Boxing Thread

[Comrade 86]

Not surprised by the bias at all. It's America and Canelo is the current cash-cow or at least he was. If he takes the re-match, which I doubt he will, despite the bluster, he'll just get beaten up again. Bivol himslef expressed concerns about getting the decision in the US but stated that he'd welcome the chance to show the world how good he is. I certainly wasn't the only man hoovering up the 5/1 on the Exchanges and yet the money still poured in on Canelo who was as short as 2/9 by the start of the fight. Honestly makes me wonder how many of those punters had even seen Bivol fight, or if they had, what they'd seen that made them think he could lose. 

As for Bivol dominating the division for years, there's the small matter of Artur Beterbiev to overcome before such claims can be made, though I'd not put it past him. That said, IMO Beterbiev is pound-for-pound the most destructive fighter out there and let's not forget he's also the current WBC and IBF LH champ. It has to be noted though that he's not getting any younger. It'll be interesting to see whether Joel Diaz and the Bivol camp see making that fight as a worthwile risk, or whether they take the cash should Canelo be dumb enough to exercise the re-match clause. I don't think the Canelo camp fancied Beterbiev one bit and saw Bivol as the easier option, so I think Artur ends up by default with Bivol or Buatsi as his next meaningful challenger.

Talking of the latter, I mentioned Buatsi a while back. He's raw, but extremely dangerous and I suggested on here a while back that he was worth following. He takes on Craig Richards in an all British elimination bout this month and I expect Buatsi win with minimal fuss. For such a lovely bloke outside the ring, Buatsi scares the crap out of me when he pulls the gloves on. He's beyond ferocious and just walks through anything and everything thrown at him. He could be a serious challenger, but the Richards fight will tell us more. Nice to see another all-British fight, irrespective.

Aa a footnote, I also suggested a while back that Kell Brook would KO Khan but should then retire as there were no fights to be made that weren't space-fillers or unwinnable. I'm genuinely pleased to see he's hung up his gloves and leaves the game healthy. It's the right call and he retires head held high and with a nice few quid in the bank. This makes me happy. 

Lastly, Oliveira! Great fight champ, but missing weight and getting stripped is just plain stupid. That said, it was nice to see him shut up the motormouth that is Justin Gaethje. Who's the quitter now Justin? After weeks of calling Oilveira a quitter, there was some schadenfreude in seeing him totally outthought and outfought before quitting the fight himself. That's karma. 

[Alph]

I wanted to see Buatsi v Yarde. Well, not for seeing Yarde get beat but more his trainer Tunde. Can't stand the geezer. Yarde might be bearable without the clowns that he's with. 

Buatsi in a tough fight though. I know he's violent when he sets about it but there was one fight (can't remember who) where he seemed to struggle to adapt for a while. Richards is a good step up. He's going down the WBA route isn't he? So he's likely to bump into Bivol before Beterbiev? 

Interesting to see the route Buatsi takes. It's not really a stacked division so it's going to be tough to build up to Bivol. Again it's a division like Super Lightweight where the best rise quickly and run out of options. Where does Buatsi go after Richards, assuming he wins? 

[Comrade 86]

18 minutes ago, Alpha said:

I wanted to see Buatsi v Yarde. Well, not for seeing Yarde get beat but more his trainer Tunde. Can't stand the geezer. Yarde might be bearable without the clowns that he's with. 

Buatsi in a tough fight though. I know he's violent when he sets about it but there was one fight (can't remember who) where he seemed to struggle to adapt for a while. Richards is a good step up. He's going down the WBA route isn't he? So he's likely to bump into Bivol before Beterbiev? 

Interesting to see the route Buatsi takes. It's not really a stacked division so it's going to be tough to build up to Bivol. Again it's a division like Super Lightweight where the best rise quickly and run out of options. Where does Buatsi go after Richards, assuming he wins? 

Think you might mean Bolotniks who was pretty wily and it was late in the fight before Joshua started to get on top. Buatsi was guilty of headhunting that night IMO. The punch that ended it though! Hopefully his team will have been reminding him that he can't beat everyone with single shots and the lads body-shots are genuinely frightening. Think he ought to have learned plenty that night anyway so while he's outdoubtedly still very raw, he has time on his side. As I said, I think the Richards fight will tell us more about his championship credentials and you're correct about the division. The Richards fight is a WBA eleminator, not WBC. Assuming he beats Richards, then the three in the unification mix are Bivol, Beterbiev and Buatsi and I don't see either of the Russians ducking anyone, nor Buatsi for that matter.

[Comrade 86]

On 11/04/2022 at 21:14, Bris Vegas said:

Canelo won’t lose another boxing match in his career. 

 

On 05/05/2022 at 03:31, 86 Hair Islands said:

Agreed. Looking forward to this one. There was some 5/1 available on the exchanges and I've taken some. I don't see this as being straightforward for Canelo against a natural LH who is technical and has really good feet. He's not an out-and-out banger like Beterbiev, it's true, but there's spite in his punches and I'd sooner take 5's on Bivol than 1/4 Canelo.

