Fans Forum 13th March

[RoyMac5]

23 minutes ago, Mistaram said:

Roy I don't know if you have seen these under23 players because the ones who are presently with us and not on loan are nowhere near ready for Championship football ...

Maybe not game in game out, nor perhaps even 90 minutes. But some of them have played against other Prem U23 teams with over age players in and have played well. Didn't the Arsenal team have Wilshere in it? I think there's nothing like giving them a go to see whether they're ready...

[EnigmaRam]

1 hour ago, Mistaram said:

Roy I don't know if you have seen these under23 players because the ones who are presently with us and not on loan are nowhere near ready for Championship football  Thomas is skilled but still physically weak that's because he's still maturing Bogle is a very good attacking full back but defensively still a bit naive  No good people blaming Rowett for not playing them you have to be extremely careful with youngster to early and you can ruin a career Can't remember Mclaren giving to many youngsters their debuts 

What's this physically weak nonsense? Have you seen some of the players in the championship and premiership? In fact the world over. Do you have to be 6 foot 6 and 18 stone of prime muscle to play football?

sessegnon was hardly physically developed when he was thrown in at 15 was it? Stirlings hardly a muscle bosun either and it doesn't stop him. 

[Steve Bloomer's Washing]

Just gonna add some light relief to this serious discussion with this - Rowett having a cheeky pop at Mel at the fans' forum (ICYMI):
 

 

[Angry Ram]

Okay, watched the bit about the academy.. So in essence what they are saying is the academy is not producing as they would have hoped. £5mil per annum they are investing but unless we are midtable, they won't really get a chance. Mel gets all pompus asking how many we want in the team and he is inferring it's 4 or 5 youth in there as starters. How much slack would we cut them !! FFS the geezer is all over the place. Typical push it back with an extreame. Gary is so wrapped up with what others do.. Burnley, Hull, Brighton..  He won't change unless his hand is forced, a bit like Saturday. What exactly is wrong with giving these youth players cameo roles in the matchday squad? 

The reality is that as we stand today there is no real pathway unless an absolute superstar comes along. Are we then wasting £5mil each year? So what is the new version of 'The Derby Way'? What is the ethos of the club now? 

[archied]

Watched the forum now and I don’t see the problem ,, pretty honest and open ,I didn’t see the view by some that Mel and rowett were looking for excuses ,,, excuses for what? Not spending massively? Not feeling that at this point that there’s players in the under 23s that are ready for a championship promotion chasing team? For having a run of not winning enough games to stay in second place? 

Its football ,there are no guarantees, why are so many fans trying to nail owner and manager to a cross when it’s clear they are trying to do the best for the club and not doing too bad a job all things considered 

[Angry Ram]

Also why does Morris just seem to think our only revenue stream is gate receipts? He is very good at doing this, picking one thing and making it all encompassing.

What the hell was he on about with extra points for FFP?? So now you win or lose in the boardroom.

[Mistaram]

11 hours ago, RoyMac5 said:

Maybe not game in game out, nor perhaps even 90 minutes. But some of them have played against other Prem U23 teams with over age players in and have played well. Didn't the Arsenal team have Wilshere in iwrong t? I think there's nothing like giving them a go to see whether they're ready...

Yes Wiltshire did play but most of the Derby team then are out on loan  Nothing wrong with giving them a go if your not worried about losing but until were out of playoff race that would be suicidal  We only had to put a couple in for the League cup and fans were on here saying we don't pay good money to watch kids 

[Seaside Sam]

12 hours ago, RamNut said:

Where's the common sense?

to accuse someone who never boos, never slags them off on social media etc etc as being part of the problem? 

yawn

[RamNut]

9 minutes ago, Seaside Sam said:

yawn

Gosh. You are so interesting. Absolutely riveting. You've always got something fascinating to say. 

[DRBee]

45 minutes ago, Angry Ram said:

Okay, watched the bit about the academy.. So in essence what they are saying is the academy is not producing as they would have hoped. £5mil per annum they are investing but unless we are midtable, they won't really get a chance. Mel gets all pompus asking how many we want in the team and he is inferring it's 4 or 5 youth in there as starters. How much slack would we cut them !! FFS the geezer is all over the place. Typical push it back with an extreame. Gary is so wrapped up with what others do.. Burnley, Hull, Brighton..  He won't change unless his hand is forced, a bit like Saturday. What exactly is wrong with giving these youth players cameo roles in the matchday squad? 

The reality is that as we stand today there is no real pathway unless an absolute superstar comes along. Are we then wasting £5mil each year? So what is the new version of 'The Derby Way'? What is the ethos of the club now? 

The 'Derby Way ' argument used by Mel was always tosh . It can mean whatever a user of the term wants it to mean and as a response to difficult questions.

The academies of  the better clubs are always going to get the best home grown talent and our academy faces a difficult challenge. The disappointing thing about our !st team recruitment under Mel is the narrow pool from which we seem to get players. Even under the hard pressed Nigel Clough years we did try the occasional foreign player. True we have Vydra, but he came from another English team and was relatively expensive. How depressing that aged has been Jerome is the pinnacle of our permanent acquisitions in the recent transfer window.

