eddie Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 8 minutes ago, curtains said: No Didn't you flounce yesterday? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Just now, eddie said: Didn't you flounce yesterday? Because I knew this was going to happen. Preminition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEL Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Just now, curtains said: Because I knew this was going to happen. Euro millions numbers please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadioactiveWaste Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Nope. nope. no. Although he's not likely to last much longer at "toon" and has spent even more than us..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North East Ram Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 1 minute ago, curtains said: Because I knew this was going to happen. Must've made a few bob then? any thoughts on the roll over numbers this week? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 1 minute ago, Derby_EnglandLoyal said: Euro millions numbers please. I only work on racing certainties. But certain players need to look at themselves thats all I'm saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssendonRam Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 In a heartbeat! Does he need to modify the helter-skelter brand of football? Of course. Ironically, Clement would've been the perfect deputy for him to achieve that. But just as most Derby fans actually dismiss the positives of Nigel's time in rightly pointing out the negatives, we're doing the same with McClaren. McClaren rejuvenated basically the same squad from mid-table/lower PO status to potential world beaters on their day. We forget how young and lightly framed they were (traditionally death in the Championship). We forget how half the Premier League were seriously placing "Derby County under Steve McClaren" at or near the top of their preferred list for their young stars to be developed. We forget the horribly timed rash of injuries to key players in what was still one of the smaller squads in the Championship. We forget we lost Jordan Ibe who, in hindsight, was our pace (still missing it). We forget that, while Steve certainly had a better deal with players than Nigel, we were still unable to BUY many players; reliance on loanees was our lot. Despite that, we played a side £50-60m "better" than us off the park but just couldn't snatch promotion. Mac rightly said: it's not luck, we're not ready. He played to our strengths the entire next season and we were first...until injury and loanee turnover - coinciding with the worst part of our fixture - robbed the side of cohesion. Then confidence. Then their togetherness as the blame game set in. From fans. From the media. Possibly - nay, probably - from within. Then, two months AFTER Mac had turned down the Newcastle job, the Newcastle issue resurfaced. Why? Because results had dried up. The media ignored the obvious reasons and targeted the better story. Thus began the myth of the turned head. Why do I confidently assert it to be a myth? Because it was accompanied by emotive claims of "disloyalty" when McClaren, if anything, erred by showing too much loyalty to Derby County. In hindsight, that decision may have harmed both Derby and himself. Instead of taking the more prestigious job mid-season as most managers would have done, he turned it down saying he had a job to do and wanted to do it. He risked the job no longer being available by delaying his decision. This logic is irrefutable yet many Derby fans refuse to acknowledge it. They argue McClaren was always going to take the Newcastle job but the above is irrefutable regardless of whether he had made up his mind to go or to stay. My belief, for what little it's worth, is that McClaren was undecided but inclined to leave at season's end if Newcastle avoided relegation. I also suspect he did the honourable thing and advised the Board and/or the club of that and felt they understood his position; indeed, I suspect the Board collaborated in not making it public while commencing the search for his replacement. But, subsequently, the results went awry and the pressure from outside grew. While McClaren and the club stuck stoically to the agreed script, fans and the media demanded the categoric assurances McClaren couldn't give. At some point, the tension between McClaren and the prospective new sole owner became intolerable; perhaps Mel had hoped McClaren would alter his timetable for a decision once he'd regaled him with his ambitions for Derby? I suspect not. I suspect Mel Morris moved on from McClaren the instant he mistook his interest in Newcastle for disloyalty. This, if it was apparent to McClaren, may have meant he realised that, in doing what he thought was the right thing for himself and for Derby, he could have lost both jobs. If the players were aware of either the tension or the likelihood of McClaren departing Derby, it's easy to see how unsettling it might have been; unlike most, I suspect the players' sympathy may have lain with McClaren if they knew of the circumstances. Why?; because professional footballers would ordinarily consider it odd to defer an offer from a bigger club. Either way, the uncertainty was not conducive to getting the season back on track.Against that, to be fair, is the fact none of the players followed McClaren to Newcastle which could suggest his relationship with some of them wasn't strong. As the season petered out, McClaren and his staff were increasingly rendered isolated and impotent. We missed the playoffs after an incredibly dispirited performance against Reading. Then, after the season, McClaren decided to stay. Many assume it was for the payout; I suspect it had more to do with the natural disappointment at failure. His reputation hadn't been restored at Derby after all and failure at Newcastle would possibly return him (unfairly) to the wilderness. Either way, Derby had