Matej Vydra - Signed for Burnley

[The Scarlet Pimpernel]

1 minute ago, lukedcfc said:

Can't beleive we are going to sell our main man for 11m, hes not even in his final year of his contract. 

So if nobody wants to pay any more you would keep him and play this season with no new players either bought or loaned?

[cheron85]

18 minutes ago, Papahet said:

Errrm, well we are in the process of selling our only asset at the club to another Championship rival, solely to stay within FFP and give Frank a million or two to play with.

That's what almost all teams do - I've mentioned it before but look at Spurs selling Bale - They built a much stronger squad having done that - Essentially only the likes of Man Utd, City, Chelsea, PSG etc can get away with not selling players

20 minutes ago, Papahet said:

Hell,  just search for the SwissRamble twitter account, that'll explain in more detail how bad things look regarding our financial position anyway.

Not sure how legit some dude on Twitter is - Our own resident accountant (now left?) here on the forum said we're fine and all the doom and gloom merchants don't know what they're on about

21 minutes ago, Papahet said:

I'll say this though. Morris was part of the board with Gadsby who couldn't wait to sell up to the Americans in 2007, Morris shown no interest in the club whatsoever since then, these "mid table finishes with nothing to play for past December, praying for just a million to be spent on a player in January to give us something to hold on to as attendances plummeted" you mention, why couldn't Mel have come in and helped us out back then huh?

He didn't have the money then! He hadn't sold his shares in King at that point and was probably only worth in the 10s of millions - He probably did contribute his business knowledge and some money at that point but he couldn't afford to bankroll us like he has been recently

23 minutes ago, Papahet said:

He literally only reappeared when it looked like we could actually gain promotion. He thought he'd make a fortune turning us into a Premiership side, that major backfired and now himself and the club are paying the price for it. Massive backwards step and we look nowhere closer to getting out the division now than we did in 2014

The only massive backwards step we made was firing McClaren the first time - He's the guy who took us to Wembley and given a bit more money and some consistency behind the scenes I think we would be in a better position

I'm not a blind follower of Uncle Mel - I think the managerial merry-go-round has been a joke - I think the appointments have all been wrong - Everything since the first McClaren firing - However we don't know how much of the behind the scenes nonsense has been him and how much was Rush - Certainly since Rush left we've suddenly given the manager a bit of time - Rowett's plummet from 2nd to falling out of the playoffs would have got McClaren and Clement fired...

[SaintRam]

If we keep Vydra, I expect by the end of the season folks on here would be complaining about not selling him to Leeds for £11m - because I don't think he'd play nearly as much, let alone score as many. Sure, conjecture on my part but I think his career history supports me.

If we sell Vydra, people will complain and spit their dummies out but it will all be silenced if Derby do well without him, or if indeed, he fails to perform for Leeds. 

Football fandom is a fickle business.

[Papahet]

18 minutes ago, Kennington Ram said:

Selling to hopefully invest in more than one new assets though. If we buy well, we take nearly £14m from AW and MV, get 3 players and maybe Abraham on loan, and either best case go up or if we have spent well, at least bought players we can receive £14m for down the line. It's the Butterfield's and Shackells that worry me far more than selling Vydra for a tidy amount.

Didn't the sales of Hendrick, Hughes and Ince teach you anything ?

Sold those three for 20 odd million and brought what exactly with the money? Why are people so confident we will spend it wisely all of a sudden? Probably buy someone like Leon Clarke off the back of last seasons goals for 8 million.

[Ambitious]

2 minutes ago, Papahet said:

Didn't the sales of Hendrick, Hughes and Ince teach you anything ?

Sold those three for 20 odd million and brought what exactly with the money? Why are people so confident we will spend it wisely all of a sudden? Probably buy someone like Leon Clarke off the back of last seasons goals for 8 million.

The irony here, of course, is that the sale of Hendrick ultimately paid for Vydra... as well as Anya. 

Ince & Hughes - Davies, Huddlestone, Lawrence & Wisdom. 

[Animal is a Ram]

4 minutes ago, Papahet said:

Didn't the sales of Hendrick, Hughes and Ince teach you anything ?

Sold those three for 20 odd million and brought what exactly with the money? Why are people so confident we will spend it wisely all of a sudden? Probably buy someone like Leon Clarke off the back of last seasons goals for 8 million.

Distinct lack of Sam Rush for a start.

[SaintRam]

4 minutes ago, Animal is a Ram said:

Distinct lack of Sam Rush for a start.

"Always gets his man" we said, gleefully. Gloating.

Turns out he was offering them 20k a week more than they were worth. Hindsight. 

[DCFC1388]

10 minutes ago, Papahet said:

Didn't the sales of Hendrick, Hughes and Ince teach you anything ?

