Formula 1 2023 and general Motorsport

[RadioactiveWaste]

So, this weekend is the Brazilian Grand Prix from Interlagos.

It's a silly sprint again, so qualifying for Sunday is today at 18.00

The sprint qualifying is 14.00 tomorrow and sprint is at 18.30

Grand Prix Sunday at 17.00

With little to play for in terms of big prizes, the only remaining interest apart for the ongoing disintegration of Sergio Perez is how do Merc, McLaren and Ferrari shake out, will we get a non-max win, and the actually interesting battles at the bottom of the constructor championship:

Williams (7th, 28 points) Alpha Tauri (8th, 16 pints) Alpha sauberaudi Romeo (9th, also 16 points) and Haas (10th 12 points) are all still hoping to get the extra money that comes with each place up the championship your team gets and it's no small deal to these teams, tens of millions of dollars.

AT are ahead of Sauber because of days heist finishing position (so a bit like goal difference).

I personally think Williams are probably safe in 7th but the resurgence of alpha Tauri probably has them worried, 3 good weekends could see them overhauled.

Although bottom of the pile seems inevitable for Haas a 4 point swing really is only 1 good performance away and Hulk and K-Mag are capable drivers,but it does seem sauberaudi-romeo have a better car, hopefully for them Bottas has a giving a toss weekend one of the last 3.

 

[RadioactiveWaste]

Sprint was good.

Yuki is my shout out today, out qualified Danny in both qualifyings and got P6 and some points towards hunting down Williams for P7.

Mclaren looked good, Mercedes looked to run out of tyre life and fade.

[Comrade 86]

6 hours ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

Sprint was good.

Yuki is my shout out today, out qualified Danny in both qualifyings and got P6 and some points towards hunting down Williams for P7.

Mclaren looked good, Mercedes looked to run out of tyre life and fade.

Mercedes don't seem to be able to get the balance of the car right at all. I think they have pace, but watching the sprint today you could see Hammy chopping at the wheel as early as the 10th lap. Perez showed a bit more, but watching him blast past Hamilton and then drive right away makes you think that in 'party mode', the RBR car still has plenty to spare, as it happened before tyre deg became an issue.

Have to say I'm already getting fed up with Sky fawning over Ricciardo. Obviously RB want a second driver who won't rock the boat or appear disgruntled at any point in time and will do whatever is required to ensure another WDC for Max. DR fits the bill perfectly, though how funny would it be if they did decide to get Fernando in? Drive to Survive viewing figures would sky-rocket 😆

[RadioactiveWaste]

Ferrari managed to Ferrari Leclerc before the race even started today.

Easy win for Max (obvs), Norris untroubled in second but not enough to challenge, Alonso won out over Perez in some pretty good racing at the end of the grand prix. following on were baby stroll, Sainz, Gasly, Lewis, YUKI Tsunoda, Ocon.

Turn 1 crash took out Albon and K-mag, the race was red flagged and piastri and ricciardo had their cars fixed to restart but were considered a lap down as they'd not done the lap under the safety car that everyone else did.

George retired but was scoring points when he did, both saubers retired, Logan sargent finished P11 ahead of the haas of hulk and the two lap down aussies.

So, my Yuki to red bull train must be gathering momentum by now, out qualifys danny twice and finishes ahead twice bringing home points in the sprint and the grand prix - go Yuki, fulfill that fast but erratic destiny.

[Comrade 86]

A funny thing happened yesterday. Race start, red flag, re-set grid and then... I went to the pub with mates, didn't bother watching the highlights and won't be bothering either. 14 of the last 15 races won by the same driver. 

Time for some fresh blood and new ideas at Merc I reckon. Toto seems to be just guessing these days. Given what a pig that car has been this year and last, for all but fleeting moments, it's remarkable that Hamilton sits 3rd even with last time out's DQ. Watching customer cars sail past them tells us all we need to know I reckon. 

[RadioactiveWaste]

On 06/11/2023 at 07:31, Comrade 86 said:

A funny thing happened yesterday. Race start, red flag, re-set grid and then... I went to the pub with mates, didn't bother watching the highlights and won't be bothering either. 14 of the last 15 races won by the same driver. 

Time for some fresh blood and new ideas at Merc I reckon. Toto seems to be just guessing these days. Given what a pig that car has been this year and last, for all but fleeting moments, it's remarkable that Hamilton sits 3rd even with last time out's DQ. Watching customer cars sail past them tells us all we need to know I reckon. 

I remember hearing that a lot of the direction of mercedes development during the dominant years had been at least signposted by Ross Brawn before he left and Toto was able to surf that up until the major rule changes in 22. I suspected BS when I heard it, but Wolf is not looking like he's on top of it at all.

It certainly seems they've made some seriously bad choices and it seems like the engineers are constantly on the back foot to even get the car 2nd, 3rd 4th fastest, same as for the most part the drivers have been doing a hell of a job to get the most out of it, the porblems at Merc are high up in the managment and technical leads, and it certainly seems they're not as strong as they used to be in that regard, the slow ebb away of people to other teams is taking it's toll as well.

