SuperDerbySuperRams Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 Far better. If used correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 15 minutes ago, brady1993 said: I know I might be going on a bit here but he really isn't.... https://www.whoscored.com/Players/12490/History/Bradley-Johnson Derby 16/17 - 69.5% Derby 15/16 - 74% Norwich 15/16 - 70.1% Norwich 14/15 - 72.2% Norwich 13/14 - 74.2% Norwich 12/13 - 71.9% Norwich 11/12 - 78% AVE - 73.6% Fair enough, but as the old saying goes stats aren't everything, I think he's passing is solid enough to play some form or role in our team but that's my opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 1 hour ago, Alpha said: I think the best of these players would be better than the best of the 2013 bunch. But Clough already had them as a group. These lot seem like strangers on a pitch not sure it's true to pretend that they never looked like strangers under Nigel Clough. There was plenty of woeful football under him. I do wonder however, if McClaren has this lot flying up the table, will you all start giving Pearson and Clement as much credit as NC gets now. For me, NC deserves credit for spotting players, all the rest... the tactics, spirit, feelgood factor and attitude during the good times... the credit for that belongs to SMc and his staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 As a group of 25 individuals - better. As a team of 25 all geared up to play football in the same style - considerably weaker. Clough made his signings with a particularly style of football in mind which he actually implemented. McClaren just did it better. I'd take our September 2013 squad back in a heartbeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 3 minutes ago, Mostyn6 said: not sure it's true to pretend that they never looked like strangers under Nigel Clough. There was plenty of woeful football under him. I do wonder however, if McClaren has this lot flying up the table, will you all start giving Pearson and Clement as much credit as NC gets now. For me, NC deserves credit for spotting players, all the rest... the tactics, spirit, feelgood factor and attitude during the good times... the credit for that belongs to SMc and his staff. Me to, 5 years and the highest he got them was 8th (could have even been 10th), and not once did we ever look like even getting to the play offs let alone promotion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
needles Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 The best players we have now were here when he came in first time around. The rest are more expensive and in places have more ability, but aren't so well blended. It's like we've bought players like Panini stickers rather than with any clear purpose. I'd say his job is bigger this time, much bigger. Needs patience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroyDyer Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 7 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said: Me to, 5 years and the highest he got them was 8th (could have even been 10th), and not once did we ever look like even getting to the play offs let alone promotion. Highest we finished was 10th. I love how much the line "If he was that good, how come bigger clubs never came in for him?" is applied to players when they leave this club, but never to Nigel Clough. The man gets a free pass. "But he had to get rid of so many players"... Yeah, most of which he signed himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 9 minutes ago, Mostyn6 said: not sure it's true to pretend that they never looked like strangers under Nigel Clough. There was plenty of woeful football under him. I do wonder however, if McClaren has this lot flying up the table, will you all start giving Pearson and Clement as much credit as NC gets now. For me, NC deserves credit for spotting players, all the rest... the tactics, spirit, feelgood factor and attitude during the good times... the credit for that belongs to SMc and his staff. There were signs under Clough of great team spirit, good football and everyone knowing their roles. Signs of a team. Not like now where it looks like a teenagers bedroom. McClaren took it way beyond that but I wouldn't compare what Clough left to what we have now. And that's over a £30m upgrade. I think Pearson gets enough credit for winning the PL. I don't think I like a single thing that he did in his time here. Don't think a single player performed at their best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TelTheRam Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 16 minutes ago, Mostyn6 said: not sure it's true to pretend that they never looked like strangers under Nigel Clough. There was plenty of woeful football under him. I do wonder however, if McClaren has this lot flying up the table, will you all start giving Pearson and Clement as much credit as NC gets now. For me, NC deserves credit for spotting players, all the rest... the tactics, spirit, feelgood factor and attitude during the good times... the credit for that belongs to SMc and his staff. Some credit to Clement, but Pearson ? Not a chance. If Mac gets them flying it will just show how bad Pearson was. 9 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said: Me to, 5 years and the highest he got them was 8th (could have even been 10th), and not once did we ever look like even getting to the play offs let alone promotion. It was 10th but you can't really say he had them for 5 years. Having finally got a squad capable of challenging he was sacked. Its obvious Mac got them playing better, and the loan of Wisdom was great for us, but I think we would have been somewhere near or just in the playoffs that season even with Clough. The style was already starting to show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 15 minutes ago, TelTheRam said: Some credit to Clement, but Pearson ? Not a chance. If Mac gets them flying it will just show how bad Pearson was. It was 10th but you can't really say he had them for 5 years. Having finally got a squad capable of challenging he was sacked. Its obvious Mac got them playing better, and the loan of Wisdom was great for us, but I think we would have been somewhere near or just in the playoffs that season even with Clough. The style was already starting to show. Which ever way you look at it, there were clubs all around us during that period that finished higher than us, he had 5 years and the best he could finish was 10th. Teams got relegated from that league and promoted twice in the same period he was in charge, 5 years...Pearson didn't even get much over 5 weeks, PC 5 months, and