The Derby Way

[Gary Teale]

Clement is gone, get over it, as a team we were no better than last season after spending a load of money. The football the last 2 months (since Bristol City) was dreadful. 

Lets get behind the team and Cheer the lads on hopefully to promotion.

[rynny]

I am of seeing people moaning that MM wants us to play attacking football that is easy on the eye, and get promoted, not because we are efficient percentage teams but because we are actually good at playing fast attacking football. All because he has labelled it 'The Derby Way'.

Fed up of seeing people say MM doesn't want us to get promoted this season, doesn't matter if we lose 5-4, 8-7, 18-17 etc cos we have played attacking football, don't want to get a manager that is too ambitious and might get us promoted this season.

It is getting ridiculous now, if you don't understand what MM wants, that is fine, just say that instead of saying things like the above because, to me, you look like childish.

Also fed up of people writing Wass off and our season off, again ridiculous, there is no way we know how he is going to perform and how he is going to get the team to perform. It is the same as people writing off/hyping up players when they have just signed. Let's see how they perform for us before going all off in a huff.

Sorry for going on a mini rant here, just can't be bothered to pick out every single person as there seems to be too many. 

[EssendonRam]

49 minutes ago, rynny said:

I am of seeing people moaning that MM wants us to play attacking football that is easy on the eye, and get promoted, not because we are efficient percentage teams but because we are actually good at playing fast attacking football. All because he has labelled it 'The Derby Way'.

Fed up of seeing people say MM doesn't want us to get promoted this season, doesn't matter if we lose 5-4, 8-7, 18-17 etc cos we have played attacking football, don't want to get a manager that is too ambitious and might get us promoted this season.

It is getting ridiculous now, if you don't understand what MM wants, that is fine, just say that instead of saying things like the above because, to me, you look like childish.

Also fed up of people writing Wass off and our season off, again ridiculous, there is no way we know how he is going to perform and how he is going to get the team to perform. It is the same as people writing off/hyping up players when they have just signed. Let's see how they perform for us before going all off in a huff.

Sorry for going on a mini rant here, just can't be bothered to pick out every single person as there seems to be too many. 

I'll put my hand up. I don't understand what Mel wants...and I have genuinely tried to..honestly.

 

It doesn't help that, as far as I can tell, his own statements don't sit well together. For instance, PC played the young guys too sparingly. I agree. And that is consistent with the prominence Mel and the Board have given to the Academy.

 

But...it's inconsistent with our squad strategy this season. We have bought established talent from outside (ie not even kids for the most part). As for Mel saying promotion is not the primary aim this season, I actually understand where he is coming from there. But that suggests to me that the recent run of poor results weren't a factor...all of which would suggest leve the Head Coach And the Academy Director  in place until the end of the season.

 

So.in my case at least, I'd appreciate it if you can help me understand.

[rammieib]

1 hour ago, rynny said:

I am of seeing people moaning that MM wants us to play attacking football that is easy on the eye, and get promoted, not because we are efficient percentage teams but because we are actually good at playing fast attacking football. All because he has labelled it 'The Derby Way'.

Fed up of seeing people say MM doesn't want us to get promoted this season, doesn't matter if we lose 5-4, 8-7, 18-17 etc cos we have played attacking football, don't want to get a manager that is too ambitious and might get us promoted this season.

It is getting ridiculous now, if you don't understand what MM wants, that is fine, just say that instead of saying things like the above because, to me, you look like childish.

Also fed up of people writing Wass off and our season off, again ridiculous, there is no way we know how he is going to perform and how he is going to get the team to perform. It is the same as people writing off/hyping up players when they have just signed. Let's see how they perform for us before going all off in a huff.

Sorry for going on a mini rant here, just can't be bothered to pick out every single person as there seems to be too many. 

Sorry Rynny I disagree with you.

