Tamworthram

They are accountable but not always totally responsible. (Imagine the outcry if, following the good result and performance on Saturday, anyone had dared to suggest it was all down to PW). That doesn’t, and shouldn’t, absolve the rest of the workforce from some degree of responsibility or deny them any recognition.

It’s their fault if they execute the plan, however crap that may be, badly. I wasn’t at the game last night and neither were you but, by all accounts (looking at the comments and the player ratings) most didn’t play particularly well. 
 
Only yesterday you were stating that there is no shared responsibility - it all on PW. I’m not sure if you’ve now changed your opinion. I don’t think anyone is suggesting PW got things right last night or is completely (or even remotely convinced) by his ability and tactics but you can’t in it all on PW as you seem to be trying to do.
It’s quite telling that you have been far more vocal following last nights defeat than you were following the win on Saturday. 
 

Therein lies part of the problem with this forum at the moment. There are certain (not all and not naming names) anti Warne posters that are so blinkered that they cannot seem to accept that PW isn't always the only one to blame for our woes and anyone that suggest that is labelled a Warne lover.
There maybe members at the other end of the spectrum that can see no wrong in PW but I'm struggling to think of any. 😀

99% agree with you. Just think your assessment of “OK” for Saturday is a bit harsh. Yes, the penalty was a tad soft and two goals were scored from long free kicks but, we created a few other chances (the fine tackle on Barks as he was through in the penalty area, Barks miss when one on one with the keeper and Sibley hitting the bar spring to mind). You also have to take into account the opposition. Agreed Barnsley weren’t at their best but maybe a lot of that was down to us containing them. One swallow doesn’t make a summer though and I won’t be happy until we’re regularly producing that sort of form and result. 
 
I also agree regarding the academy prospects. I think PW was right to go with a relatively strong team and might well have brought one or two on if we’d been in a comfortable position. As it was, it seems he was too afraid to give the youngsters a try but instead opted for bringing Bradley on. 

Ironic how you’re accusing me of trying to re-interpret what you said and then can find no other interpretation for “taking responsibility” other than “not trying”. You do know that someone can try hard but still not do very well don’t you?
To try and end this conversation perhaps I should remind you that all I said originally is that I suspect there is probably an element of shared responsibility. I.e. Warne got things wrong and continues to do so but the players also make mistakes and play badly from time to time that you can’t always pin on the coaching they receive or the style of play they’re being asked to play. 

I agree to an extent in the sense that cup games should (potentially) be excluded (I don’t imagine Portsmouth fans are losing too much sleep over losing to Chesterfield) but, wouldn’t you say we have already been fundamentally inconsistent in the league even before the Bristol and Vale games? I would turn it around and suggest we have been inconsistent and it will take a longer run of good results (or at least good performances) to prove otherwise.

Is that normally how it works? Football management seems a bit of an anomaly in that it almost always is the manager who pays the price, yet in all other organisations I’ve worked in both in the public and private sector, a poor performing employee is given every opportunity to improve and if they persist with their underperformance they are more often than not managed out of the business or repurposed into a different role, it’s rarely been a manager that’s sacked despite their supposed accountability. I’ve always found in the real world as opposed to the football world that poo rolls downhill. 
This is more an observation on football management versus other industries than a specific observation on Warne. 
I guess in football the players are a business asset and less disposable than perhaps employees in the broader sense of other industries 🤔 

They are accountable but not always totally responsible. (Imagine the outcry if, following the good result and performance on Saturday, anyone had dared to suggest it was all down to PW). That doesn’t, and shouldn’t, absolve the rest of the workforce from some degree of responsibility or deny them any recognition.

It’s their fault if they execute the plan, however crap that may be, badly. I wasn’t at the game last night and neither were you but, by all accounts (looking at the comments and the player ratings) most didn’t play particularly well. 
 
Only yesterday you were stating that there is no shared responsibility - it all on PW. I’m not sure if you’ve now changed your opinion. I don’t think anyone is suggesting PW got things right last night or is completely (or even remotely convinced) by his ability and tactics but you can’t in it all on PW as you seem to be trying to do.
It’s quite telling that you have been far more vocal following last nights defeat than you were following the win on Saturday. 
 