I get that having to add "behind Max Verstappen" to every race has been a grind, but the other teams are getting closer and I have everything crossed for next season having at least 1 proper rival to the red bull. What I 100% do not want is the orangisers to start trying to artifically hobble Max, it only ends up sucking more than giving it a little while to shake out.

 

[Comrade 86]

6 minutes ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

I remember hearing that a lot of the direction of mercedes development during the dominant years had been at least signposted by Ross Brawn before he left and Toto was able to surf that up until the major rule changes in 22. I suspected BS when I heard it, but Wolf is not looking like he's on top of it at all.

It certainly seems they've made some seriously bad choices and it seems like the engineers are constantly on the back foot to even get the car 2nd, 3rd 4th fastest, same as for the most part the drivers have been doing a hell of a job to get the most out of it, the porblems at Merc are high up in the managment and technical leads, and it certainly seems they're not as strong as they used to be in that regard, the slow ebb away of people to other teams is taking it's toll as well.

I get that having to add "behind Max Verstappen" to every race has been a grind, but the other teams are getting closer and I have everything crossed for next season having at least 1 proper rival to the red bull. What I 100% do not want is the orangisers to start trying to artifically hobble Max, it only ends up sucking more than giving it a little while to shake out.

 

Toto seems like he has lost a little focus. This dalliance with Ratcliffe and the Man United bid is just another unwelcome diversion when full focus should be closing the gap to RBR. I don't want to sound too harsh, as he's obviously had his successes, but you just get the sense he's not 'all-in' the way he used to be and whatever we say about Karen, you could never accuse him of being anything other than 100% committed. I think when driven nature begins to ebb away, you have to accept it's time to look to fresh blood.

[RadioactiveWaste]

It's Vegas Baby!

Yeah I'm not fussed either. F1 has had an obsession with "the TV shot of F1 cars racing down the los Vegas strip" for decades it seems like.

It'll be trash.

The hype will be trash.

The track looks trash.

That one TV shot of the strip.

The race will most likely be trash.

They've tried having a grand Prix in Vegas before. It sucked.

However, I'm not alone in being grumpypants about it, so is mantrum throwing world champion max Verstappen. Hates sprints, hates Vegas, hates drive to survive...I may warm to him yet.

In terms of actual racing, Perez can secure P2 in the driver's providing he doesn't soil himself. The most exciting part is going to be can alpha Tauri overtake Williams, the AT car is good now. The AT drivers are good now.

 

[ThePrisoner]

2 hours ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

However, I'm not alone in being grumpypants about it, so is mantrum throwing world champion max Verstappen. Hates sprints, hates Vegas, hates drive to survive...I may warm to him yet.

I'm almost ashamed to admit that (as much as I can recognise his talent and how good of a car he has) during this season he really seems to have matured and grown a lot and I too am starting to warm to him.

I need a cold shower.

[Comrade 86]

3 hours ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

It's Vegas Baby!

Yeah I'm not fussed either. F1 has had an obsession with "the TV shot of F1 cars racing down the los Vegas strip" for decades it seems like.

It'll be trash.

The hype will be trash.

The track looks trash.

That one TV shot of the strip.

The race will most likely be trash.

They've tried having a grand Prix in Vegas before. It sucked.

However, I'm not alone in being grumpypants about it, so is mantrum throwing world champion max Verstappen. Hates sprints, hates Vegas, hates drive to survive...I may warm to him yet.

In terms of actual racing, Perez can secure P2 in the driver's providing he doesn't soil himself. The most exciting part is going to be can alpha Tauri overtake Williams, the AT car is good now. The AT drivers are good now.

 

This made me smile.

38 minutes ago, ThePrisoner said:

I'm almost ashamed to admit that (as much as I can recognise his talent and how good of a car he has) during this season he really seems to have matured and grown a lot and I too am starting to warm to him.

I need a cold shower.

You guys! 

He's alright, it's just fun to take the piss out of him. That said, I'm not sure he's grown up too much based on the level of expletives used at his head engineer, even when winning races and I'd also venture that it's easier to appear classy when you've won 14 of the last 15 races. I'd still be hopeful that he will be absolutely losing the plot again with Karen in back up if anyone else produces a decent car 🤣

Vegas will be shoyte though

[RadioactiveWaste]

11 minutes ago, Comrade 86 said:

This made me smile.

You guys! 

He's alright, it's just fun to take the piss out of him. That said, I'm not sure he's grown up too much based on the level of expletives used at his head engineer, even when winning races and I'd also venture that it's easier to appear classy when you've won 14 of the last 15 races. I'd still be hopeful that he will be absolutely losing the plot again with Karen in back up if anyone else produces a decent car 🤣

Vegas will be shoyte though

Oh yeah, once he's under pressure it'll be back to the hilarious sweary crashy max we all love to hate.