[Alph]

Tbf I thought he'd beat Bivol too. 

Even if it had to be a robbery. The fact they gave it 7-5 shows that Canelo wins a few rounds every ring walk. He has a granite chin so simply surviving I thought would see him win every fight. 

I like what Bivol said. 

He doesn't care if he doesn't get the decision. He doesn't care if he's "robbed". He'll prove to himself that he can beat Canelo. 

Shows how one sided it was that they couldn't even tip it. That jab left Canelo marked up after 5 minutes

[Comrade 86]

55 minutes ago, Alpha said:

Tbf I thought he'd beat Bivol too. 

Even if it had to be a robbery. The fact they gave it 7-5 shows that Canelo wins a few rounds every ring walk. He has a granite chin so simply surviving I thought would see him win every fight. 

I like what Bivol said. 

He doesn't care if he doesn't get the decision. He doesn't care if he's "robbed". He'll prove to himself that he can beat Canelo. 

Shows how one sided it was that they couldn't even tip it. That jab left Canelo marked up after 5 minutes

I know I'm just being a tw4t ?

 

[Bris Vegas]

2 hours ago, 86 Hair Islands said:

 

In my mind Canelo has now lost five fights. Floyd, Lara, GGG x2 and Bivol.

The reason I thought he’d never lose another fight is he is first and foremost very good and extremely durable, but judging on the previous scorecards against the aforementioned, he’s boxings number one cash cow.

Boxing is a subjective sport and opinions are swayed by green notes.

If roles were reversed and Canelo had done to Bivol what Bivol had done to Canelo, you’d be looking at 119-109 scorecard on each.

Edited May 9, 2022 by Bris Vegas

[Comrade 86]

38 minutes ago, Bris Vegas said:

In my mind Canelo has now lost five fights. Floyd, Lara, GGG x2 and Bivol.

The reason I thought he’d never lose another fight is he is first and foremost very good and extremely durable, but judging on the previous scorecards against the aforementioned, he’s boxings number one cash cow.

Boxing is a subjective sport and opinions are swayed by green notes.

If roles were reversed and Canelo had done to Bivol what Bivol had done to Canelo, you’d be looking at 119-109 scorecard on each.

Errr, yeah. Was just pulling your leg mate.

[Alph]

Boxing outside the ring is such nonsense isn't it. 

As if in this day and age we let people pick a winner based on things like Aggression/coming forward. 

There's enough technology to score jabs, power punches, % success and even zones of the ring (how ring position is even a criteria is nonsense considering some fighters prefer being on the back foot).

Time and time again judges have proven they can't be trusted. Saturday the perfect example. I love watching Canelo's story unfold as he'll be spoken about for a century. I didn't care who won. But Canelo did not win 5 rounds. And yet some had him winning 5 or 6

The only way that is possible is if you prefer a fighter and watch it entirely from his perspective. 

With that AJ v Usyk fight I thought it was close at first because I'm watching shots bounce off Joshua and cheering his punches on Usyk. Almost ignoring Usyk's shots. I had Usyk winning but watching it back he won far more comfortable than I originally thought. Impartiality is a big ask and boxing judges aren't capable of ignoring hype/names. 

Edited May 9, 2022 by Alpha

[BaaLocks]

11 minutes ago, Alpha said:

Boxing outside the ring is such nonsense isn't it. 

As if in this day and age we let people pick a winner based on things like Aggression/coming forward. 

There's enough technology to score jabs, power punches, % success and even zones of the ring (how ring position is even a criteria is nonsense considering some fighters prefer being on the back foot).

Time and time again judges have proven they can't be trusted. Saturday the perfect example. I love watching Canelo's story unfold as he'll be spoken about for a century. I didn't care who won. But Canelo did not win 5 rounds. And yet some had him winning 5 or 6

The only way that is possible is if you prefer a fighter and watch it entirely from his perspective. 

With that AJ v Usyk fight I thought it was close at first because I'm watching shots bounce off Joshua and cheering his punches on Usyk. Almost ignoring Usyk's shots. I had Usyk winning but watching it back he won far more comfortable than I originally thought. Impartiality is a big ask and boxing judges aren't capable of ignoring hype/names. 

Yup, thirty years later I have finally admitted that Leonard won the Hagler fight, for pretty much the reasons you said, I always wanted Hagler to have won it coz he was, well, Marvelous.

[Bris Vegas]

2 hours ago, Alpha said:

Boxing outside the ring is such nonsense isn't it. 

As if in this day and age we let people pick a winner based on things like Aggression/coming forward. 

There's enough technology to score jabs, power punches, % success and even zones of the ring (how ring position is even a criteria is nonsense considering some fighters prefer being on the back foot).

Time and time again judges have proven they can't be trusted. Saturday the perfect example. I love watching Canelo's story unfold as he'll be spoken about for a century. I didn't care who won. But Canelo did not win 5 rounds. And yet some had him winning 5 or 6

The only way that is possible is if you prefer a fighter and watch it entirely from his perspective. 

