stropped out of a press sconference over such a question. He's utterly pathetic and spineless.

 

 

[TramRam]

16 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

Just to clarify, can you remind me what opinion you were offering?

Given your own responses (“not a clue” for example) and the fact “she missed the boat” because she was being polite and then he refused to let her ask her question suggests he was acting in a mature and rational way? 
 

If your answer is yes, then I guess we’ll have to beg to differ.

If your answer is no then surely it is bizarre for anyone to try to defend him.

 

1.That journalist said or something similar "I was letting this journalist ask more" I guess...as I don't know what's going through his mind, She missed the boat with being nice to another journalist.

[Uptherams]

2 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said:

That's your evidence? Fair enough

I'm not even defending WHO or the CCP, as I'm sure they have plenty to answer for, I'm just curious as to how you've stated as fact that they have covered stuff up, rather than just alleging it. See also your statement of fact about cyber attacks from China.

I have no problem with people alleging this stuff, but I have a problem with people dressing up allegations as fact - especially if they are the same people who regularly pull up other people on that sort of behaviour.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself

 

 

Adjust the timeline political activists are sharing then, remove the emotive language and add context to each statement. Case in point, missed 5th Cobra meeting. 

Honestly, you need to broaden your range of sources for news, etc. Are you seriously unaware of the cyber attacks ?‍♂️

[Bob The Badger]

14 minutes ago, Highgate said:

She's always been a outspoken conservative it seems, but was sharply critical of Trump before he got elected in 2016, calling him an 'inauthentic Republican' and describing some of his comments as racist, derogatory and hateful. 

It appears she had a change of heart in the last few years. ?

I have wondered a few times if Trump even knows she said that?

She went off the deep end when she got the job with CNN.

But maybe she was on some form of bonus scheme that the more mental she sounded the more she got paid.

She must be worth a small fortune.

[Bob The Badger]

3 minutes ago, TramRam said:

1.That journalist said or something similar "I was letting this journalist ask more" I guess...as I don't know what's going through his mind, She missed the boat with being nice to another journalist.

The White House Press Corps have protocols and one is to allow any journalist to ask a follow up question.

Another is that they allocate seats. Which is why the same reporter who Trump's aides tried to move the back of a press conference because Trump didn't like her. Not only did she refuse by the journalist sat at the back refused to move to a prime seat.

[Uptherams]

3 minutes ago, Bob The Badger said:

 

You've clearly not watched many unedited press conferences then. He attacks the media constantly. Weird, you contradict yourself by the end ?‍♂️

Follows on from the same logic then i presume. Not in China, can't ask questions of them..

Trumps apparently a massive idiot and has no filter. Wouldn't be too difficult to rephrase questions and ask in a better tone, to get more answers then would it. 

Nah, the media is trying to control you, me and everyone. #Obamagate got over 4 million tweets and twitter censored this and the media's reporting of this scandal is a complete shambles. 

[Stive Pesley]

24 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

So China and WHO response being slow is a conspiracy theory but the UK Government response being slow is fact? How does that work out of interest? 

Because there was a huge list of dates and events in what I posted earlier. They are all facts, but you are more than welcome to disagree with how those facts might have been framed (and other facts that may have been omitted). That's what we're here to debate

The difference is that there is no attempt to present any facts about how WHO and the CCP have covered stuff up, Just a blind statement of fact that they have. And intransigence in the face of any request for sources. The worst kind of political argument

Remember when some people said Jacob Rees-Mogg had profited from Brexit and you went nuts insisting that those people provide concrete evidence that this was true? 

Yeah - that

[TramRam]

6 minutes ago, Bob The Badger said:

The White House Press Corps have protocols and one is to allow any journalist to ask a follow up question.

Another is that they allocate seats. Which is why the same reporter who Trump's aides tried to move the back of a press conference because Trump didn't like her. Not only did she refuse by the journalist sat at the back refused to move to a prime seat.

I guess your point is, Trump didn't follow "protocol", I'm sure the press will slight him for it, Also it gives people on message boards an opportunity to either ridicule him or stand up for him...if given an opportunity, I can do both.

[Bob The Badger]

5 minutes ago, Uptherams said:

You've clearly not watched many unedited press conferences then. He attacks the media constantly. Weird, you contradict yourself by the end ?‍♂️

Follows on from the same logic then i presume. Not in China, can't ask questions of them..

Trumps apparently a massive idiot and has no filter. Wouldn't be too difficult to rephrase questions and ask in a better tone, to get more answers then would it. 

Nah, the media is trying to control you, me and everyone. #Obamagate got over 4 million tweets and twitter censored this and the media's reporting of this scandal is a complete shambles. 

I've watched (or listened to) most of them. He gets asks literally scores of questions every time. Just before the disinfectant incident he'd gone 3 days without having a go at anybody. A mate of mine over here where WhatsApping each other about how well he was doing.

When he does lose his rag, that is when it then gets reported. I cannot remember seeing Obama ever get angry with a journalist even when they were questioning his heritage and Fox news were calling him unpresidential for wearing a tan suit.

Obamagate suffers from one teeny-tiny flaw. It's utter baalocks.

As has been attested to by numerous outgoing members of Trump's transition team.

There was no undermining, no nasty notes left in draws, no secret plan by Obama, it's just right wing conspiracy nonsense dragged up again because Bill Barr dropped charges against a man who had admitted his guilt and who Mike Pence wanted gone for lying to him as well as the FBI.

 

[1of4]

38 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

So China and WHO response being slow is a conspiracy theory but the UK Government response being slow is fact? How does that work out of interest? 

Isn't the China and the WHO conspiracy theory, is that their response was slow to cover-up wrongdoings by the Chinese government. Whereas our owns government's slow response was in fact down to pure incompetence.

