That Centre-Back Solution

[Nuwtfly]

I am utterly astounded that people can advocate starting Albentosa with a straight face. Obviously he hasn't had time to prove himself, but he has to earn his position like anyone else. I always ask the same question to Albentosa ideologues and am yet to receive a satisfactory response, what have you seen from him to justify starting him ahead of Buxton and Keogh?

From what I saw last season;

- His passing is very poor. Certainly worse than Buxton's.

- He does not demonstrate the same level of confidence as Keogh and Buxton.

- He is very slow, at least as slow as Buxton.

- He's decent in the air. Better than Keogh, possibly better than Buxton.

I hope that you're all right and the iffy start to his Derby career can be put down to the team being in free fall and him adjusting to a new league and culture, but how can you possibly justify putting him ahead of our established centre backs based on what we've seen so far?

You're basing your entire view of this player on his introduction to a crumbling defence in a team on the slide. 

That's incredibly short-sighted.

[cannable]

There were so many factors counting against Albentosa last season, that it's not fair to judge him based on such a small sample of games. He was so highly rated in La Liga that he could be a real asset for us and I feel he has the potential to be a key player for us if he can replicate his form he showed at Eibar.

But the form he displayed at Eibar was in a team that was well organised and defended deep. He's being asked to do different things here. It's no coincidence that his best game for us was against Nowrich away, when they pinned us back. Like all players, he's good in the right system and it's not the system we play. 

 

 

[Sexydadbod]

It depends what formation we play. We could play 3 at the back for all we know. The reason why I think this is because it's 1 of only a couple of formations that can have 2 strikers up front and more than 2 centre backs. Also it is clear that Clement is a fan of 3 at the back because I remember seeing him on twitter in his Real Madrid days reply to a coach and recommend 3 at the back. Weimann also said that he wanted to play up front as a striker so that's another reason to believe that we are going to play a 2 up front formation.

In that case Keogh Albentosa Shackell as my back 3

[Anon]

You're basing your entire view of this player on his introduction to a crumbling defence in a team on the slide. 

That's incredibly short-sighted.

You are the one advocating for change. The onus is on you to tell me what he has shown to justify a starting position.

At the moment all I have to go on is your hunch that he will come good.

[Sexydadbod]

Someone showed some stats on here a couple of days ago and it showed that Albentosa was better in almost all defensive departments than the rest of our defenders despite not speaking the language and playing in his unfavoured position. People like to criticize him because he is foreign so an easy target

[t'oldu]

Keogh has had a very difficult  time with so much changing around him and so many different players to talk through the game as well as doing his own job and that of captain.    He was an excellent RB .. A lot of the defensive problems were down to SM changing the wide MF and still expecting the backs to run the wing with no defensive support . He broke up partnerships that worked .  He also left the team playing a system that wasn't working. Eventually he destroyed all confidence and the players gave up.   And who can blame them .Next season will be a breath of fresh air  -    for many reasons. 

[YorkshireRam]

But the form he displayed at Eibar was in a team that was well organised and defended deep. He's being asked to do different things here. It's no coincidence that his best game for us was against Nowrich away, when they pinned us back. Like all players, he's good in the right system and it's not the system we play. 

 

 

That's a good point and one I've not considered admittedly.

I'd argue that a professional footballer should be versatile within his position though and with the right coaching, Albentosa could adapt to fit our style of play?

[TheDeadlySaul]

It depends what formation we play. We could play 3 at the back for all we know. The reason why I think this is because it's 1 of only a couple of formations that can have 2 strikers up front and more than 2 centre backs. Also it is clear that Clement is a fan of 3 at the back because I remember seeing him on twitter in his Real Madrid days reply to a coach and recommend 3 at the back. Weimann also said that he wanted to play up front as a striker so that's another reason to believe that we are going to play a 2 up front formation.

In that case Keogh Albentosa Shackell as my back 3

I don't think playing 3 at the back would work for us, we would rely heavily on our full backs who aren't the best and where would it leave players like Ince (if we sign him) and Russell. I'm pretty sure we are gearing up to be playing a 4-2-3-1 with the arrivals of the CDMs in Baird and potentially Bridcutt.

[YorkshireRam]

You are the one advocating for change. The onus is on you to tell me what he has shown to justify a starting position.

What has Keogh done to keep his starting place is possibly a more poignant question?