Morris has come out and justified his sacking by using a phrase which has no definition. In doing so, for me, he has made us a laughing stock. (That's a fact, read the national press this week). I'd have respected his justification more if he had referred to the football quality. I'd respect him more for saying that he wants a style of football which is more attacking but no, he refers to it with a meaning which has no meaning.

I also fail to see how any club can progress by changing the mangers. He has been the boss now for six months, and we are on our third manager/head coach. I assume we'll be on a fourth by the summer. That's a record which puts him in company with Celino.

[Rev]

I completely understand the Derby way, and Mel has been completely consistent with his words on the matter, right from the very start.

His actions however, sanctioning the spends are somewhat of a contradiction, however I believe him when he said he operates a no-excuses policy, therefore he spunked the cash.

It's easily overlooked that Mel himself is inexperienced as a football club owner, and therefore went along with whatever Clement wanted. 

In which case, the blame lies at Clements door, he could have asked for Messi, Saurez and Neymar, but instead got Blackman, Camara and Olsson!

 

[rammieib]

15 minutes ago, reveldevil said:

I completely understand the Derby way, and Mel has been completely consistent with his words on the matter, right from the very start.

His actions however, sanctioning the spends are somewhat of a contradiction, however I believe him when he said he operates a no-excuses policy, therefore he spunked the cash.

It's easily overlooked that Mel himself is inexperienced as a football club owner, and therefore went along with whatever Clement wanted. 

In which case, the blame lies at Clements door, he could have asked for Messi, Saurez and Neymar, but instead got Blackman, Camara and Olsson!

 

Paras 2, 3 and 4 get a like.

[rynny]

34 minutes ago, RamDon said:

I'll put my hand up. I don't understand what Mel wants...and I have genuinely tried to..honestly.

 

It doesn't help that, as far as I can tell, his own statements don't sit well together. For instance, PC played the young guys too sparingly. I agree. And that is consistent with the prominence Mel and the Board have given to the Academy.

 

But...it's inconsistent with our squad strategy this season. We have bought established talent from outside (ie not even kids for the most part). As for Mel saying promotion is not the primary aim this season, I actually understand where he is coming from there. But that suggests to me that the recent run of poor results weren't a factor...all of which would suggest leve the Head Coach And the Academy Director  in place until the end of the season.

 

So.in my case at least, I'd appreciate it if you can help me understand.

In a way you are right, but he was trying to fully support PC, he trusted him with the football matters, and to an extent let PC buy who he thought would help us achieve better attacking football (playing the Derby Way ) The Derby Way is what he referred to in the summer, consistently, he wants to do things our way. He has his vision of playing fast productive attacking football, with a team that has a sprinkling of Derby lads in the team.

I guess the reason he has changed it now is a damage limitation for the players and the fans. Wass in charge to get us to how we were playing in the 13/14 season and just get everyone connected to the club to enjoy the rest of the campaign and get rid of the chore feeling about this season.

26 minutes ago, rammieib said:

Sorry Rynny I disagree with you.

Morris has come out and justified his sacking by using a phrase which has no definition. In doing so, for me, he has made us a laughing stock. (That's a fact, read the national press this week). I'd have respected his justification more if he had referred to the football quality. I'd respect him more for saying that he wants a style of football which is more attacking but no, he refers to it with a meaning which has no meaning.

I also fail to see how any club can progress by changing the mangers. He has been the boss now for six months, and we are on our third manager/head coach. I assume we'll be on a fourth by the summer. That's a record which puts him in company with Celino.

See these are the type of posts I have no problem with, the reasoned ones. I have seen very few posters do this rammie, and they are the ones I was referring to.

I totally understand what you are saying. The thing with MM interview on why PC went was for us, the fans, not the national press, when he was talking about 'The Derby Way' in the summer it was to us and the national press didn't take too much interest of it and neither did opposition fans but now they are paying attention to it they do not understand so think it is funny. Look how many were outraged when we got rid of Nigel, look how many were calling us after that, then the following 'interview' with Sam Rush on the decision. We were absolutely destroyed in the press by every national journo. I think we should wait and see before we criticise.