Sold those three for 20 odd million and brought what exactly with the money? Why are people so confident we will spend it wisely all of a sudden? Probably buy someone like Leon Clarke off the back of last seasons goals for 8 million.

Maybe they have trust in the new managements judgment of players as they have no reason not to?

And with the Ince money we got Lawrence, still young and can easily repay the money back - Vydra has shown what 1 good season can do to a players value.

[Premier ram]

Everybody calm down a bit , Vyds hasnt gone yet and if he does im sure the club have an adequate replacement lined up , nobody knows whats going on behind the scenes , so chill out and enjoy the close season , Franks here , Rowett isnt , whats not to enjoy

[Papahet]

22 minutes ago, Ambitious said:

The irony here, of course, is that the sale of Hendrick ultimately paid for Vydra... as well as Anya. 

Ince & Hughes - Davies, Huddlestone, Lawrence & Wisdom. 

Nah, the sale of Jeff paid for Anya and our marquee signing of Chris Weale - could never forget one of the worst deadlines in our history.

Then we later went on to sign Nugent for a couple of million, along with a Scottish wiz kid we have yet to see kick a first team football in January window.

Money down the pooper IMO.

Davies is about the only player I can honestly say we got a bargain out of when I look through the squad. We have paid over the odds far too often for bang average and sold for peanuts ever since I can remember. Even Forest got decent transfer fee's under Fawaz.

[cheron85]

13 minutes ago, Papahet said:

Nah, the sale of Jeff paid for Anya and our marquee signing of Chris Weale - could never forget one of the worst deadlines in our history.

Then we later went on to sign Nugent for a couple of million, along with a Scottish wiz kid we have yet to see kick a first team football in January window.

Money down the pooper IMO.

Davies is about the only player I can honestly say we got a bargain out of when I look through the squad. We have paid over the odds far too often for bang average and sold for peanuts ever since I can remember. Even Forest got decent transfer fee's under Fawaz.

How's that selective memory working out for you?

Seems to keep you happy - But also seems to create a lot of negative sentiment about your opinions...

[jimbobram]

14 minutes ago, Papahet said:

 Even Forest got decent transfer fee's under Fawaz.

Yeah, and it went straight in his pockets

[Papahet]

10 minutes ago, cheron85 said:

How's that selective memory working out for you?

Seems to keep you happy - But also seems to create a lot of negative sentiment about your opinions...

My memory is fine thanks. We sold Hendrick on deadline day and brought in Anya and Weale - when everyone was expecting a marquee signing.

Last summer we sell Hughes for peanuts to Watford and bring in Tom Huddlestone for 2.5m. Another over 30 who won't improve, on big wages and with no potential sell on value.

Sell Tom Ince and bring in Lawrence off the back of a decent loan at Ipswich for 7 million (could be wrong on figure thereabouts). Still not in a million years worth that much.

3m for Blackman I won't forget in a hurry either. This club has taken the piss with transfer fee's both ins and outs and I don't suddenly expect to change under Lampard. It's happened under Mac, it's happened under Clement, under Pearson, under Rowett and it'll happen with Vydra under Frank Lampard.

[cheron85]

18 minutes ago, Papahet said:

My memory is fine thanks. We sold Hendrick on deadline day

Hendrick was a rotation player for us - A good one - But was never first choice, got the chance to go to the Premier League and was at a time when we had enough players for the CM positions

19 minutes ago, Papahet said:

Last summer we sell Hughes for peanuts to Watford and bring in Tom Huddlestone for 2.5m. Another over 30 who won't improve, on big wages and with no potential sell on value.

Hughes wanted to go - Needed to test himself in the PL - If the guy wanted out and only one club came in then obviously we get whatever they're willing to pay

Huddlestone was obviously central to the way Rowett wanted to play - He was the focus everything seemed to be built around

20 minutes ago, Papahet said:

Sell Tom Ince and bring in Lawrence off the back of a decent loan at Ipswich for 7 million (could be wrong on figure thereabouts). Still not in a million years worth that much.

I admit the Ince sale rankles with me - But ALL suggestion was that Rowett made that decision - Nothing to do with the owner - And Lawrence was £5.5m possibly rising to £7m - He's 1 season in - Under a manager who couldn't get the best out of him all the time - And he was still one of our best players

22 minutes ago, Papahet said:

It's happened under Mac

The vast number of players he signed eh? For big fees? Or are you still whining about Bent's wages?

[Day]

@Papahet One minute you're praising GSE for having us under control financially, whilst having a pop at the club for having a whopping wage bill. Your next breath is being used have a go at the club for selling it's top players, wouldn't that lower the wage bill you was complaining about?