here we had someone whose claim to fame was 10th, and still people say that was going to be his year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 We were weird under Clough. He had us performing like one of the best teams in the league but we were undone by his own lack of tactical nous and his lack of willingness to 'go for it'. Burnley, Leicester and Reading all respected us enough to park the bus and allow us to play our game… but in the latter two's case they easily beat us. We murdered the likes of Millwall and Yeovil, passed them off the pitch. We were flat-track bullies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 25 minutes ago, cannable said: We were weird under Clough. He had us performing like one of the best teams in the league but we were undone by his own lack of tactical nous and his lack of willingness to 'go for it'. Burnley, Leicester and Reading all respected us enough to park the bus and allow us to play our game… but in the latter two's case they easily beat us. We murdered the likes of Millwall and Yeovil, passed them off the pitch. We were flat-track bullies. I'll never forget that first game of the season, going 2-up at home to Sheff Weds and playing amazingly. I remember thinking "yes, he's cracked it" as we restricted their players to long shots and runs from halfway, (maybe Antonio), but then we proper backed off and let them have the ball and ended up 2-2. I was devastated.. mainly cos the ex was Wednesday fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brady1993 Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 2 hours ago, Millenniumram said: Fair enough, but as the old saying goes stats aren't everything, I think he's passing is solid enough to play some form or role in our team but that's my opinion I've been giving this a little thought. If anyone can coach Johnson into becoming a holding midfielder with decent ball retention it's Mac. He just needs to sit in place and play it simply (but quickly) into the feet of our more advanced players. I still stand by we shouldn't have signed him at the time but now he's here perhaps I should be a little patient to see what Mac can make of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 7 minutes ago, brady1993 said: I've been giving this a little thought. If anyone can coach Johnson into becoming a holding midfielder with decent ball retention it's Mac. He just needs to sit in place and play it simply (but quickly) into the feet of our more advanced players. I still stand by we shouldn't have signed him at the time but now he's here perhaps I should be a little patient to see what Mac can make of him. That's pretty much my thoughts exactly, good player, not what we needed- but can still be useful under the right coaching and in the right role Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brady1993 Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 1 minute ago, Millenniumram said: That's pretty much my thoughts exactly, good player, not what we needed- but can still be useful under the right coaching and in the right role Particularly whilst King george gets fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 13 minutes ago, brady1993 said: Particularly whilst King george gets fit. Yep hopefully the king of football won't be long tho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 4 hours ago, Mostyn6 said: I'll never forget that first game of the season, going 2-up at home to Sheff Weds and playing amazingly. I remember thinking "yes, he's cracked it" as we restricted their players to long shots and runs from halfway, (maybe Antonio), but then we proper backed off and let them have the ball and ended up 2-2. I was devastated.. mainly cos the ex was Wednesday fan. This was why I wanted Clough to stay but in hindsight am glad he went. Honestly, I felt we should have made the play-offs in 12/13. It's such a strange scenario for a manager to have his team producing top three standard performances and yet them finishing tenth. Most of it was nothing we couldn't have done from the stands. As a fan, the only thing I wouldn't have been able to do to take Clough's team into McClaren's team is to sort us out from set-pieces. Everything else just seemed so simple and he just couldn't see it. But this is something he deserves credit with. No. he may not have taken us to the play-offs. But performance wise he had us playing to that standard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TelTheRam Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 22 hours ago, Mostyn6 said: I'll never forget that first game of the season, going 2-up at home to Sheff Weds and playing amazingly. I remember thinking "yes, he's cracked it" as we restricted their players to long shots and runs from halfway, (maybe Antonio), but then we proper backed off and let them have the ball and ended up 2-2. I was devastated.. mainly cos the ex was Wednesday fan. The first game of the 13/14 season was against Blackburn, draw 1-1. Late equaliser for them after Eustace was brought on to hep shore up the defence I believe. That was the only home game I missed that season. Leicester didn't batter us at home, they got a fluke own goal. Promoted as champions. Burnley did batter us - as usual. Promoted as runners-up Reading we lost 3-1 to a late goal when pushing for an equaliser. And I've seen people say Pearson had a difficult start ! Any way, all done a long time ago. We move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 12 minutes ago, TelTheRam said: The first game of the 13/14 season was against Blackburn, draw 1-1. Late equaliser for them after Eustace was brought on to hep shore up the defence I believe. That was the only home game I missed that season. Leicester didn't batter us at home, they got a fluke own goal. Promoted as champions. Burnley did batter us - as usual. Promoted as runners-up Reading we lost 3-1 to a late goal when pushing for an equaliser. And I've seen people say Pearson had a difficult start ! Any way, all done a long time ago. We move on. You're talking about a different season. I didn't specify which season, just A season where I got prematurely excited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TelTheRam Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 4 minutes ago, Mostyn6 said: You're talking about a different season. I didn't specify which season, just A season where I got prematurely excited. Sorry, I thought we were talking about when he was sacked. Not worth arguing over. No matter, I'm excited for tomorrow now Mostyn6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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