moved on. They had already identified Mac's successor; we sacked him after a standoff and engaged in a petty argument about his payout. That was pure bile on Mel's part; it was unprofessional and unnecessary since the club didn't have any legal basis to refuse the payout. (Only in Australia can you be charged with hurting another's feelings!) With that act of pettiness, Derby extinguished any possible prospect of civility with McClaren - genuinely unfortunate as we had, overall, been good for each other - but also sent a dangerous signal to prospective employees about a potentially Maxwell-esque disregard for employee entitlements. After the events of this week, I hope Mel thinks over how he and McClaren allowed their egos to poison what ought to have been a straightforward situation. When I heard Mel speaking about it, he did sound a tad regretful that we'd lost McClaren in the manner we did. I hope he genuinely thinks about what he may need to improve so he doesn't repeat what I suspect is the same mistake: managers performing well will get approaches from other clubs. If a "big" club comes a'knockin', there is nothing to be gained by being offended by it. Or accusing the manager of being insufficiently committed to his - our - ambitions for Derby County. The only thing we can - and should - do about that is to keep pursuing our strategy to grow the club. *** Apologies for the 3000-word essay as rant: I just don't want all of the work so many have done since 2008 to improve every aspect of the club to be brought undone by silly fan expectations and impatience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 enjoyed that ram don.....pretty much on the mark too in my opinion. mac brought me back to derby after a long absence for various reasons and ill be forever grateful to him for that....... my view is that if we had triumphed againt qpr in the play offs he would still be here now and we wouldnt be far behind leicester,esp with mels backing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssendonRam Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 21 minutes ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said: enjoyed that ram don.....pretty much on the mark too in my opinion. mac brought me back to derby after a long absence for various reasons and ill be forever grateful to him for that....... my view is that if we had triumphed againt qpr in the play offs he would still be here now and we wouldnt be far behind leicester,esp with mels backing Thanks mate. But I didn't enjoy your response as much...because I half agree. I accepted after the PO Final that that squad wasn't ready...It was either that or cry uncontrollably! But, honestly, I don't know any more: Hughes and Thorne belong in the Prem. In fact, I would go so far as to say (conveniently ignoring knee injuries) their game is better suited to the Premiership and I suspect we'll be holding up their development if we don't win promotion this year. I know many don't rate Weimann but he's another I think will be better suited to the Premiership. We may have struggled to avoid relegation but I have zero doubt we'd have done better than QPR; given the rate some of the minnows have been falling over, I think we might just have scraped to safety. And, then, built on that core young squad. I also think McClaren is more suited to the style in the Premiership too, partly because circumstances force him to be a little more conservative. But Derby as Leicester? Despite the fact that I often wear the Pedigree away top when watching Fester nowadays just to help me imagine that's us soon....Mac is a long way off Ranieri. But, if we can keep doing what we have been doing every year since 2008 and improve the brand across the board, we'll be competing in the top 10 every year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 aye,you are probably right and its probably the drink making me overly optimistic about our chances back in 2013 but i genuinely believe that we may have gone onto prosper in the prem with mac in charge...but only with some heavy investment in backing up the squad which was our downfall last year.....oh well,here we go again anyways! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssendonRam Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 2 minutes ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said: aye,you are probably right and its probably the drink making me overly optimistic about our chances back in 2013 but i genuinely believe that we may have gone onto prosper in the prem with mac in charge...but only with some heavy investment in backing up the squad which was our downfall last year.....oh well,here we go again anyways! Nah, it's not the drink. It's the fact that we're building our best squad since TBE's magical squad. And that squad also played positive football. We're on our way mate. We just have to balance not letting our expectations get out of hand (cos some of us are becoming almost Toonish with how we carry on) but also keep the faith when little setbacks happen. The upward trajectory since 2008 has been unbelievable. I honestly believe it's only us that can stop us this time! Winning the Prem? Nah. Us joining Fester and others to cut the money giants down a bit? Yes! They're all so reliant on competing in the Champions League every year that, just knocking them out for a year or two one-by-one, could undermine their elite model. They're all either so highly geared or their prima donnas get upset and look to leave, that could really close the gap permanently. The EPL table this year makes me wonder; not just Fester either. The gap will never be eradicated but I have a feeling there's a chance to reduce their advantage for smart, well-run holistic clubs over the next few years. And, then, if the billionaires get bored with not being guaranteed to buy titles every few years, who knows? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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