Next we're having disappointing transfer windows with signings of Chris Weale and £2m on David Nugent whilst expecting marquee signings, did you want us to spend more of Mel's money to help lower the wage bill as I'm getting really confused now as marquee signings mean big money.

Bargain marquee signings on low wages are entering that Unicorn territory again, the one bargain arrival you speak of in Davies wasn't given the red carpet treatment. 

Do you want the wage bill lowered or are you looking for marquee signings, is promotion of any interest to you or would you be just as happy mid table under and comfortably treading water?

[Papahet]

22 minutes ago, cheron85 said:

Hendrick was a rotation player for us - A good one - But was never first choice, got the chance to go to the Premier League and was at a time when we had enough players for the CM positions And now we have such wonderful options in midfield with Huddlestone, a major crock in Thorne, another aging player in Ledley, "Bradley Derby City Johnson" and someone who has barely set the world alight since 2014 in Craig Bryson. great

Hughes wanted to go - Needed to test himself in the PL - If the guy wanted out and only one club came in then obviously we get whatever they're willing to pay Bryson wanted out the second the play off game was over, he drove up to Turf Moor and only did a U-turn once we threw down a lovely 5 year deal. I'd have done the same with Hughes personally rather than cashed in at such a lousy prize.

Huddlestone was obviously central to the way Rowett wanted to play - He was the focus everything seemed to be built around

I admit the Ince sale rankles with me - But ALL suggestion was that Rowett made that decision - Nothing to do with the owner - And Lawrence was £5.5m possibly rising to £7m - He's 1 season in - Under a manager who couldn't get the best out of him all the time - And he was still one of our best players He's had one good season in his entire career, I honestly don't get the hype around the lad. Look's like a one season wonder if you ask me

The vast number of players he signed eh? For big fees? Or are you still whining about Bent's wages? Warnock, Bent, Albentosa, Whitbread, Shotton. Not one of them a success here. I won't mention the several u23's signed up and later released without a chance of first team football here.

 

[cheron85]

2 minutes ago, Papahet said:

And now we have such wonderful options in midfield with Huddlestone, a major crock in Thorne, another aging player in Ledley, "Bradley Derby City Johnson" and someone who has barely set the world alight since 2014 in Craig Bryson. great

Bryson wanted out the second the play off game was over, he drove up to Turf Moor and only did a U-turn once we threw down a lovely 5 year deal. I'd have done the same with Hughes personally rather than cashed in at such a lousy prize.

Huddlestone was obviously central to the way Rowett wanted to play - He was the focus everything seemed to be built around

He's had one good season in his entire career, I honestly don't get the hype around the lad. Look's like a one season wonder if you ask me

Warnock, Bent, Albentosa, Whitbread, Shotton. Not one of them a success here. I won't mention the several u23's signed up and later released without a chance of first team football here.

You really do like the benefit of hindsight don't you? You complain about things which have happened over a period of years as if they could have been easily seen from day 1... You're just a massive whiner for the sake of whining - Try being constructive - What's your solution eh? What would be the right thing to do NOW? 

Thorne was a quality signing at the time - No-one could have predicted what a horrible time he would have with injury - He's also 25 so has time on his side still

Hughes wanted higher level football - He got signed by a club who have been in the Prem for a while - When Bryson was going to head north no-one predicted that Burnley would last more than a season]

Lawrence is 24 - There are loads of players who don't kick on til they're older than that - Ince had abou8t 1 good season under his belt before he joined us - Jamie Vardy (who everyone loves to quote) was 25 before he signed for Leicester...

How much money was spent on those signings you quote under Macca? You complain about spending too much money on players - And then quote the EXACT reason why we're trying to spend decent money - If you spend small you are less likely to get a good player

[Papahet]

20 minutes ago, David said:

@Papahet One minute you're praising GSE for having us under control financially, whilst having a pop at the club for having a whopping wage bill. Your next breath is being used have a go at the club for selling it's top players, wouldn't that lower the wage bill you was complaining about?

Next we're having disappointing transfer windows with signings of Chris Weale and £2m on David Nugent whilst expecting marquee signings, did you want us to spend more of Mel's money to help lower the wage bill as I'm getting really confused now as marquee signings mean big money.

Bargain marquee signings on low wages are entering that Unicorn territory again, the one bargain arrival you speak of in Davies wasn't given the red carpet treatment. 

Do you want the wage bill lowered or are you looking for marquee signings, is promotion of any interest to you or would you be just as happy mid table under and comfortably treading water?

GSE had the wage bill under control, it took 5 years for Nigel to get it to a respectable amount from the mess Jewell left us in. Mac took us to another level without Mel Morris money. Bamford, Thorne, Wisdom, Dawkins ETC all coming in on loan, without a major cash injection. We soon shot up the league once these players came in and settled.