 

[Gaspode]

First practice cancelled after broken manhole cover damages both Sainz and Ocon cars.....too much hype, not enough substance - could I actually agree with the man-baby for once?

[RadioactiveWaste]

1 hour ago, Gaspode said:

First practice cancelled after broken manhole cover damages both Sainz and Ocon cars.....too much hype, not enough substance - could I actually agree with the man-baby for once?

Not going to lie, I'm highly amused by this development.

[Rambam]

19 minutes ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

Not going to lie, I'm highly amused by this development.

Yanks ruining the sport shocker. It’s like, how come they get two world cups before we get another one? It’s their fourth favourite sport! 

Edited November 17, 2023 by Rambam

[ThePrisoner]

[Gaspode]

You couldn't make up the farce that F1 is nowadays - Sainz hits a broken manhole cover (clearly not his fault) and therefore has to repair various bits of his powertrain and is given a 10 place grid penalty as a result...are they actively trying to drive people away from the sport?

[RadioactiveWaste]

Just now, Gaspode said:

You couldn't make up the farce that F1 is nowadays - Sainz hits a broken manhole cover (clearly not his fault) and therefore has to repair various bits of his powertrain and is given a 10 place grid penalty as a result...are they actively trying to drive people away from the sport?

It's effectively they had to because if they didn't the other teams would challenge it, because it's in the way the rules are written and how could you justify not weakening the position of a competitor?

Of course, the rules are written assuming that the track is fit to race on, which it clearly isn't and there isn't any exemption based on "unfit track" because that'd raise the question of why were they running on an unfit track.

Essentially Ferrari will have to seek restitution by suing race control for declaring the track open.......it's so F1 it's unbelievable.

I disliked the Vegas obsession before, I disliked this race before the start of the weekend.

I'm open to giving it a fair shot,but everything about it, to me, is looking like this is going to be an epic fail.

And as someone (forgot who) who drove the "ceaser's palace grand Prix" from the early 80s said on a podcast this week - the gambling on F1 just isn't there so it's not really ever going to be a Las Vegas thing.

10 years of this pish whilst great tracks are gradually dropped from the calenda never to return......

[Comrade 86]

Look on the brightside, in 5 years, when the Liberty have completely squeezed the pips out of it, the Saudis state will buy F1 for 3 times what it's worth and then stage every race around the streets of Jeddah, with literally nobody watching. Imagine how cheap the tickets will be! You'll even be able to afford an Air BNB in Monaco during race week. No racing mind, but hey, you can't have everything.

Good to see the drivers, (yes, him too) giving it a resounding 'oh do **** off', as well as binning off the meet and greet. Wish I could have seen Stefano Domenicali's reaction when he realised not one of the top drivers were going to rock up. Even baby Stroll blanked him 🫢

[RadioactiveWaste]

17 minutes ago, Comrade 86 said:

Look on the brightside, in 5 years, when the Liberty have completely squeezed the pips out of it, the Saudis state will buy F1 for 3 times what it's worth and then stage every race around the streets of Jeddah, with literally nobody watching. Imagine how cheap the tickets will be! You'll even be able to afford an Air BNB in Monaco during race week. No racing mind, but hey, you can't have everything.

Good to see the drivers, (yes, him too) giving it a resounding 'oh do **** off', as well as binning off the meet and greet. Wish I could have seen Stefano Domenicali's reaction when he realised not one of the top drivers were going to rock up. Even baby Stroll blanked him 🫢

That's probably the best bit.

I've often mused that F1 in it's current form will eventually die, but "Grand Prix racing" as the top single seater motorsport category with open technical development will continue. And, no, I'm not going to big up FormulaE as being that replacment.

But I agree, I think the Liberty Media era of F1 expansion is going to crash hard at some point (remember about 15 yars ago Nascar was blowing up huge then crashed), souless dustbowl races no one wants to be at that exist as ego trips and sportswashing for dictators. The vacuous endless hype, the gimmicks, the manufactured rivalries and drama, it's all so very limited in vision and it's fluff that once it's worn off leaves a tarnished version of what was once an actually impressive sport.

They lucked out on 21 being a close season but even then they couldn't help themselves trying amp it up so much it ended up tainted.

 

[Comrade 86]

14 minutes ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

That's probably the best bit.

I've often mused that F1 in it's current form will eventually die, but "Grand Prix racing" as the top single seater motorsport category with open technical development will continue. And, no, I'm not going to big up FormulaE as being that replacment.

But I agree, I think the Liberty Media era of F1 expansion is going to crash hard at some point (remember about 15 yars ago Nascar was blowing up huge then crashed), souless dustbowl races no one wants to be at that exist as ego trips and sportswashing for dictators. The vacuous endless hype, the gimmicks, the manufactured rivalries and drama, it's all so very limited in vision and it's fluff that once it's worn off leaves a tarnished version of what was once an actually impressive sport.

They lucked out on 21 being a close season but even then they couldn't help themselves trying amp it up so much it ended up tainted.

 

Sad to say, I think this just about nails it.