Think it is harsh to say we will be on our 4th manager under MM in the summer (assuming DW does not keep the job full time) as SM was sacked before MM had taken over and GSE were still in charge. 

[RamNut]

4 minutes ago, rynny said:

SM was sacked before MM had taken over and GSE were still in charge. 

Come on mate. 

Schteve was sacked by mel and no-one else.

[Rev]

4 minutes ago, RamNut said:

Come on mate. 

Schteve was sacked by mel and no-one else.

He told us face to face, he got rid because he believed Mac wanted to stay through loyalty, and a desire to put things right, rather than his heart being truly in it.

[rammieib]

6 minutes ago, rynny said:

In a way you are right, but he was trying to fully support PC, he trusted him with the football matters, and to an extent let PC buy who he thought would help us achieve better attacking football (playing the Derby Way ) The Derby Way is what he referred to in the summer, consistently, he wants to do things our way. He has his vision of playing fast productive attacking football, with a team that has a sprinkling of Derby lads in the team.

I guess the reason he has changed it now is a damage limitation for the players and the fans. Wass in charge to get us to how we were playing in the 13/14 season and just get everyone connected to the club to enjoy the rest of the campaign and get rid of the chore feeling about this season.

See these are the type of posts I have no problem with, the reasoned ones. I have seen very few posters do this rammie, and they are the ones I was referring to.

I totally understand what you are saying. The thing with MM interview on why PC went was for us, the fans, not the national press, when he was talking about 'The Derby Way' in the summer it was to us and the national press didn't take too much interest of it and neither did opposition fans but now they are paying attention to it they do not understand so think it is funny. Look how many were outraged when we got rid of Nigel, look how many were calling us after that, then the following 'interview' with Sam Rush on the decision. We were absolutely destroyed in the press by every national journo. I think we should wait and see before we criticise.

Think it is harsh to say we will be on our 4th manager under MM in the summer (assuming DW does not keep the job full time) as SM was sacked before MM had taken over and GSE were still in charge. 

Good post. My memory seems to think Mac went after the take over but I'm happy to be wrong. I'm sure though MM was calling the shots behind the scenes though when Mac went.

I agree that MM used that phrase early on and in the forums alluded to it. I just dislike a phrase which isn't even clear to the majority of Derby fans on what it means. He talked about a style of football, then referred to the past two seasons. I think he has tried to then create the definition as being the two seasons under the Mac (although the football was shocking for 3 months at the end). I just wish he hadn't coined a phrase to it. We don't have a football culture, I'd say very few teams have a football culture. Maybe Liverpool, Arsenal and Man Utd do but that's because of either significant success or long term managers in place playing a brand of football. We've not had a luxury of that and thus I don't think we have a right to coin the phrase that Mel has done.

[rynny]

11 minutes ago, RamNut said:

Come on mate. 

Schteve was sacked by mel and no-one else.

I was talking technically, maybe should have gone the inherited him as head coach and wasn't his choice...

 

 

 

[rynny]

5 minutes ago, rammieib said:

Good post. My memory seems to think Mac went after the take over but I'm happy to be wrong. I'm sure though MM was calling the shots behind the scenes though when Mac went.

I agree that MM used that phrase early on and in the forums alluded to it. I just dislike a phrase which isn't even clear to the majority of Derby fans on what it means. He talked about a style of football, then referred to the past two seasons. I think he has tried to then create the definition as being the two seasons under the Mac (although the football was shocking for 3 months at the end). I just wish he hadn't coined a phrase to it. We don't have a football culture, I'd say very few teams have a football culture. Maybe Liverpool, Arsenal and Man Utd do but that's because of either significant success or long term managers in place playing a brand of football. We've not had a luxury of that and thus I don't think we have a right to coin the phrase that Mel has done.

You are right about Mel calling the shots in deciding that Steve would be sacked as @reveldevil and @RamNut have pointed out.