We loss in the final as everyone knows. But then Mel pops up and suddenly contracts are getting thrown around everywhere after a run of form. Sure we still got the odd gem on loan like Ibe and Ince but it was the start of the downfall the second we sacked Mac. WTF made Morris spend that amount under Paul Clement? I get Ince, but then Shackell, Bent, Johnson, Butterfield, Weimann, Blackman, Baird....? It just got so amateur and was turning into a game of Fifa. Now 4 years or more on, we are paying the price. Sell Hendrick, sell Ince, sell Hughes and now Vydra - the only reason for that is simple, FFP, from Mel's spending spree in the first place!

How can you build a top side if you are selling the better players off, especially to a rival? I look at the current squad and it's nothing special bar the odd one or two like Davies and Carson - even those won't be worth much if we absolutely needed the money towards "balancing the books".

I honestly don't get the love for Mel, he's spend money but it's done us no good whatsoever. He might message you in support of the forum and act like a lad and offer you a drink or what not. But that doesn't take away the fact he's done a terrible job of running a football club.

What would it take for people to wake up and see we have gone backwards since 2014? Would an embargo do it? Crowds dropping to under 20k? Because selling you're better players is never a sight a club is moving forward.

 

[Papahet]

7 minutes ago, cheron85 said:

You really do like the benefit of hindsight don't you? You complain about things which have happened over a period of years as if they could have been easily seen from day 1... You're just a massive whiner for the sake of whining - Try being constructive - What's your solution eh? What would be the right thing to do NOW? 

Thorne was a quality signing at the time - No-one could have predicted what a horrible time he would have with injury - He's also 25 so has time on his side still

Hughes wanted higher level football - He got signed by a club who have been in the Prem for a while - When Bryson was going to head north no-one predicted that Burnley would last more than a season]

Lawrence is 24 - There are loads of players who don't kick on til they're older than that - Ince had abou8t 1 good season under his belt before he joined us - Jamie Vardy (who everyone loves to quote) was 25 before he signed for Leicester...

How much money was spent on those signings you quote under Macca? You complain about spending too much money on players - And then quote the EXACT reason why we're trying to spend decent money - If you spend small you are less likely to get a good player

Hindsight.

Show me the squad and it's age and potential in 2014 and then stick up the crap we currently have contracted today.

If you spend small, they are most likely to be aging hasbeens no other sod wants a'la Bent, Warnock, Shackell and Baird.

 

[DCFC1388]

6 minutes ago, Papahet said:

GSE had the wage bill under control, it took 5 years for Nigel to get it to a respectable amount from the mess Jewell left us in. Mac took us to another level without Mel Morris money. Bamford, Thorne, Wisdom, Dawkins ETC all coming in on loan, without a major cash injection. We soon shot up the league once these players came in and settled.

We loss in the final as everyone knows. But then Mel pops up and suddenly contracts are getting thrown around everywhere after a run of form. Sure we still got the odd gem on loan like Ibe and Ince but it was the start of the downfall the second we sacked Mac. WTF made Morris spend that amount under Paul Clement? I get Ince, but then Shackell, Bent, Johnson, Butterfield, Weimann, Blackman, Baird....? It just got so amateur and was turning into a game of Fifa. Now 4 years or more on, we are paying the price. Sell Hendrick, sell Ince, sell Hughes and now Vydra - the only reason for that is simple, FFP, from Mel's spending spree in the first place!

How can you build a top side if you are selling the better players off, especially to a rival? I look at the current squad and it's nothing special bar the odd one or two like Davies and Carson - even those won't be worth much if we absolutely needed the money towards "balancing the books".

I honestly don't get the love for Mel, he's spend money but it's done us no good whatsoever. He might message you in support of the forum and act like a lad and offer you a drink or what not. But that doesn't take away the fact he's done a terrible job of running a football club.

What would it take for people to wake up and see we have gone backwards since 2014? Would an embargo do it? Crowds dropping to under 20k? Because selling you're better players is never a sight a club is moving forward.

 

If you get Ince then you should also get why we got Bent in on a free, Baird was also on a free. Johnson had a quality season before we signed him and a lot of fans were buzzing about his signing, he just hasn't hit those heights in a Derby shirt, similar with Butterfield - but these things happen, Torres was unbelievable at Liverpool but then didn't hit the heights at Chelsea this happens all the time at all levels of football for all sorts of reasons from wrong formations to get the best out the player to off field issue's and not settling.

The Shackell signing was because it was deemed that our attacking was strong but defence was weak and Shackell was bought in to strengthen this which he did in his first season, yes we paid over the odds but at the start of that season it was a gamble in the hope that the high fee would result in us being more solid and promotion gained which then covered the higher price.