But I suppose we'll never know until this world crisis is over and an investigation is held.

[Uptherams]

1 hour ago, Bob The Badger said:

I've watched (or listened to) most of them. He gets asks literally scores of questions every time. Just before the disinfectant incident he'd gone 3 days without having a go at anybody. A mate of mine over here where WhatsApping each other about how well he was doing.

When he does lose his rag, that is when it then gets reported. I cannot remember seeing Obama ever get angry with a journalist even when they were questioning his heritage and Fox news were calling him unpresidential for wearing a tan suit.

Obamagate suffers from one teeny-tiny flaw. It's utter baalocks.

As has been attested to by numerous outgoing members of Trump's transition team.

There was no undermining, no nasty notes left in draws, no secret plan by Obama, it's just right wing conspiracy nonsense dragged up again because Bill Barr dropped charges against a man who had admitted his guilt and who Mike Pence wanted gone for lying to him as well as the FBI.

 

A presidential candidate was spied on. The justification for which has resorted in nothing tangible. Much of the findings and logistics behind what lead to the spying has been closed off..for now  

It appears as though the decisions taken to spy were politically motivated. 

People are asking for transparacy. But far lefties only want transparacy when it's for their cause. 

Strange, did i not criticise Trump enough. ??‍♂️

Same poo this side of the Atlantic with Russia Russia Russia. 

[Eatonram]

28 minutes ago, Uptherams said:

A presidential candidate was spied on. The justification for which has resorted in nothing tangible. Much of the findings and logistics behind what lead to the spying has been closed off..for now  

It appears as though the decisions taken to spy were politically motivated. 

People are asking for transparacy. But far lefties only want transparacy when it's for their cause. 

Strange, did i not criticise Trump enough. ??‍♂️

Same poo this side of the Atlantic with Russia Russia Russia. 

As President wouldn't Trump have access to all the evidence necessary to support your allegations? I can't imagine for a minute that he would hold back to protect Obama or anyone complicit in what would surely be a crime. What do you think is preventing him?

 

Sounds like just another nut job conspiracy theory that are two a penny in the USA.

[Uptherams]

9 minutes ago, Eatonram said:

As President wouldn't Trump have access to all the evidence necessary to support your allegations? I can't imagine for a minute that he would hold back to protect Obama or anyone complicit in what would surely be a crime. What do you think is preventing him?

 

Sounds like just another nut job conspiracy theory that are two a penny in the USA.

If only it were that simple. Unfortunately it isn't and for many reasons. Given what's happened and the public demand, there needs to be transparacy. Will help clear up all matters Russia related, Obama and some officials inside the intelligence agencies. 

Many people are concerned what might be uncovered and how they'll continue to maintain their argument and principles.

One way or another, some people are guilty of something and this has been dragged on too long. 

 

[Anon]

6 minutes ago, Uptherams said:

If only it were that simple. Unfortunately it isn't and for many reasons. Given what's happened and the public demand, there needs to be transparacy. Will help clear up all matters Russia related, Obama and some officials inside the intelligence agencies. 

Many people are concerned what might be uncovered and how they'll continue to maintain their argument and principles.

One way or another, some people are guilty of something and this has been dragged on too long. 

 

I'd warn against dragging Obama's name into this. There is a lack of transparency, but that's mainly to do with the multitude of alphabet soup agencies that seem to exist mainly to serve themselves at this point. Obama probably did have people looking into the Trump campaign, but he's smart enough to have kept several degrees of separation between himself and any actual snooping, and honestly he'd have been remiss not to keep a very close eye on a billionaire entering the political system. I say this a someone who is generally supportive of Trump's presidency. Don't forget that the Republicans, especially the tea party, had plenty of conspiracy theories about Obama that were just as insane as the stuff the Trump derangement syndrome crowd come out with.

[Uptherams]

5 minutes ago, Anon said:

I'd warn against dragging Obama's name into this. There is a lack of transparency, but that's mainly to do with the multitude of alphabet soup agencies that seem to exist mainly to serve themselves at this point. Obama probably did have people looking into the Trump campaign, but he's smart enough to have kept several degrees of separation between himself and any actual snooping, and honestly he'd have been remiss not to keep a very close eye on a billionaire entering the political system. I say this a someone who is generally supportive of Trump's presidency. Don't forget that the Republicans, especially the tea party, had plenty of conspiracy theories about Obama that were just as insane as the stuff the Trump derangement syndrome crowd come out with.

I'd advise you to look at my last half dozen or so posts. ??

[Anon]

5 minutes ago, Uptherams said:

I'd advise you to look at my last half dozen or so posts. ??

Yeah, apologies. I'd only read the post I quoted.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm off to go and teach my grandma how to suck eggs.

[Bob The Badger]

1 hour ago, Uptherams said:

A presidential candidate was spied on.

Nope.

He tried that line 3+ years ago and it was found not to be true.

He'd dragging it up now to deflect from Fauci's testimony today.

Or do you think that's a coincidence, that he dropped it for so long? And did so after Senate Intel couldn't support his belief. When the Republicans control Senate.

Ya know, his own party wouldn't back him up. I wonder why?

The people who he was advised to avoid were spied upon and some of his team fell under that investigation because they were setting up back channels before they were legally allowed to do so ie after the inauguration.

Trump himself was not spied upon.

Since the year DOT the security services have been accused of being right wing because over here you have to register who you support before you vote and the majority are Republicans.

But the minute they stand up to Trump they're suddenly left wing or part of the *deep state*

It's not that you didn't criticize Trump enough, that is neither here nor there.

It's that you are spectacularly uninformed and ignorant of basic facts.