I think he is wanting to build it from the start and create it straight from the off. From all I have seen and heard from Mel is that he is trying to build something here that will out last him, you and me and be apart of this club for as long as possible. There are quite a few teams who get labelled with terms that either are from within or from the media, just think of the crazy gang at Wimbledon, Stoke recently and their route 1 bullying football (were they the same team? ) Chelsea and their bus, Boring Arsenal and their 1-0's, Arsenal and their invincible's. I guess if MM didn't say the Derby Way the press would have labelled us the bottlers so tried to get in with something before they did 

[rammieib]

5 minutes ago, rynny said:

You are right about Mel calling the shots in deciding that Steve would be sacked as @reveldevil and @RamNut have pointed out.

I think he is wanting to build it from the start and create it straight from the off. From all I have seen and heard from Mel is that he is trying to build something here that will out last him, you and me and be apart of this club for as long as possible. There are quite a few teams who get labelled with terms that either are from within or from the media, just think of the crazy gang at Wimbledon, Stoke recently and their route 1 bullying football (were they the same team? ) Chelsea and their bus, Boring Arsenal and their 1-0's, Arsenal and their invincible's. I guess if MM didn't say the Derby Way the press would have labelled us the bottlers so tried to get in with something before they did 

He probably does want to build something, but then it comes back to the fact I think it was rash to sack a manager 33 games in who was 5th in the league. I respect opinions will differ on this though and we have more than enough threads for a conversation on that topic.

[rynny]

4 minutes ago, rammieib said:

He probably does want to build something, but then it comes back to the fact I think it was rash to sack a manager 33 games in who was 5th in the league. I respect opinions will differ on this though and we have more than enough threads for a conversation on that topic.

The only I answer I can give on that is we will soon see. I still can't decide whether the sacking was fair or not.

[EssendonRam]

I hear you Rynny...and it's absolutely fair to say I really want you to be right.

 

Just two minor quibbles then a round of applause: I too have concluded that, rightly or wrongly, Mel's judged that Clement remaining in place would cause damage. That's the only rational conclusion when you think about the potential disruption to the Academy, the squad, etc. I just wish I had an idea what the risk was (I am not alluding to the rumours either; I dismiss such gossip) although (working in risk myself) fully understand that's unfeasible and unimportant. That it's the second mysterious departure of a head coach within 10 months following a precipitous drop in performance is concerning. One more and we have a pattern as they say.

 

On those lines, while you're technically correct that McClaren was dismissed before Mel took sole ownership, you'd have to acknowledge that Mel was the driving force behind it. Certainly that was the view expressed by Brett Wilson and others, including McClaren. I vaguely recall Mel himself may have acknowledged that albeit whilst emphasising it was a unanimous decision.

 

Now the commendation: you've hit the nail on the head re the "Derby Way". Although it was unwise to use it in the context he used it, Mel has consistently referred to the Derby Way as the driving force behind his ambition for the club.

 

And, even though it means slightly different things on the periphery to different fans, most Derby fans could readily offer 5-10 things the phrase means to them. Its nebulous meaning is actually a strength when not used in an inappropriate circumstance.

 

(My definition, given my age - 49 - and my interest in history, plus being a long-distance lover of the club, centres on Brian Clough and the passion and commitment of the town of Derby. Clough's phrase "Derby is a footballing town"; the explanation  why matches between neighbouring teams are called 'derbies'; and my grandfather's passion for DCFC all feature in my definition, as well as the way Clough's teams played the beautiful game...and why McClaren's teams reminded us so heavily of that.)

 

But I digress....

 

So, a good call on standing up for the Derby Way. It's not easy standing against the tide like that...even in a Derby fan forum. 

 

In your own way, you displayed the Derby Way. It may not always be the cushiest ride; it certainly gives us some low points.

 

But we understand there are more important things sometimes than always succeeding. Someone has to hold the spirit of the game.

 

(No...I haven't been drinking!)

