Mossack Fonseca

[LesterRam]

Wouldn't it be nice to have a flat rate of income tax, a standard rate of corporation tax and a workable living wage, forget about working tax credits, tax credits and a life of benefits, if you are found to avoid any tax you lose everything, ahhh utopia.

Don't understand how Mr Cameron can continue in his role, its not like he has been a success, no great data coming from official sources and even less via genuine sources.

[Mafiabob]

4 hours ago, LesterRam said:

Wouldn't it be nice to have a flat rate of income tax, a standard rate of corporation tax and a workable living wage, forget about working tax credits, tax credits and a life of benefits, if you are found to avoid any tax you lose everything, ahhh utopia.

Don't understand how Mr Cameron can continue in his role, its not like he has been a success, no great data coming from official sources and even less via genuine sources.

Wish life was that simple 

[Ramarena]

A third off-shore fund has been found, more questions for Cameron.

[1of4]

On 08/04/2016 at 12:28, jono said:

It isn't that Stive. I want any wide boy well and truely nailed. My gripe is that so many on the left assume that if you are wealthy and educated privately then you must be a cheat, a con man or a bully. The truth is that sharp practice crosses class and education boundaries from top to bottom. ... You will have gathered that I am not left wing but that is primarily down to realising that sums have to add up not because I lack integrity, compassion or common decency. It's my experience that both sides have their cow boys, bullies cheats and power hungry manipulators. It is something that a proportion of the left just refuses to acknowledge. The right on the other hand keep quiet about their bad crew because they know they have them and so do we. Plenty of folk including me rage about the criminal misbehaviour in the banking sector they are soft targets .. Everyone hates them. But Jack Straw got off pretty lightly with his paid for lobbying didn't he ? The left want to tell me what to do and how to run my life and will be very happy to pass laws to limit ordinary everyday behaviour. The right tend to leave me alone as long as they can line their pockets. I am much more frightened by potential lords and masters on the left than I am of a few greedy politicos lining their pockets. 

So you are happy with greedy politicos Hope you are still happy when you need the NHS but can`t afford it because it`s been privatized by greedy politicos

[i-Ram]

1 hour ago, 1of4 said:

So you are happy with greedy politicos Hope you are still happy when you need the NHS but can`t afford it because it`s been privatized by greedy politicos

I do hope the other 3 are a bit brighter than you appear.

[Posh Ram]

I'm not a Cameron apologist, only sort of Tory even if the username might imply otherwise. 

That being said, he's not broken the law - I can't see it as grounds for a challenge to his leadership. And I hope he doesn't get voted out, the alternatives are so much worse.

[jono]

2 hours ago, 1of4 said:

So you are happy with greedy politicos Hope you are still happy when you need the NHS but can`t afford it because it`s been privatized by greedy politicos

I wouldn't be happy with a one party state where there isn't a functioning 21st century health service for anyone other than the party elite and we were all told by our illustrious leader that it was time to eat the root of the grass. 

You need to expand your reference sources, improve your comprehension, develop some realistic analysis of how things work in the real world rather than using a purile, jealousy based didactic that hides behind a faux claim of social justice. 

oh yes and read what people write taking in To consideration, context, nuance and balance. 

[GboroRam]

1 hour ago, Posh Ram said:

That being said, he's not broken the law

Let me be in charge of setting the rules and then examine my tax returns. I think you'll find, despite the incredibly low tax I'd pay, I wouldn't have broken any rules.

[LesterRam]

1 hour ago, Posh Ram said:

I'm not a Cameron apologist, only sort of Tory even if the username might imply otherwise. 

That being said, he's not broken the law - I can't see it as grounds for a challenge to his leadership. And I hope he doesn't get voted out, the alternatives are so much worse.

The problem I have is he insisted on making a point about jimmy Carr and his offshore account knowing he had funds stashed abroad.

[Posh Ram]

8 minutes ago, LesterRam said:

The problem I have is he insisted on making a point about jimmy Carr and his offshore account knowing he had funds stashed abroad.

Oh yeah, incredibly hypocritical I agree. But we already knew he was a tw*t, I just disagree that he's a criminal or should have his position as PM put in jeopardy. Also, wasn't what Carr did illegal?

[jono]

9 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

Let me be in charge of setting the rules and then examine my tax returns. I think you'll find, despite the incredibly low tax I'd pay, I wouldn't have broken any rules.

Of course you are 100% right Gboro. History tends to be written by the victors. Although it should be said that one of the foundations of democracy is that parliament and the judiciary are separate entities and it is what lifts us above the one party state / oligarch systems of government. Flawed though it is .. It is a hell of a lot fairer than any other system so far invented.

let the far left run the country and they would simply replace one elite with another and remove a lot of our personal freedoms at the same time. What I find so startling in this thread is that the "lets get him voices" seem totally incapable of accepting that ALL powerful people bend rules to their benefit. There is naivity that assumes "their team" are completely honest fair and reasonable just because they say they are. We need to scrutinise all our leaders and have strong well written anti corruption and tax law. You can't moan when humans take advantage of badly drafted law. We should be complaining to parliament for having leaky law, not at those who exploit it. If a striker gets a pen because there was "contact" who's to blame him .. It's not nice, not pretty but players from Deby and Forest are equally guilty 

[Posh Ram]

20 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

Let me be in charge of setting the rules and then examine my tax returns. I think you'll find, despite the incredibly low tax I'd pay, I wouldn't have broken any rules.