[Seaside Sam]

15 minutes ago, RamNut said:

Gosh. You are so interesting. Absolutely riveting. You've always got something fascinating to say. 

yawn.

,yawn

[RamNut]

2 minutes ago, Seaside Sam said:

yawn.

,yawn

....and predictable 

 

[Seaside Sam]

4 minutes ago, RamNut said:

....and predictable 

 

yawn only worth one this time ,bet you didn,t predict that

[Angry Ram]

1 hour ago, DRBee said:

The 'Derby Way ' argument used by Mel was always tosh . It can mean whatever a user of the term wants it to mean and as a response to difficult questions.

The academies of  the better clubs are always going to get the best home grown talent and our academy faces a difficult challenge. The disappointing thing about our !st team recruitment under Mel is the narrow pool from which we seem to get players. Even under the hard pressed Nigel Clough years we did try the occasional foreign player. True we have Vydra, but he came from another English team and was relatively expensive. How depressing that aged has been Jerome is the pinnacle of our permanent acquisitions in the recent transfer window.

The academy is a dead duck, it's just a matter of when the whole thing changes. Not Derby's fault and I understand what they are saying and the pathway difficulties. The nievety of football in general is staggering on this front and Morris is wasting a large portion of his £5mil a year. Okay we have sent players out on loan but to lower league teams.. How long before the next stock excuse comes out that they are not tried and tested at this level, so we can't risk them on a promotion push. Right now if I was a young lad and I had offers from Derby and say Forest and you had no allegiance to either club.. Who would you pick? How do we attract lads to come.. Not when they are really young (that's another waste of time) but when they are 18 upwards. Clubs like us will always be shopping in Aldi.

I have more sympathy on the recruitment front, it is not easy for them or any club for that matter. The players have the power and agents will play one off against the other. I am still confused to actually what their basic plan is though.. We've gone from potential to experience and now probably back to potential again if we don't go up.

Personally I have lost track of the clubs identity now. 

Don't get me started on the 'Derby Way'. 

[EnigmaRam]

42 minutes ago, Angry Ram said:

The academy is a dead duck, it's just a matter of when the whole thing changes. Not Derby's fault and I understand what they are saying and the pathway difficulties. The nievety of football in general is staggering on this front and Morris is wasting a large portion of his £5mil a year. Okay we have sent players out on loan but to lower league teams.. How long before the next stock excuse comes out that they are not tried and tested at this level, so we can't risk them on a promotion push. Right now if I was a young lad and I had offers from Derby and say Forest and you had no allegiance to either club.. Who would you pick? How do we attract lads to come.. Not when they are really young (that's another waste of time) but when they are 18 upwards. Clubs like us will always be shopping in Aldi.

I have more sympathy on the recruitment front, it is not easy for them or any club for that matter. The players have the power and agents will play one off against the other. I am still confused to actually what their basic plan is though.. We've gone from potential to experience and now probably back to potential again if we don't go up.

Personally I have lost track of the clubs identity now. 

Don't get me started on the 'Derby Way'. 

I agree with this. The academy will never be self funding or sustainable if the players don't get put into the first team to sell to make a profit to re invest.nobody will buy them for £10-£15 mil if they have never played in at least a championship team for a sustained period of time.

if all we do is release them, let them go on a free or never play them it's all a bit of a waste of time and money. Currently we are developing players for other teams to benefit from after we've not bothered to play them.

just my opinion of course

[Boycie]

So we can develop players and sell them on to lower leagues maybe, with sell on clauses which financially benefits the club.

Is this not a sucesss in its own right?

[Angry Ram]

1 hour ago, Boycie said:

So we can develop players and sell them on to lower leagues maybe, with sell on clauses which financially benefits the club.

Is this not a sucesss in its own right?

That's a by product of any academy but surely success for the club must be to produce players for DCFC? If an academy is your preferred option for spending money. We could save ourselves 5 mill and be that lower league club and get a Man City cast off. Let them do the work.

Maybe bigger questions would be asked if we sold a lad to Wycombe who then was sold to Chelsea.. 

[Boycie]

2 hours ago, Angry Ram said:

That's a by product of any academy but surely success for the club must be to produce players for DCFC? If an academy is your preferred option for spending money. We could save ourselves 5 mill and be that lower league club and get a Man City cast off. Let them do the work.

Maybe bigger questions would be asked if we sold a lad to Wycombe who then was sold to Chelsea.. 

Come on mate, close yer eyes, take a deep breath and think positive thoughts ?

i think we need to get you, @RamNut and @RoyMac5 kidnapped and bundled in to the next fans forum so they can put all your concerns direct to the owner and his money men.

Then you can get it all off your chests.

[t'oldu]

Chelsea don't use their young players either!!!   Just buy them in then loan them out.

[Angry Ram]

1 hour ago, Boycie said:

Come on mate, close yer eyes, take a deep breath and think positive thoughts ?

i think we need to get you, @RamNut and @RoyMac5 kidnapped and bundled in to the next fans forum so they can put all your concerns direct to the owner and his money men.

Then you can get it all off your chests.

The Three Wise Men... Better be the Christmas session.. They had better also give us more than a few hours notice..