Our defence was so poor at the end of last season that no-one's starting spot is safe. Everything is up for grabs, especially with a new coach, which means Albentosa has as much of a chance as Keogh of earning himself a starting spot...

Nuwtfly doesn't have to justify anything!

[Nuwtfly]

You are the one advocating for change. The onus is on you to tell me what he has shown to justify a starting position.

At the moment all I have to go on is your hunch that he will come good.

I'm basing my opinion on the form he showed for Eibar and what he achieved as a key part of that defence. This is a team that plays in a ground a quarter of the size of Plymouth Argyle who were sitting fairly comfortably in mid-table of the La Liga before he left.

I respect your opinion, but Albentosa is a better player than I think you're giving him credit for. He proved that in Spain. 

[Anon]

I'm basing my opinion on the form he showed for Eibar and what he achieved as a key part of that defence. This is a team that plays in a ground a quarter of the size of Plymouth Argyle who were sitting fairly comfortably in mid-table of the La Liga before he left.

I respect your opinion, but Albentosa is a better player than I think you're giving him credit for. He proved that in Spain. 

The biggest positive, for Derby at least, is the way Eibar crashed and burned without him. I'm really not sure 17 games in La Liga proves too much though. As I said on a previous thread, we're talking about a 26 year old who has played 58 games above the Spanish third tier in his entire career.

[YorkshireRam]

The biggest positive, for Derby at least, is the way Eibar crashed and burned without him. I'm really not sure 17 games in La Liga proves too much though. As I said on a previous thread, we're talking about a 26 year old who has played 58 games above the Spanish third tier in his entire career.

Yet you're writing him off after less than that at Derby...

Albentosa hasn't been given a fair crack yet. If he under-performs again this season then by all means criticise away but he hasn't had a consistent run of games (when the rest of the team is at its best) to prove himself.

[SSC]

Buxton and Keogh for me. Proven pairing, work well together.

The others can come in and challenge but I'd start with them.

[TheDeadlySaul]

The biggest positive, for Derby at least, is the way Eibar crashed and burned without him. I'm really not sure 17 games in La Liga proves too much though. As I said on a previous thread, we're talking about a 26 year old who has played 58 games above the Spanish third tier in his entire career.

If you at Eibars defensive record when Raul left it barely changed, here is a quote from an Eibar fan about what affect his departure had:

Eibar have missed him less than i thought they would. As a team eibar conceded 25 goals in the first half of the season with albentosa and 30 in the second half without him. However there were a lot of very close one goal games where eibar lost that they couldve gotten a point had albentosa stayed.

[Idiakez]

You could put Thiago Silva alongside Christie and even he'd struggle after being left 2 on 1 time and time again. Keogh had to play CB and cover RB at times last season when both Christie and Shotton had forgotten how to play football. Notice how nobody targeted Keogh for abuse when we had Wisdom in the side? That's because Wisdom did his job defensively and didn't leave him exposed 4/5 times a game.  

[YorkshireRam]

You could put Thiago Silva alongside Christie and even he'd struggle after being left 2 on 1 time and time again. Keogh had to play CB and cover RB at times last season when both Christie and Shotton had forgotten how to play football. Notice how nobody targeted Keogh for abuse when we had Wisdom in the side? That's because Wisdom did his job defensively and didn't leave him exposed 4/5 times a game.  

I did because when we had a decent RB, nobody could use that excuse and Keogh's defensive deficiencies were even more glaring.

Keogh makes far too many mistakes, however he had a steady 2nd half of the season and played well for us. If he can maintain that performance level, he'll be pushing for a starting spot but I'd argue we have more talented defenders in the squad (and possibly incoming) who might knock him out of the side.

[Alph]

Keogh to Burnley I reckon. 

[needles]

Of what we've got assuming it's a back 4, there's Keogh and Pearce starting, Bucko unluckily glowering on the bench, and Shotton and Albentosa looking for a new club. They've both been crap. It's not even close or up for debate for me.

[inter politics]

Keogh and Shackell could be a great partnership, would compliment each other

[Scott129]

I'd like to see Keogh and Bucko get us up to the promised land (just for sentiment's sake) but I can't see that happening, unfortunately.

I'd also like to see Keogh and Shackell (that would be a top pairing) but, if we do bring Shackell in, I think Keogh's on his way out. I'm also not convinced that Burnley are going to sell their captain either.

That leaves me with Keogh and Pearce. I'd be more than comfortable with that too.