It's shady and concerning and, in my opinion, immoral. He deserves criticism, but I hope it doesn't come to anything more than that. The alternatives within the Tory party - perhaps with the exception of Sajid Javid, who won't be a serious candidate - are a lot lot worse.

[Ramarena]

1 hour ago, Posh Ram said:

I'm not a Cameron apologist, only sort of Tory even if the username might imply otherwise. 

That being said, he's not broken the law - I can't see it as grounds for a challenge to his leadership. And I hope he doesn't get voted out, the alternatives are so much worse.

Kind of missing the point. Here we have a PM who actively lobbied Van Rompuy, to prevent the E.U cracking down on tax havens. 

Sadly this story, which is the most important, has been lost in the noise of the did he, didn't he avoid tax.

I've linked the article from the Guardian as it's not behind a paywall, the oringial and better story was in the FT.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/apr/07/david-cameron-offshore-trusts-eu-tax-crackdown-2013

[1of4]

1 hour ago, i-Ram said:

I do hope the other 3 are a bit brighter than you appear.

They are but I`m bright enough to see this government is trying to destroy the NHS and our education system

[LesterRam]

1 minute ago, Posh Ram said:

Oh yeah, incredibly hypocritical I agree. But we already knew he was a tw*t, I just disagree that he's a criminal or should have his position as PM put in jeopardy. Also, wasn't what Carr did illegal?

I didn't vote for jimmy Carr, he has a moral duty whilst in office, what kind of message is he giving to other operations run in tax havens, it reflects badly on the nation.

[Posh Ram]

7 minutes ago, Ramarena said:

Kind of missing the point. Here we have a PM who actively lobbied Van Rompuy, to prevent the E.U cracking down on tax havens. 

Sadly this story, which is the most important, has been lost in the noise of the did he, didn't he avoid tax.

I've linked the article from the Guardian as it's not behind a paywall, the oringial and better story was in the FT.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/apr/07/david-cameron-offshore-trusts-eu-tax-crackdown-2013

He's not had an offshore trust though, he invested in a hedge fund. They're quite different. How different is what he's done to investing in an ISA or buying duty free abroad?

[Posh Ram]

6 minutes ago, LesterRam said:

I didn't vote for jimmy Carr, he has a moral duty whilst in office, what kind of message is he giving to other operations run in tax havens, it reflects badly on the nation.

Did you think calls for Bill Clinton's impeachment were justified? To me they seemed ridiculous. How different is this to that.

[Ramarena]

8 minutes ago, Posh Ram said:

He's not had an offshore trust though, he invested in a hedge fund. They're quite different. How different is what he's done to investing in an ISA or buying duty free abroad?

Quite different, tax avoidance is legal, but morally questionable.

Investing in an ISA, or buying duty free, is not morally questionable. In fact the ISA is a government initiative, to promote saving, if you're trying to say an ISA is morally questionable, then you need to be looking at the government- Tax avoidance is bending the rules of the tax system to gain a tax advantage that Parliament never intended. 

[Posh Ram]

19 minutes ago, Ramarena said:

Quite different, tax avoidance is legal, but morally questionable.

Investing in an ISA, or buying duty free, is not morally questionable. In fact the ISA is a government initiative, to promote saving, if you're trying to say an ISA is morally questionable, then you need to be looking at the government- Tax avoidance is bending the rules of the tax system to gain a tax advantage that Parliament never intended. 

'David Cameron has admitted that he and his wife, Samantha Cameron, had shares in his father's offshore wealth fund, Blairmore. The Camerons invested £12,497 in 1997, and sold the stake in January 2010 - four months before Cameron became Prime Minister -for £31,500.

As the profit fell below the capital gains tax threshold, they paid no tax following the sale, though Cameron insisted in an interview with ITV News that the shares' dividends were subject to British income tax.

The fund, Cameron said, "wasn’t a family trust. It wasn’t for the benefit of one particular family; anyone could have bought units in it. And crucially, if you were a UK citizen and bought units in it, then you paid income tax on the dividends."'

I'm not convinced that's even tax avoidance, he just owned shares in an overseas fund. The mother/inheritance tax thing she may well have intended as a gift. 

I understand why people dislike Cameron, he comes across as a condescending pr*ck quite clearly out of touch with the British people and just presided over one of the worst budgets ever. But this is really scraping the barrel for grounds to criticise. The only reason it's a big deal is because the right-wing media have finally turned against him

[LesterRam]

I would like questions to be raised on the point of spending £9m of taxpayers money on the "in campaign", so in our beloved democracy the " out campaign" has to fund its own advertising, shouldn't this be deemed a dictatorship.