With that AJ v Usyk fight I thought it was close at first because I'm watching shots bounce off Joshua and cheering his punches on Usyk. Almost ignoring Usyk's shots. I had Usyk winning but watching it back he won far more comfortable than I originally thought. Impartiality is a big ask and boxing judges aren't capable of ignoring hype/names. 

It’s genuinely hard to watch any sport you are invested in and not favour one side or the other. There is no way boxing judges are completely neutral with no ulterior motive. Nobody other than somebody wanting Cáñelo to win could give him six rounds vs Floyd, or 10. Rounds vs GGG, or even five rounds vs Bivol.

While the likes of GGG was robbed of a middleweight record, I don’t think his career has been harmed by the Cáñelo results in terms of future prospects and his bank balance.

Where boxing is really unfair is when an unheard of fighter from Mexico with a pretty average record travels to Europe to fight for a world title and gets blatantly robbed on points. It’s career-defining and life changing moments. It can elevate one boxer out of relative poverty and completely change their life and those around them. 

This happens far too frequently. 

[Alph]

They also try to balance fights don't they?

Like Saturday it's entirely possible to give Bivol all 12 rounds. But that would mean the scores wouldn't show how that Bivol had to work for it.

So they tip a few to a losing fighter to show he was competitive. 

When in truth Canelo was competitive but probably lost 11 rounds.

You even find yourself thinking you have to find Canelo a round here because he's Canelo!

[Comrade 86]

Canelo - Bivol 2 a distinct possibility it seems. Had my doubts, but apparently all Canelo needs to do to win comfortably is work behind the jab. So simple a strategy that I'm wondering why he didn't try it on the night ?

[Alph]

57 minutes ago, 86 Hair Islands said:

Canelo - Bivol 2 a distinct possibility it seems. Had my doubts, but apparently all Canelo needs to do to win comfortably is work behind the jab. So simple a strategy that I'm wondering why he didn't try it on the night ?

He'll have to carry Piers Morgan's ego for 6 months if he wants to stretch his arms long enough to jab Bivol.

 

[Alph]

Great scrap on Channel 5

[Alph]

Linus Udofia v Denzel Bentley was a great fight. Hate fights like this that go distance because some poor lad has thrown the kitchen sink at a very close fight and won't get the decision. 

[Comrade 86]

Buatsi - Richards fight a belter. Richards was incredibly game and the contrast of styles made for a really entertaining fight with quarter asked nor given. Better from Buatsi from a technical standpoint, but he remains reckless and in his first real test, he didn't show enough for me to think he has the beating of the Russians. Feel a little for Richards, as he's a really skilled fighter, but his punches are stinging rather than heavy and while he did wobble Buatsi in the 8th, he couldn't stop him marching forward and landing plenty of his own. A routine, if hard fought win then for Buatsi, but without the fireworks I expected. Not sure where Richards goes from here though.

Next up is Bivol and I don't think he'll be overly worried by what he sees. He has the option of the contracted re-match with Alvarez, but despite Canelo and his camp's claims, I don't see that fight happening. Bivol comprehensively beats Buatsi for my money, at which point the Russians have nobody left bar eachother. Some match up that'd be! The outstanding boxer versus the outstanding puncher. Fair to say that for a dvision that lacks a little strength in depth, it is still throwing up some very decent fights with the promise of more to come.

[Alph]

20 hours ago, 86 Hair Islands said:

Buatsi - Richards fight a belter. Richards was incredibly game and the contrast of styles made for a really entertaining fight with quarter asked nor given. Better from Buatsi from a technical standpoint, but he remains reckless and in his first real test, he didn't show enough for me to think he has the beating of the Russians. Feel a little for Richards, as he's a really skilled fighter, but his punches are stinging rather than heavy and while he did wobble Buatsi in the 8th, he couldn't stop him marching forward and landing plenty of his own. A routine, if hard fought win then for Buatsi, but without the fireworks I expected. Not sure where Richards goes from here though.

Next up is Bivol and I don't think he'll be overly worried by what he sees. He has the option of the contracted re-match with Alvarez, but despite Canelo and his camp's claims, I don't see that fight happening. Bivol comprehensively beats Buatsi for my money, at which point the Russians have nobody left bar eachother. Some match up that'd be! The outstanding boxer versus the outstanding puncher. Fair to say that for a dvision that lacks a little strength in depth, it is still throwing up some very decent fights with the promise of more to come.

On holiday so I missed it!

Most reliable reports saw it pretty much the same as you. Right down to saying he needs a fight between Richards and Bivol

But that's the problem with that weight. There's good fighters but not enough of them. What can prepare him for world title shots? 

 

[Comrade 86]

Canelo vs Triple G confirmed. Canelo still saying he wants Bivol rematch. In a pig's eye.

*sigh*

[tomsdubs]

If GGG doesn't sort that body conditioning out it will be a short night, he was almost buckled in half by Murata and Canelo is a devastating body puncher. Fair play though to still be chasing the dream at 40 years old, personally I hope he gets revenge for the 1st fight when they robbed him.