Therein lies part of the problem with this forum at the moment. There are certain (not all and not naming names) anti Warne posters that are so blinkered that they cannot seem to accept that PW isn't always the only one to blame for our woes and anyone that suggest that is labelled a Warne lover.
There maybe members at the other end of the spectrum that can see no wrong in PW but I'm struggling to think of any. 😀

FTFY 😂

I suspect the playing out of position thing has the effect of magnifying any other mistakes. If a player is clearly struggling to do his job, and he makes a few sloppy mistakes on top of that, it's going to look a lot worse than a few sloppy mistakes in an other-wise accomplished performance, because you've already got your finger pointed in his direction.
I do think the tactical setup isn't helping either.  If you look at Hourihane's mistake for their second, in the highlights posted previously, he picks the ball up, and there's basically no other Derby player in shot for the entire duration he holds it, and he ends up trying to thread a difficult pass that he fails to make.  If he's got a simple pass on there, we probably don't concede that goal.
Their first goal, both Smith and Hourihane appear to have got caught up field, and struggle to get back quickly enough to influence the game.  But if you set up with a pair of 30+ year olds in midfield and have them both constantly getting forwards and chasing back, that sort of stuff is going to happen at times.

Folk don't need to 'answer every question you ask' matey! 
Am I doing it right? 🤣

The biggest issue is that a lot of the players we have are just not capable of doing the job that Warne wants them doing, they were mostly signed to do different jobs in a completely different setup.  Hourihane is not a mobile midfield enforcer, Sibley and Barkhuizen are not flying wingers that can cross, Collins is not a big physical target-man that you can play off, Bird and Smith are not a box-to-box midfielders etc etc etc.  A fair few of the players we've signed this summer seem to fall into this category too, which is even more worrying.
If we keep setting up in ways that require Sibley to hit the byline and cross, or Hourihane to dominate midfield on his own, or Smith to make runs into the box to support the striker etc, then both the team are going to struggle and the players themselves are going to look bad.  Those players are never going to be able to do those things.
So there are 3 options - we replace most of the squad with different players, the manager has a change of heart and completely changes tack, or we get a new manager.  I don't see anything improving until one of those things happens.

How about you listen to, and quote, the whole clip instead of cherry picking this one phrase:
 
”WE give the ball away for their second goal”
”For the next 70 minutes WE didn’t lay a glove on them”
“WE didn’t create enough goal scoring opportunities”

How about you listen to, and quote, the whole clip instead of cherry picking this one phrase:
 
”WE give the ball away for their second goal”
”For the next 70 minutes WE didn’t lay a glove on them”
“WE didn’t create enough goal scoring opportunities”

Yeah I noticed this last night, not a fan of warnes and think we probably need a change. Some people seem to now equate every problem with warne and totally absolve the players of any responsibility.
similarly sibley is being turned into Lionel Messi by some, I agree he’s talented but had a lot of chances now and never made himself a guaranteed starter. And I realise people will show me assist stats etc, but from watching games sibley has to do more. He’s not the only one in that regard.

How about you listen to, and quote, the whole clip instead of cherry picking this one phrase:
 
”WE give the ball away for their second goal”
”For the next 70 minutes WE didn’t lay a glove on them”
“WE didn’t create enough goal scoring opportunities”

Therein lies part of the problem with this forum at the moment. There are certain (not all and not naming names) anti Warne posters that are so blinkered that they cannot seem to accept that PW isn't always the only one to blame for our woes and anyone that suggest that is labelled a Warne lover.
There maybe members at the other end of the spectrum that can see no wrong in PW but I'm struggling to think of any. 😀

How about you listen to, and quote, the whole clip instead of cherry picking this one phrase:
 
”WE give the ball away for their second goal”
”For the next 70 minutes WE didn’t lay a glove on them”
“WE didn’t create enough goal scoring opportunities”

It's also clearly Warne quoting what he was saying to playing staff ahead of a game, of course he said you, he isn't on the pitch playing. I have no idea why he thinks that is a relevant point.

How about you listen to, and quote, the whole clip instead of cherry picking this one phrase:
 
”WE give the ball away for their second goal”
”For the next 70 minutes WE didn’t lay a glove on them”
“WE didn’t create enough goal scoring opportunities”

How about you listen to, and quote, the whole clip instead of cherry picking this one phrase:
 
”WE give the ball away for their second goal”
”For the next 70 minutes WE didn’t lay a glove on them”
“WE didn’t create enough goal scoring opportunities”

Therein lies part of the problem with this forum at the moment. There are certain (not all and not naming names) anti Warne posters that are so blinkered that they cannot seem to accept that PW isn't always the only one to blame for our woes and anyone that suggest that is labelled a Warne lover.
There maybe members at the other end of the spectrum that can see no wrong in PW but I'm struggling to think of any. 😀

I openly stated in this thread that I don't think he's the right man. I'm just providing some balance by also reviewing the players performances or lack of too. I have done on this thread exactly what you alledge that I don't.
Try reading what I say before throwing out petty jibes.