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the 'honest appraisal' debate.....

Mostyn6

By Mostyn6
in Derby County Forum

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Stive Pesley

Stive Pesley

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For the record my definition of bullshit is just "talking rubbish" - nothing to do with deliberately misleading.

 

Fact- UEFA Pro Licence is required to manage in the Premier League & UEFA tournaments. Nigel doesn't have this, but why would he? He doesn't manage in the Premier League.

 

Fact - a lot of Premier league managers also don't hold the UEFA Pro licence. They were given waivers (in the form of a "diploma") based on the length of time they had been working as a football manager. Neil Warnock is one of these.

 

Fact - the only other top level qualification is the "FA Academy Managers Licence" which is for Academy Managers and Academy Directors. Nigel doesn't have this and again, why would he?

 

 

 

This is like saying I'm a crap driver because I only have a driving licence and not a HGV licence.

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Mostyn6

Mostyn6

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"The UEFA A Licence is the highest practical coaching award available."

 

So maybe provide some links to your "fact" that the FA Career Path website is wrong?

 

perhaps I'll provide you with the help you need

 

"The UEFA A Licence is the highest practical coaching award available... from the FA here in England, to attain higher you have to go elsewhere..."

 

Or perhaps the other courses are not 'practical', maybe they're classroom courses.

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Mostyn6

Mostyn6

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For the record my definition of bullshit is just "talking rubbish" - nothing to do with deliberately misleading.

 

Fact- UEFA Pro Licence is required to manage in the Premier League & UEFA tournaments. Nigel doesn't have this, but why would he? He doesn't manage in the Premier League.

 

Fact - a lot of Premier league managers also don't hold the UEFA Pro licence. They were given waivers (in the form of a "diploma") based on the length of time they had been working as a football manager. Neil Warnock is one of these.

 

Fact - the only other top level qualification is the "FA Academy Managers Licence" which is for Academy Managers and Academy Directors. Nigel doesn't have this and again, why would he?

 

 

 

This is like saying I'm a crap driver because I only have a driving licence and not a HGV licence.

 

 

nothing like it at all, if you do well at driving a car, you don't get a promotion to drive a HGV do you?

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Dimmu

Dimmu

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I've done some badges of coaching and could propably clear little bit of these licenses....

 

Uefa Pro License is highest badge manager can get and like GreenRam said, it's demanded from managers who is working in highest level (of every country!!!). If you've ever wondered why some managers are having so called "rolling contracts", that's the reason. They usually don't have Pro License and they should if they are working permanently. (Can't remember was permantly same as 4 or 6 months or more, something like that)

 

A and B levels are really about daily training. It's very practical and gives you more tools to train people and their physique, techincal abilities, tactics etc.

 

Pro License more like high school of football, including bit of everything from sports medicine to finances. And as a reminder, Pro Licence is used everywhere and these skills are more useful somewhere else than in English clubs, where there is more people taking care of club.

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Stive Pesley

Stive Pesley

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Thanks - and as i said, there are loads of UK managers (who have managed in the Prem) that haven't got the UEFA Pro Licence, they were just given an equivalent diploma based on years of experience.

 

However, all of this is a nonsense and we should just accept that the reason we aren't top of the league is because Nigel hasn't got the certificate. Pretty much everyone  (no-one) believes that

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Mostyn6

Mostyn6

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Thanks - and as i said, there are loads of UK managers (who have managed in the Prem) that haven't got the UEFA Pro Licence, they were just given an equivalent diploma based on years of experience.

 

However, all of this is a nonsense and we should just accept that the reason we aren't top of the league is because Nigel hasn't got the certificate. Pretty much everyone  (no-one) believes that

 

and nobody said it either. Ronnie wanted to distract the thread, and it worked.

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Mostyn6

Mostyn6

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So without reading everything on this what was the end result? Was Mostyn telling unnecessary Porkies again to back up yet another weak point? 

 

basically, I made an ominous post and one sentence said "...Clough finally got his basic qualification.." or similar, it was in a massive post that was not debated, but that one throwaway and largely irrelevent sentence was picked up and labelled as a lie.

 

The conclusion? There are two qualifications higher, Brendon Rodgers has both for example, but Clough doesn't need them..

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Ambitious

Ambitious

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basically, I made an ominous post and one sentence said "...Clough finally got his basic qualification.." or similar, it was in a massive post that was not debated, but that one throwaway and largely irrelevent sentence was picked up and labelled as a lie.

 

The conclusion? There are two qualifications higher, Brendon Rodgers has both for example, but Clough doesn't need them..

 

Alan Shearer probably has both too.

 

Coaching course are horse-**** anyway, only people who haven't ever been in football will ever learn anything. I've done my FA coaching badges and they're just so basic, a 5-year-old could pass them.

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Ambitious

Ambitious

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But could you manage an academy? That's what I think let's Nigel down :lol:

 

I took these course in my exuberant youth, obviously being a football fan - I like analysing the game and my own personal opinion, in my world is quite coherent and well thought, well planned and I thought I could have some sort of future in the game.

 

But, the courses dampend my spirit about coaching, it was childs play - I managed my own football team for a couple of years, and learned more from that, about adaptability...etc despite it only being a poor standard (well the standard I can play at  :lol: well could, now my knee's knacked - who knows) 

 

I have since learned that any future in football is near on impossible without having played some kind of professional football.

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Stive Pesley

Stive Pesley

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I'm feeling slightly guilty for my Mostyn baiting (he loves it really)

 

So here's some honesty based on a thought I had. Clough & Garner were both good strikers in their day and we have seen a gradual improvement in our attacking play during their tenure. However we've seen no tangible improvement in our defending. Is that because we are lacking in the area of defensive coaching, or just because the players aren't good enough?

 

This table shows Clough's 4 full seasons and based on the 8 games so far a projection for the rest of this season (assuming we don't get better or worse obviously - it's just an illustration)

 

"http://i44.tinypic.com/9pq7f6" alt="9pq7f6">

 

Now to make the play offs a team generally has to get around 70 points, win at least 20 games and have a goal difference of at least +15.

 

As it stands we're not on track for the top 6. FACT

 

It will be interesting to do this again in another 8 games. If we're still off track for the top 6 then I imagine Sam Rush will be getting very anxious and be planning his next move -  stick or twist.

 

Either Back NC with some cash in January to improve the defence, or accept that the players are good enough and get a new manager in who might get more out of them.

 

Is that an "honest appraisal"?

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CrimsonRam

CrimsonRam

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Getting a better piece of paper from the FA  is about as helpful as spending £100,000,000 on a building and some pitches to teach kids how to play football properly.

 

Edit: Seen in a few thread this week the concept of speaking "Honestly" as if it gives credence to your opinion...... I can speak honestly but it's still my opinion and I could still be saying I don't think the holocaust happened.

 

But it's my honest appraisal.

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