[eddie]

16 minutes ago, rynny said:

The only I answer I can give on that is we will soon see. I still can't decide whether the sacking was fair or not.

I can't say I'm that bothered any more.

[EssendonRam]

19 minutes ago, rynny said:

The only I answer I can give on that is we will soon see. I still can't decide whether the sacking was fair or not.

That we will. The only thing I have worked out over the years is not to rush to judgement, nor waste energy jumping up and down about it because (a) the decision has been taken and the club simply has to pull together on it; and (b) my initial emotional reaction is usually wrong. I thought Nigel got a raw deal...until McClaren was announced. I thought we should have tried to keep McClaren but kept thinking during the Boro game that we would've been 3 or 4 down after 20 minutes if Mac was still here.

[rynny]

28 minutes ago, eddie said:

I can't say I'm that bothered any more.

 

19 minutes ago, RamDon said:

That we will. The only thing I have worked out over the years is not to rush to judgement, nor waste energy jumping up and down about it because (a) the decision has been taken and the club simply has to pull together on it; and (b) my initial emotional reaction is usually wrong. I thought Nigel got a raw deal...until McClaren was announced. I thought we should have tried to keep McClaren but kept thinking during the Boro game that we would've been 3 or 4 down after 20 minutes if Mac was still here.

There will be people going tomorrow that will be going because PC is no longer in charge (not many, maybe 3-4), there will be more people going that wouldbe going regardless of who is in charge but I doubt there will be anyone not going because PC is not in charge. We all support Derby and all want us to go in the right direction, our opinions differ on how that should be but the ultimate goal is the same.

[rynny]

39 minutes ago, RamDon said:

I hear you Rynny...and it's absolutely fair to say I really want you to be right.

 

Just two minor quibbles then a round of applause: I too have concluded that, rightly or wrongly, Mel's judged that Clement remaining in place would cause damage. That's the only rational conclusion when you think about the potential disruption to the Academy, the squad, etc. I just wish I had an idea what the risk was (I am not alluding to the rumours either; I dismiss such gossip) although (working in risk myself) fully understand that's unfeasible and unimportant. That it's the second mysterious departure of a head coach within 10 months following a precipitous drop in performance is concerning. One more and we have a pattern as they say.

 

On those lines, while you're technically correct that McClaren was dismissed before Mel took sole ownership, you'd have to acknowledge that Mel was the driving force behind it. Certainly that was the view expressed by Brett Wilson and others, including McClaren. I vaguely recall Mel himself may have acknowledged that albeit whilst emphasising it was a unanimous decision.

 

Now the commendation: you've hit the nail on the head re the "Derby Way". Although it was unwise to use it in the context he used it, Mel has consistently referred to the Derby Way as the driving force behind his ambition for the club.

 

And, even though it means slightly different things on the periphery to different fans, most Derby fans could readily offer 5-10 things the phrase means to them. Its nebulous meaning is actually a strength when not used in an inappropriate circumstance.

 

(My definition, given my age - 49 - and my interest in history, plus being a long-distance lover of the club, centres on Brian Clough and the passion and commitment of the town of Derby. Clough's phrase "Derby is a footballing town"; the explanation  why matches between neighbouring teams are called 'derbies'; and my grandfather's passion for DCFC all feature in my definition, as well as the way Clough's teams played the beautiful game...and why McClaren's teams reminded us so heavily of that.)

 

But I digress....

 

So, a good call on standing up for the Derby Way. It's not easy standing against the tide like that...even in a Derby fan forum. 

 

In your own way, you displayed the Derby Way. It may not always be the cushiest ride; it certainly gives us some low points.

 

But we understand there are more important things sometimes than always succeeding. Someone has to hold the spirit of the game.

 

(No...I haven't been drinking!)

Good post Don, the only thing I will point out is that I did correct the sacking of SM, after a gentle reminder that MM did make the decision.

[EssendonRam]

To have Derby doing what Fester are doing...and then some!